Replies

1. 
   sbonder | Oct 09, 2002 08:31pm | #1

   Yes, the japanese chisels are generally harder.  But, as a result, they chip if used incorrectly.  You can't use them to pry chips like I do with slightly less hard chisels.  I didn't notice any significant difference in sharpening time.  I have a few japanese chisels I like, but for the most part find that my Sorby chisels are easier to handle and less prone to chip.

1. 
   Benjamin2016 | Oct 09, 2002 08:36pm | #2

   Damn right ... you can find a great set that includes a terrific mallet that are made up in New Britain Ct.

   Call them and ask to see a brochure (or a retailer where you can buy them)on their 150th Anniversary commemorative set. I got mine from the old "Tool Traditions" catalog that was published by the folks at Jensen Tools. That catalog folded because not enough woodworkers bought American-made tools.

   It includes three chisels and the mallet. The blades are made of high grade cutlery steel with brass strike caps and hickory handles. The ferrules are also brass and carry the famous Stanley "Sweetheart" logo from 1920.

   You're gonna pay about $160 for the set. Worth every penny. Make sure you specify this particular set. It is one of the few they make here in the USA.

   By the way, they are so beautiful, you'll not want to use them the first time. Don't worry. I had mine for 6-months before they touched wood and I've used them a lot now and they're still beautiful.

   Do not loan them to anyone, whatever you do.

   Ben

1. 
   KenMattie | Oct 10, 2002 02:53am | #5

   Ben,

   Which chisels are you referencing?  Could you post the telephone number or their website if they have one.

1. 
   MSDMSD | Oct 10, 2002 03:56am | #6

   I agree with Scott and think Japanese tools are in the top of their class.  I own some of thier chisels and saws and they stay the sharpest and have the marrowest kerf.

   There is an article in FWW which put chisels to the test. To get right to the point the Japanese Blue Steel Chisel took first place and the Japanese White Steel Chisel took second.  If I come across the article I'll let you know.

   Check out http://www.Japanwoodworker.com

2. 
   b1gcountry | Oct 09, 2002 08:52pm | #3

   You shouldn't take a Japanese Chisel to the grinder, but otherwise are pretty similar. Try buying one and seeing if you like it. Highland Harware sells individual chisels, and so does woodcraft (?)

   Tom

3. 
   theRev | Oct 10, 2002 01:42am | #4

   Tom

   Japanese chisels are all I use and I would never go back, even if given an anniversary package of sorby chisels! <g> I find that the Japanese cutting tools (chisels, planes, knives) just seem to have and keep great edges (purely subjective on my part, perhaps due to the fact I live in Japan).

   As for sharpening, I use stones. But I can't see why you couldn't use a sandpaper sharpening system.

   I think they're great tools. As was mentioned above, get one and try it. If you need more info, let me know.

   Scott

4. 
   MarkRoderick | Oct 10, 2002 02:40pm | #7

   For what it's worth, I once heard that traditional Japanese woodworking was done mostly in softwoods. That's why Japanese chisels can use hard but brittle metal. This may not translate well to the red oak and other wood traditionally used in American woodworking.

   Also, the point was made about Japanese chisels not fitting into most honing guides. For me, that would be a real pain.

1. 
   theRev | Oct 14, 2002 02:20pm | #8

   Yeah, I keep hearing that about "harder" wood. Maybe it's the way the chisel is being used by persons complaining aobut that. I use a bit of red oak, Japanese oak (nara), and keyaki in my work and never had any problem with edge breaking on my chisels. A well tuned chisel will pare end grain off hard wood without any problem.

   As for not buying Japanese chisels because they won't fit in honing guides, well, perhaps that reason speaks for itself.

   Scott

1. 
   NormInFujino | Oct 15, 2002 01:39am | #11

   I use Japanese chisels exclusively and love them, but since beginning a bit of wood carving the past year, I've grown confused about Japanese carving tools. I have a variety of knives, some good, some not so, and it may just be my hit-and-miss technique (no training in this at all!), but I do think they are made of milder steel than the European counterparts, and I've experienced bending on some of the spade knives (thin tang). I also have assumed that the difference in steels was a result of design; most Japanese hobby-type carving is done in hinoki and other soft woods. Noh masks are mostly hinoki, SFAIK. In contrast, I recently bought a set of Swiss Pfeil palm knives and love them; much heftier shafts; stay sharp longer. I will continue to use the Japanese knives for some purposes and hope to learn more about the technique side of their use, but I'm sold on Pfeil right now.

   ". . .and only the stump or fishy part of him remained."

   Green Gables: A Contemplative Companion to Fujino Township

   Edited 10/14/2002 6:41:08 PM ET by Norm in Fujino

1. 
   theRev | Oct 15, 2002 08:55am | #12

   Norm,

   Sorry, I don't much about the carving tools. I have a noh mask maker up the street from me. If I get a chance, I can ask him. Earlier this year I got a huge tree from our local shrine. It is called mochi (mochi no ki). I've been told that it is used alot in carving. I've already slabbed up a bit of it (with my new chainsaw slabbing set up, wu-huuu), but I've got quite a few odd pieces of it still around which might make for some interesting carving. Give me a shout if you ever want to come donw here and get them.

   Scott (in Shiga)

1. 
   DustyTom | Oct 15, 2002 07:47pm | #13

   Great discussion, Thanks for all the input.

   In my paying job I am faced with trade-offs based on design, serviceability and operation. It looks like the "trade-off" concept is alive and well in woodworking also. I think I'll have to try each type and explore them both a bit closer.

2. 
   jeffn7 | Oct 14, 2002 06:57pm | #9

   I have both, Japanese and Euro/American, and find there is a place and use for each kind.

   I like the feel and "look" of Japanese chisels... something about the way it looks against a piece of wood that is visually appealing. The high end Japanese chisels (available at http://www.japanwoodworker.com, among other places) are almost works of art, in addition to tools that can earn their keep. The craftmanship and tradition behind them is staggering.

   However, I find that they do tend to chip or 'fold over' in hardwoods, and because the taper is so delicate they don't have the toughness of a Marples. For mortises in hardwood, or dovetails, I just find them to be not as effective.

   The classic European and American chisels are heavier and seem to hold up better in the kind of woods that I use most of the time. But sometimes a heavy chisel just gets in the way... like I said, there is a place and time for each type.

   Buy one of two and try them out, for a really well crafted japanese chisel you should expect to pay anywhere from $35 to $60, while the super luxury kind (made from old ship anchors, etc.) can cost up to several hundred dollars for a single chisel.

1. 
   MarkRoderick | Oct 14, 2002 07:13pm | #10

   Thanks for the reply and the good suggestion. I've always wanted to try a good Japanese chisel if only to see what the fuss is about, and now I'll go ahead and do it. Now if I could learn to sharpen a chisel without a honing guide. . . .