As usual, my search for a new tool has spiralled outward. What at first seemed like a choice between Powermatic and Delta deluxe 14″ bandsaws has turned into a choice of 14″ or 16″ bandsaws.
My dilemma: I want to have the better frames and advanced features of the larger bandsaws, but I still want to be able to run 1/8″ blades for curves. Of course, I also want to do straight ripping and resawing.
A 16″ saw fits right in that middle zone, both in size and features, and price.
The one I am interested in is the Jet 16″. It has good resaw capacity and nice features. It gets pretty good reviews.
One interesting point: the Delta is about $1,000 after a fence; the Powermatic is about $900, since it comes with a fence; the Jet 16″ is about $900 after a fence. So the price for deluxe 14″ is about the same as this 16″ saw.
Any opinions or suggestions?
Thanks all!
Edited 7/12/2005 12:48 pm ET by Matthew Schenker
Replies
See the "is something up with powermatic" topic running.
I ahve seen a lot of bad press lately here on delta. I have also seen a lot of good reviews on Grizzly. I think they have a 17" that might fit your bill - won't hurt to check their web site and maybe do some searches here and in Tool Talk on the ones you are looking at or on bandsaw choices
Rick,
Thanks for the suggestion. The 17" Grizzly does look nice. But I have two concerns here. First is that I'm not sure a 17" saw would be able to handle the narrow blades well enough. And second, I have had bad experiences with Grizzly and would prefer not to go to them again unless I really have to.
Try and contact Forest Girl - she lives in their area and has recently bought one of their band saws and may be able to give you some consumer info on them
Not sure on the blade acceptance, Grizzly tech support should be able tell you what sizes it will accept.1 - measure the board twice, 2 - cut it once, 3 - measure the space where it is supposed to go 4 - get a new board and go back to step 1
Rick,
I've already checked on this with some technical support people. They tell you that the saw will accept 1/8" blades, and if you look at the literature, it says the same thing. But then you hear from owners who say it does not handle the 1/8" blades very well. So, they can do it, but not adequately. One of those gray areas.
I have the Grizzly 17" hd and am very pleased with it. I threw the stock blade away and bought some timber wolf blades from suffolk machinery (on the reccomendations from the folks here). Can't say enough about the combo. The smallest blade I have used is the 1/4" and of course the resaw blade. I do have a 1/8" blade. I will put it on and run some stuff through it, and let you know. The only thing I could see being a pain is aligning the bearings, but I'll let you know what I think. Here is a link from when I posted my original post of the purchase. If you are using dial-up they may be large sorry. This was before I learned to cut the size down.
http://forums.taunton.com/tp-knots/messages/?msg=17846.1
bones,
Nice coverage of the Grizzly 17"!I would be very interested to hear what you say about running 1/8" blades on it. Cut some curves and tell me what you discover. Take pictures if you can!!I'll be at the AWFS show in Las Vegas in a couple of weeks, and I might talk to the Grizzly rep about all this. Also, hoping for a deal!
Sorry for this taking a while, but been working on the house getting it ready to sell. Well the talk that it is difficult to track an 1/8th inch blade on a big bandsaw turned out to be somewhat true. When I say somewhat, I mean if I had done it before, It would have been simpler. All my blades are timber wolfe blades. When I bought the Grizzly G0513 17" BS, I got a deal on several blades, and the 1/8th happened to be one. I had not used it to this point. I removed the resaw blade and put the 1/8th on. It traced immediately. I will say, that properly placing the guides slightly behind the gullet was difficult because I could hardly see the darned thing. It took about fifteen minutes to get the blade on. I noticed immediately a problem. When the blade was under a power, it traced differently than when I manually turned the wheel. I would tension the blade to where I thought it should be and do the flutter method to get it right. Due to the crown of the tires, it took a little time to get it to track in the center, and it was fussy. One wrong quarter turn of the wheel and the blade would dramatically track to the front or back. It was very frustrating. I had none of these problems with the 1/2 or larger blades. I had them on and ready to cut in about 15-20 minutes. When I finally got it to track properly and with stability (would not move on power up or down), I had another problem pop up. The lower blade guide that is located directly behind the blade would not extend far enough out to get the required distance from the rear of the blade. It was late, and I decided it was best to get a good nights sleep and start again in the morning.
I got up this morning and decided to call Grizzly support and see what they suggested. I spoke with a gentleman and explained my issue and told him that tracking was not a problem, but that I needed it to track a little closer to the rear of the tires. He said that getting a 1/8th blade to track will be a challenge and require a little more work but it will do it. He indicated that due to the crown of the tire, the small blade does have a tendency to react to the slightest movement of the adjusting wheel for tracking control. He suggested that I take a file while the lower wheel is running and slightly (he emphasized slightly) take off some of the crown. I did as he suggested and it did help track the blade more towards the rear of the tire, but still not what I felt was right. I got to wondering if tension changes would impact the placement of the blade on the tire. The directions for tensioning the timber wolfe blade calls for tracking the blade (with no guides) and tensioning the blade until the flutter disappears and the blade steadies. I had been doing that except I was starting at a higher tension and backing it off till it started fluttering. By trial and error, I discovered that by steadily increasing tension the blade would flutter and straighten and then flutter again all along the different tension levels.
I backed the tension level way down to the bottom and slowly increased the tension and the blade changed the place where it tracked, to the rear of the tire, and the problem was solved. I placed the guides into proper position, and it cut like a dream. It was frustrating , but I learned a tremendous amount about my band saw. This probably would not have been such an experience for some one with a lot of experience with large band saws. I cut some 1" oak, 2 1/4" Mahogany, and 4 1/2" Mahogany. I did a free hand cut, a couple of curves in the Mahogany, and I cut some small pieces from plywood for Christmas angels, that I normally cut with a scroll saw. All were easy and on the larger pieces the cuts remained at 90 degrees to the table. I included some pics including the final position that the small blade tracked. If you have any other questions let me know.
Edited 7/16/2005 5:25 pm ET by bones
Bones,
I appreciate your time and effort in this! I don't think anyone has ever answered a question so thoroughly!Your text and photos are quite helpful. They do make me feel a little more confident that I can run 1/8" blades in a larger bandsaw, although with some trial and error. I will say that with the Jet 14" saw I was used to, installing and tracking a 1/8" blade was quick and easy, about three or four minutes all told.I wonder, though, how your findings translate into how a Jet 16" would handle 1/8" blades? After all, we are comparing a 17" to a 16" and Grizzly to Jet. Some things will not be compatible. The question is, where are the differences? But your response does give me reason to hope that a 16" bandsaw will be able to handle 1/8" blades for curve cutting.Thank you again for your tremendous help.
Edited 7/17/2005 6:33 am ET by Matthew Schenker
No problem on the response. I think it's all about experience. I know I can swap my blades out in about 15-20 minutes and now I know the quirks of the 1/8th blade. I think you will find the same for the Jet if you get that one. It makes a lot of since that the natural crown of the tire could impact a small width of steel more that a wider one. The impact of the tension was a key learning I got from today. So I say thanks to you for asking the question. Good luck on the decision.
thanks for all the info,i will puchase the 17 grizzly bandsaw. My small delta portable finally burned a rolle rubber off after 10 yrs with thousands and thousandsof hardwoods put through it. It has been a workhorse . It cost 450 back then but the same machine is only 199 now so instead of repairing im buying another and holding the old one in reserve for parts. i belive many of the parts to be interchangable/ the best part of this is the portability and storing under a small workbench. Thanks bones
Jet bandsaws are crap! get a mini-max or laguna---you'll appreciate it in the long run...
Peter
jpswoodworking.com
MiniMax and Laguna are nice, but the prices are at a premium compared to Grizzly or Jet.Scott
Scott
5 years ago, I was going to buy a Laguna 16", and my buddy at the lumber yard talked me into buying a Jet 18" from him instead. After years of unsatisfactory results, and $ spent on upgrades, I got rid of the thing and bought the saw that I should have purchased in the 1st place.
I cannot remember a time when I have said, "Gee, I really wish I would have gotten a cheaper tool--this one just works too well."
I have found that now that I have a bandsaw that does what it is supposed to do, that I am using it more than the table saw in the shop...
Just my 2 cents, as I wish someone would have swayed me towards the better tool in the first place.Peter
jpswoodworking.com
I noticed you were recomending Laguna brand. Do you have one and if so what was your buying experience with them? I am considiring buying one but have read some awfull reviews on buying one and then later with their customer service. Would appreciate any input to this you may have. Thanks!
I do have a Laguna LT16--
I ordered it from a WW show in the mpls area. The guy at the show was very nice, and the tool shipped when they said it would. I am very happy w/ the performance of the saw.
The cust. service of Laguna is fair at best. I was under the idea that my saw was to have a 3hp baldor motor on it, when it actually has a 2hp baldor. When I called the company, nobody could explain this to me. After a week or so, I finally was told that originally, the saws were outfitted w/ 3hp tiawanese motors, but since switching to US made Baldors, the hp ratings were different. They say that a 2hp baldor is the same as a 3hp tiawanese.
I have resawed 11" thick maple on my saw with no problems. And since buying the saw, find myself using it in place of my table saw more and more.
All this being said, I would definately check into the minimax before buying Laguna again. I have heard that they are a pleasure to deal with, whereas Laguna was kind of a pain.
I hope this helps...Peter
jpswoodworking.com
whereas Laguna was kind of a pain..
Yep I called them to find out about the saw... Well, to say the least I kept bein' SOLD! Not answers to my questions.. Dang Sales folks!
AND I was in Marketing for a few years...I got me my 18" RIKON.. I bet they never knew why they lost the sale!
I've posted a link to the only review I know of on the Jet 16" bandsaw. I didn't ask the site owner for permission but it is available at other forums. http://www.just4fun.org/woodworking/tool_reviews/jet_bandsaw/
I have a Jet 16" saw that I bought at Rockler when they had 'em on sale for $620. It was a lot of machine for the price. My main criticism is in the access to the lower guides when changing a blade. Fortunately, I use a 3-T 1/2" blade for almost everything. I don't use a fence to resaw, if I ever find the need I'll build my own. It's a good machine but there are others out there in the current price range that are on par or better. If I was to do it again I'd go with a 17-18" tool. I've never said, nor heard, 'that is way too much machine for what I want to do."
Tom
TomS,
I checked out the link. Thanks for the tip.It seems that most people who own the Jet 16" are happy with it. Of course, I would rather get a MiniMax, but I can't justify the additional $1K in cash.On the suggestion about 18" bandsaws, my concern is being able to run narrow blades. It seems that when you get into the 18" or higher range, they are more dedicated to straight ripping and resawing. These things are important to me, but I also need the bandsaw to cut lots of curves.Someone tell me if I'm way off on this. Perhaps an 18" would work fine for curves?
I got a 18" RICON for about $900.00 plus shipping..
I like it ALOT!.. But it broke! I turned the saw ON!.. And I had a LENOX 1 inch wide three tooth per inch blade in it..
Well.. I forgot to put the blade tension on!
DUMB ME!.. That blade lost one tooth! And my saw lost a hunk out of the saw guard AND broke the casting for the lower roller bearings!
DAMN!
Will,
I started up my Jet 14" a couple of times with a loose blade, but nothing happened. Why did the Rikon experience such a melt-down?What can you do about this?
Why did the Rikon experience such a melt-down?..
I had a 1 inch wide blade in there.. Lots of surface for the wheels to grab...
By the way.. I found one of the double ball bearings (blade guides) on the floor with some casting still hanging on there.. DANG!
I fixed the casting with JB? epoxy and a hunk of 1/8 thick flat plate.. Seems to be working..
REMEMBER TO TIGHTEN YOUR BLADE!
Damn... That was scarier than that first ALIEN movie I saw LONG ago!!
EDIT:: Really.. If the blade broke I could have gotten seriously hurt.. If I had a MinMax maybe better.. Do they have a safety switch for that?? I wonder?
Edited 7/15/2005 10:09 am ET by Will George
Edited 7/15/2005 10:10 am ET by Will George
Matthew,
We have one lab at school in which there are half-a-dozen bandsaws - all 16" or better, except one lone 14" Rockwell. All of the rest are Lagunas, except for a 16" Jet.
I haven't seen anyone use the Rockwell more than a few times in the past few years. Most folks go immediately to the Lagunas. The Jet is favored by shorter people, usually females, because the table height is significantly lower than the Lagunas. If you intend to equip your bandsaw with a mobile base or are concerned about table height, this could be a consideration.
I like the rack & pinion mechanism on the Jet blade guard because it can be raised or lowered far more safely and conveniently than the the Lagunas - which we instruct students to adjust only after the blade has come to a complete stop.
-Jazzdogg-
"Don't ask youself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie
jazzdog,
Do you run 1/8" blades on the Jet 16" for curve cutting? This is my biggest remaining question about the saw.
Matthew,
Since the Lagunas are predominant, we buy a lot of different blades for them, and leave the other saws, like the Jet, set up with the same blade all of the time. Even on the Lagunas, however, I don't recall the last time we used anything smaller an a quarter-inch blade, even for making tight radius cuts for bandsaw boxes.-Jazzdogg-
"Don't ask youself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie
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