Replies

1. 
   Dustmight | Apr 05, 2004 01:20pm | #1

   This is a case where bigger is usually better....assuming all is flat, square, and coplaner.  Length of beds is of some consideration too.  Going larger than an 8" poses financial and handling considerations.  Lots of us use a 6", but would rather have an 8".  If I had the room and money, a 12" would be better, but I don't.  To face joint a board larger than 6", I rip it first, joint it, then glue it together.

2. 
   woodguy | Apr 05, 2004 07:59pm | #2

   Hello Stakehorse, I also had the same problem, an old Sears Craftsman 6" joiner, It was never flat and never held ajustment. I finally broke down a bought a Yorktown 8" from Wilke Machine. Affordable and reliable,nice long bed. Wish I didn't wait so long.Wotks great. Woodguy

3. 
   tsproul | Apr 05, 2004 09:01pm | #3

   get out of the habit.

   tailed devils are not the only way to work wood.

   if you have a wider board that is excellent, I implore you NOT to rip it and then reglue. You can never get that wide board back again....there is always (unless, you happen upon a piece of near perfectly straight grained, QS wood) the tell-tale mismatch in grain.

   Use hand planes. At the least, make a sled for your thickness planer and shim undereath the high spots of the board....

   Tim

   on the neverending quest for wood.

1. 
   KySawdust | Apr 06, 2004 03:38am | #4

   I really don't want to rip the boards that I'm using for a current project.  It's an oval jewelry box from Woodsmith Issue 150.  I am using 2 1/2" thick x 8" wide boards which end up with 2 routed out recesses about 2" deep.  This would really show a joint in the oval body of the box.  I've made about 15 of these between Xmas and friends of the better half. 

   I have never seen or been around anyone hand-planing wood.  I've seen a jointer plane used and could probably handle that, but what plane(s) do I need to flatten stock across the width? 

   This is why I'm going to the Marc Adams course.  I hope to learn some basic hand skills. 

   If I want to experiment with a plane or two, what should I buy?  I've seen these Lie-Nielson planes - they're really nice looking.  Would I be better off starting with an expensive standard plane? 

   I have money to spend, but not to waste.  I want to be sure that I spend my "allowance" on the right tools.  Here's my shop inventory:

   Delta Unisaw w/52" Biesmeyer Fence

   Delta 14" Bandsaw (Open Base)

   Delta 16 1/2" Drill Press

   Craftsman 6" Jointer

   Ryobi 10 1/2" Portable Planer

   Craftsman 9" Disk / 6" Belt Sander

   Jet Mini Lathe

   Tormek Sharpener with all of the jigs

   Craftsman 36" Lathe

   Craftsman 10" Electronic Radial Arm Saw

   Makita 10" Compound Sliding Miter Saw

   Shop Vac - plan to purchase Jet Canister 2-Micron DC this month

   I am trying to decide if my next purchase should be a 15" Planer, 8" Jointer, or Delta or Performax Sander?  All of the Craftsman stuff was purchased about 20 years ago by my father and I.  Trying to upgrade as needed. 

   Any advice appreciated.  Sorry for the lengthly post - you can see that I have many questions and feel a little bit lost. 

   StakeHorse

1. 
   scooter1 | Apr 06, 2004 04:15am | #5

   I rarely have the need for a joiner any wider than 6", but I don't face joint boards. I buy lumber which is already surfaced and one side edge joined. Unless I am doing some critical edge glue ups, I don't use my Delta joiner at all.

   I do own a nice joiner plane a Stanley 08 and a Porter Cable power joiner planer, both of which get more frequent use than a my joiner.

   Regards,

   Boris

   "Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934

2. 
   billballeza | Apr 06, 2004 05:24am | #6

   You have some very nice tools.. most notably your TS and CSMS. If you can afford an 8" jointer you might look at the Powermatic and the Grizzly.

    If it were me I would tune the Craftsman. Taunton Press sells a great video on doing just that. I bought it and went to work on my Delta 6" jointer which, even new, needed a good bit of tweaking. I buy 6" rough lumber and mill it myself. (I have a 13" Delta planer).

   If you have boards wider than 6" right now edge joint them on your newly tuned jointer.. hand plane one side reasonably flat (I have a LN #5 for this job) and then run the board through your planer, flat side down, then flip it over. I actually think it's easier to remove distortions with my jack plane than with a jointer.

   Given your tools, I agree that your weakest link is the jointer.  And since it's 20 years old and you have the money in your budget.. take a look at the Grizzly Model G1018 8" X 65" super heavy duty jointer. It's only $695 and Grizzly offers great tools and support.

   Good luck!

   Bill

1. 
   CharlieP | Apr 06, 2004 05:49am | #7

   I second the vote for the 8" Grizzly.  I have been very pleased with their tools, and covet that unit. 

   Rough lumber is the way to go - not only is it much cheaper, but you get a fresh face to work with, not one that has been dinged and abused, and perhaps even warped, twisted, etc. since it was initially surfaced.

   My 6 inch jointer does a good job of flattening/squaring rough lumber, just like it is supposed to.  But I am amazed at how much rough lumber is slightly wider than the cutters.  The 10 and 12 inch boards are very rare, but the 6 1/4 inch boards are amazingly common.  (note that the minimum width of good grade hardwood (FAS) is 6 inches green, so if you buy good wood, 6 inches is barely over the minimum)

   You mentioned the Performax.  I love mine, and use it far more than I expected to.  But you MUST have dust collection (or the paper will burn), and a heavy cut is 1/64 or 1/128, FAR less than a planer.  I still use my Delta planer, but perhaps one fewer passes, so I can finish with a few passes on the Performax.  And with the Performax, I am a little less compulsive about keeping the planer perfectly tuned.

   ________________________Charlie Plesums  Austin, Texashttp://www.plesums.com/wood

3. 
   tsproul | Apr 06, 2004 09:18am | #8

   Stakehorse,

   you said:

   "I have never seen or been around anyone hand-planing wood.  I've seen a jointer plane used and could probably handle that, but what plane(s) do I need to flatten stock across the width? 

   This is why I'm going to the Marc Adams course.  I hope to learn some basic hand skills. 

   If I want to experiment with a plane or two, what should I buy?  I've seen these Lie-Nielson planes - they're really nice looking.  Would I be better off starting with an expensive standard plane? 

   I have money to spend, but not to waste.  I want to be sure that I spend my "allowance" on the right tools."

   hand planing itself isn't all that hard...it is actually quite easy, especially if you work as a hybrid of a galoot and Normer...the hard part is tuning the plane properly and sharpening the blade.  Sharpening is probably the most important part....I'm sure Marc will point you in good directions for sharpening.

   You won't waste money with a Lie Nielsen plane.  Judging by your tailed devils list, you know that a good quality tool is well worth the price.  I'd also suggest you consider the Veritas line of planes (Lee Valley).  They aren't quite as pretty or finely finished as the Lie Nielsens but performance is right up there with the LN's.  Prices are a bit less than Lie Nielsen.  I don't own any Lie Nielsen....I have a few Veritas planes (which I like quite a bit) and several old Stanleys.  For a first, get a new plane...Veritas or Lie Nielsen.  You may also want to investigate wooden planes...Knight Toolworks is a very good maker.  But get a Veritas or Lie Nielsen first.  For a first hand plane, get a #4 1/2 bench plane...about the most versatile bench plane, IMO.

   there is much more about hand planing but I'm run out of time this evening.

   btw, hand planing is a very slippery slope...  : )

   Tim