Replies

1. 
   SCFrankland | Apr 23, 2004 08:17pm | #1

   I have both an old Stanley #7 and #8 and with new A2 irons installed and both do a excellent job of squaring up edges. I built the #7 out of parts and I think it may of cost me about $50.00 US the #8 I bought all ready restored and it cost me $120.00 US. The irons where around $50.00 bucks each CDN. I have had the opportunity to use a LN #8 and it was definitely a step above my Stanley but I don't think it is 300 plus steps ahead. Not saying I won't buy one if I had the money floating around though. I also have a good 8" Delta jointer that does a near perfect job of doing what needs to be done. To answer your question I would pick up a good Stanley #8 and buy a new iron if needs be. It is a great tool to use to flatten large surfaces such as table tops and the like.

   Scott C. Frankland

   Scott's WOODWORKING Website

   "He who has the most tools may not win the race of life but he will sure make his wife look like a good catch when she goes to move on."

2. 
   RMillard | Apr 23, 2004 08:50pm | #2

   I use one of those ancient tools to do all my jointing. I have a 70's era Stanley No. 7, and Clark and Williams 30" wooden Jointer. While I like the long wood plane, I don't see any advantage in it over the 22" No. 7, and the 7's can be readily found at good prices. Buying used planes is sort of a roll of the dice, but certainly worth the try. You will quickly find the plane an indispensable tool, in fact I couldn't make anything without my planes.

   Rob Millard

3. 
   BG | Apr 23, 2004 09:12pm | #3

   Boris,

   I would agree with Scott and Rob, I bought mine from a reputable dealer...that helped reduce the risk.  Also, if you plan to continue to use the Delta jointer...you could reduce or eliminate the 'sprung' aspect of your jointing with something less than a jointer too ....even a block plane.  I tend to list to the left when planing and put a 1 or 2 degree slope on the jointed end... 
1. 
   jackplane | Apr 23, 2004 09:24pm | #4

   Another option is to build extension tables for your jointer.But a good plane is oh so nice.

1. 
   scooter1 | Apr 23, 2004 09:29pm | #5

   I have seen these NO. 8's as high as $250 from some reputable dealers, and as low as $20 out of ebay. Jeez for $250, I think I'd spring for Lie Nielson. If I get a piece of junk from Ebay, how difficult is it to restore them. I saw some vendors on the net that have replacement parts.

   Regards,

   Boris

   "Sir, I may be drunk, but you're crazy, and I'll be sober tomorrow" -- WC Fields, "Its a Gift" 1934

1. 
   Mackwood | Apr 27, 2004 06:50am | #15

   Boris,

   There's only about a dozen parts to a plane and most of them don't move.  Restoring them is a bit labor intensive but it's certainly not brain surgery!!  Just dive in, get a couple and have at 'em.  There's certainly enough info on this site alone to restore any type of plane.  Just make sure you don't have some super rare collectible before you go on the attack.  What's the worst that can happen; you screw up a $25, E-bay plane!?!

   If you can build stuff out of wood you can restore a plane!!!  It might not be worthy of a museum show case but you can sure as heck make it useable again!!

   Regards,

   Mack"WISH IN ONE HAND, #### IN THE OTHER AND SEE WHICH FILLS UP FIRST"

4. 
   ETG | Apr 23, 2004 09:30pm | #6

   Boris - Several things to consider:

   1) I have the older Rockwell 6" jointer - the one made in Canada - and I haven't had any problems with long boards.  I have 2 roller stands that I set up and level (using a 4" mason's level as a straight edge) equal to the jointer bed.  A cheaper solution than the long bed jointers than usually run in the thousands.

   2) If you are doing a glue up with multiple boards, lay out all the boards in the order they will be glued and then take two at a time and plane them together.  Board 1 and 2 edges are planed where they join together, then the edges of boards 2 and 3 where they join together, etc.  Within reason, the board edges don't have to be perfectly straight - planing two at a time will ensure one board edge contour will match the other one.  And I do agree with you  - a little spring in the middle is fine and desirable for gluing.

   3) I also own an older, English made Stanley #7 and there are times when I do use it.  It takes some practice and a hundred years ago, our forefathers used them with great success.  If you have a need for several "old" tools, there is a wonderful shop in Liberty Maine that is chock full of everything from old planes to Yankee spiral ratchet screwdrivers to power tools.  Plan a vacation around a visit there - it is well worth the trip.  Liberty Tool's owner is a bit eccentric but the place is definitely worth seeing - he also has 2 nearby shops that are more upscale (higher prices, more geared to Maine Rt. 1 Tourists).  The web site - http://www.jonesport-wood.com/jwLibToolPhotos.html.

   Good Luck!

   Ed Gregg

5. 
   jvs | Apr 23, 2004 10:07pm | #7

   Boris, something to have in mind here is that it is a skill; getting a square, straight edge with a plane takes some technique and practice, as well as a reasonably well-tuned tool (sounds like you saw that one coming). The best short tutorial I have seen on the web is at Jeff Gorman's site at http://www.amgron.clara.net/planingpoints/planeindex.htm. There is also a lot of good information on the site on planing in general, tuning, honing, etc. There was also a recent article in Popular Woodworking on jointing by hand--more text than Jeff's site, but the same basic technique/theme.

   Even if you go the machine route for much of the edge jointing you do, one of the best things about learning to planes well is that you can then reliably do face jointing of stock that is longer/wider than your jointer will accommodate. There is an excellent piece on that at http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Plains/9147/facejoint.html. This carries over to tabletop flattening, too, where you would otherwise be looking at drum sanding.

   LN's will work out of the box--something that you can't say about just about any other metal plane sold today, and are wonderful tools. If the price isn't an obstacle, go for it. My other long iron plane is a Clifton #6; if I had it to do again, I would go with the LN and save the several hours of my life that will never be seen again to get it working well. One of my favorite tools now, but no one should have to go through that at the multiple-hundred dollar price point. That said, my WW2-era #8 took less work than my contemporary Record #7 to fettle, and is a far nicer tool all around. Wooden planes are whole other subject in themselves and are great tools, but there is an additional learning curve there--iron tools will have you being productive quicker

   Ebay is like a box of chocolates (or is that condoms?); unless you feel lucky, have a gift for online auctions, or are willing to live with the consequences, you are safer going with a known dealer. Sandy Moss (www.sydnassloot.com) is one I have used several times, and is a great person to deal with who really knows tools. If he doesn't have what you are looking for, you can also try the Old Tools list (http://denali.frontier.iarc.uaf.edu:8080/~cswingle/archive/) for first-of-the-month FS postings.

   No affiliation with any of the above, etc....

   Good luck!

   /jvs

1. 
   jackplane | Apr 23, 2004 10:38pm | #8

   Unless you can see the plane real well from a photo, I wouldn't buy it that way.Some may have worn throats which will make flattening the sole a real bear, near impossible. A light flattening of the sole, cap iron, and blade is easy.

6. 
   Midnight | Apr 24, 2004 12:10am | #9

   Boris... some time ago I gave up using my 6" benchtop jointer in preference of long bed hand planes. Thesedays I do all my jointing with a square, 72" builders level and L-N#7. Compared side by side, the stock milled on the benchtop isn't in the same ballpark with either finish or accuracy. Granted, working by hand may take a little longer, but I'll take the sound of the #7 over the scream of the jointer / shop vac every time.

   Mike Wallace

   Stay safe....Have fun

7. 
   Jellyrug | Apr 24, 2004 12:43am | #10

   Your challenge is about to become mine in a few weeks, as I am looking at a 5' 6" round table top.

   I don't own a jointer yet and will probably invest in a 15" planer before I get to the jointer.

   So far all my glue up panels, have been perfect right off the table saw, but I have not gone beyond around 40" long. I don't even use a top grade ripping blade and get very good results from an Oldham 40t 10" Signature combination blade. This is why the jointer is at the bottom of my list of machines to buy.

   My role model, who taught me most of what I know a long time ago, use to join all his boards perfectly, by first finish planing to the exact same thickness and then using a profiled joint shaper cutter on his shaping machine. The profile, took care of alignment, as well as rendering a larger glue surface.

   I'll be doing some testing with a joint bit, on a router, using a long straight edge as a guide. Any experience with this method in the forum?

   Willie

8. 
   Wateren | Apr 25, 2004 08:21am | #11

   Boris, answering your original question, Record does make a jointer plane, I bet Stanley still does, maybe Anant also I'm not sure. I bought the Record jointer in a (non-chain) tool store. The cost a few years ago was about $125.

   The Record is not as nice as a L-N or Veritas plane but does a serviceable job. As to where you could get it...

   Lee Valley carries some Record planes, don't know about the jointer plane.

   Mail-order houses might have current Record or Stanley (Garrett Wade, Highland Hardware, Woodcraft, etc.), or your local hardware or lumber store would be able to order any current Stanley plane I'm sure.

   Best of luck

   Chris

1. 
   PhillipB | Apr 27, 2004 07:19am | #16

   Lee Valley does indeed carry Record Jointer planes for $129. Just sent off an order to them and happened to have their latest catalog in front of me.

   I use the Delta DJ-20 and feel privileged to have it. I recently had to completely disassemble it to get it into my basement ( just moved to IL) and got to know it very intimately. No fun at all!

   I have had absolutely no trouble jointing with it. However, I will say that it is IMPERATIVE that the cutterhead to outfeed table spec should be exactly as called for by Delta. If the outfeed table is not perfectly parallel to the cutterhead you cannot expect to be happy with any jointing you attempt to do with it. And believe me, I had mine in three big, heavy pieces and had to re-assemble it correctly if I was ever going to use it again. So I do know how important these spec's are.

   If Boris has a jointer that is out of spec this could be his problem and not the length of his infeed or outfeed tables.

   Regards,

   Phillip

9. 
   macalex | Apr 25, 2004 02:26pm | #12

   Boris

   Consider setting up a shooting board

   In the past, I've co-opted 2.4m (8 foot) MDF boards as temporary shooting boards. Once set up, you can quickly shoot the edges of boards up to 2m (6 feet) long using a long plane (any long plane, just as long as its real sharp).

   If you set the boards up and mark them in sequence and mark the top sides (use a trad joiner's triangle), and then shoot the edges top up, mating board top down, then the next pair top up, top down ... any slight out of squareness in your setup will be fully compensated.

   You should be able to go straight from the saw to the shooting board, and have a glueable joint in 4 - 5 strokes of the plane. Say 5 mins per joint, 30-40 mins max for an 8-10 board glue-up.

10. 
    desertrat | Apr 26, 2004 05:25pm | #13

    Take a look at athe ECE Wood Jointer Plane.  It sells for $182.50 at Garret Wade.  I have used mine for several years, in fact I used it to joint almost 300 bdf last year.  Works like a dream and you can almost use it for a finish plane.  Edges come out really smooth with a good sharpening.  Can't say too much about how useful it has been to me.

    http://www.garrettwade.com/jump.jsp?lGen=detail&itemID=104654&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=10000&iSubCat=10011&iProductID=104654

1. 
   brnaclbil | Apr 27, 2004 03:46am | #14

   About 6 months ago, I was in the market for a Bailey #7 and saw one on eBay from a seller an hour from here, in NH. I was able to see it before I bought it for $54.

   It is a type 5, which puts its mfg date between 1885 and 1887. I have used it on several glue ups and am very happy with the result. It has a very old (original ?) blade with about 3/8" of life left in it. After sharpening it (thru 8000 grit waterstone) it does all that I have expected of it, including "invisible" glue joints.

   Someday soon, I'll order a Hock iron for it, but I find it to be a very good solution. In addition to edging cherry for a 92" long desktop, I have flattened 8/4 maple for 24" long vise jaws and edged red oak for drawer front glueups.

   If you don't mind pushing a plane, I feel it is a very acceptable alternative. Since I do not own a powered jointer, I do all of my jointing with it.

   Regards,

   Bill