Replies

1. 
   Wil | Jan 10, 2003 10:04pm | #1

   Spinning spur center is a common problem; usualy solved by:

   1.  Drill hole for spur center.

   2.  Saw kerf across diagonal corners (use bandsaw, back saw, hacksaw, dovetail saw - your choice.

   3.  Pound spur into workpiece with a softhead hammer.

   4.  Increase tailstock pressure.

   5.  Switch to a screw center and forget 2,3,4, above.

   Good luck - and keep at it!

   Wil 

1. 
   Petey | Jan 10, 2003 10:41pm | #2

   Being somewhat of a novice at the lathe, I did not know of the screw center.. Thanks loads. Petey

1. 
   BG | Jan 11, 2003 12:14am | #3

   Petey,

   When that continued to happen to me(with my new lathe)..I bought a chuck...I was to embarassed to ask on here...good for you.

1. 
   Petey | Jan 11, 2003 02:22am | #5

   Isn't this a continuing learning process? There is a lot of truth in that old addage " you learn something new everyday " . That is what my uncle and mentor would say when I got into this biz 25 years ago. Also don't be afraid to ask questions, its alot easier than fixing mistakes. He was right

2. 
   Lilshaver | Jan 11, 2003 12:31am | #4

   Although a screw center may solve your immediate problem, it is not the best solution. Better to learn to use the spur center properly. Follow Wil's steps 1 to 4 and get a book that discusses the use. A screw center won't do you any good when you attempt to turn a small diameter piece.

   -Jeff

3. 
   ron61 | Jan 11, 2003 02:58am | #6

   check out the link might be some help i dont think it has much on spur center but lots of info. on learing to turn

   Ron

   http://www.a1studio.freeserve.co.uk/index.html

   
   

   ---

   Edited 1/10/2003 7:08:38 PM ET by ron61

1. 
   Petey | Jan 11, 2003 03:25am | #7

   thanks again for all the info

2. 
   BG | Jan 11, 2003 04:09am | #9

   Ron,

   That sight is fantastic.  I'm new to turning (hell, i'm new to everything except bills and taxes) and am in the process of building a new base for my lathe.  The on-line book is really great.  thanks 

4. 
   jako17 | Jan 11, 2003 03:42am | #8

   Hi Petey

           One thing that has not been mentioned is DO NOT pound the wood onto the spur in the lathe as it can pit the bearings .Take the spur out and drive it in. Also I put a small nick in one of the spurs so I can identify the orientation if I want to remove and reset the wood at alater date.

   Good luck     Jako

1. 
   JayS | Jan 11, 2003 05:02am | #10

   I have been turning for 15 years and had always drilled about a 3/16 inch deep hole to accommodate the point of the center, and to allow the spurs to engage the endgrain.  I would tap the drive center into the wood with a wooden mallet.  Then, I took a course at highland hardware in Atlanta, and joined the Georgia Woodturners Assoc and saw people just setting the stock in the lathe, and using the wheel on the tailstock to force the workpiece into the drive center.  I thought this couldn't be good for the bearings, but the pros told me they'd been doing it for years without adverse effects on their lathes.  It is easier than pounding.

1. 
   jako17 | Jan 11, 2003 05:57am | #11

   If the wood is rotating even slightly whilst tightning the tailstock,surely it is less likely to pit the bearings .Also the forces applied by a 60 degree cone  are probably less (as the point sinks in ) and more progressive than a hammer blow.

2. 
   Petey | Jan 11, 2003 06:16am | #12

   I was doing that but I thought I would be putting to much presure on the tailstock. Good to know that its ok. I will have to try the 3/16 hole also. thanks

5. 
   crt2cu2 | Jan 11, 2003 10:23pm | #13

   Petey,

   I use a chisel just a bit bigger than the spurs and tap confidently with a mallet to cut out a bit of wood for each spur to bite into.  Then a swift whack with the mallet drives the spur center into the wood, chuck into the headstock, snug up the tailstock and off we go.  Also, I often dab a bit of vaseline, oil, soap, or whatever lubricant may be nearby on the tailstock mounted cone center end of the piece.  This seems to help by reducing some friction which can be a partial reason for spur center tear out.  On my big lathe though I have a revolving (ball bearing) cone center which works real well.

   On some woods I try to set the spurs close to a growth ring on the end grain, theorizing that that part of the wood is a bit harder and will thus withstand the torque force of spinning.  It seems to generally work ok to have as many spurs as possible engaged in the wood fibers in parallel rather than cross grain fashion.

   sawick

1. 
   Petey | Jan 11, 2003 10:38pm | #14

   thanks again,I tried that, maybe it was just the wood I was using, osage orange. I dont think the spur comes off easily enough to drive it into the wood. what eventually worked was making a deeper saw cut and tapping the workpiece onto the spur, then snugging up the tailpiece. I use bearing grease on the tail spur. the only instruction to the lathe i have had was from my 16 year old who had a shop class at h.s.  I appreciate all the good advice from everyone who responded to my plea. thanks again  Petey

1. 
   ron61 | Jan 13, 2003 08:36am | #15

   I like Osage " hedge" It turns nice if its not to narly.Very tough and springy stuff I made a handle for my vise to day. I just take a punch and drive it in the ends first then the spur with a mallet make sure the little teeth have a bite- chuck it up set the tail stock-crank it up tight.Then while holding the stock back off the tail and the just bump it up to the wood so there is no slop.That way you don't have to much pressure on the head stock. 

   Made a few Bows from hedge as well 

    Ron

1. 
   Petey | Jan 13, 2003 06:43pm | #16

   Ron, after all the great advice I was able to finally finish what I started, a new mallet. A friend gave me a chunk awhile back and its only big enough for that kind of stuff. I have been replacing chisel and carving tool handles when I got the time. Great stuff. Funny you should mention that you are a "bowyer". I have a piece of yew that I want to make a bow out of. Are the bows you made self bows or laminated? I just recieved some info on the subject but I would like to pick your brain if possible. My e-mail address is [email protected]  Thanks  Petey

1. 
   ron61 | Jan 14, 2003 01:34am | #19

   I just made self bows hickory- hedge- white oak , gave most away kept a couple out of osage. they shoot pretty good 60lbs at 29in. draw. 6 ft. long-lots of work splitting an osage log. 

2. 
   Petey | Jan 14, 2003 04:10am | #21

   Ron, sounds like they are fairly eeasy to make. Ihave a piece of white oak about 50 years old. I dont think it was kiln dried. Do you think it would still be good to use, I would like to save the yew until I have a couple under my belt. Also would you be willing to let me copy your pattern ?  Thanks  Petey

3. 
   ron61 | Jan 15, 2003 06:22am | #27

   Pete

   Well theres a little more to it than a pattern.

    The White Oak that you have is it a Stave" split out of a log" or a Board?If it is a stave& If it has no insect damage or splits or checks" Depending on draw length" a clear section say 6 ft. long MAYBE. You can make them from boards but if the grain is running off the back you would need to back it. Its working with the grain- keeping the same growth ring on the back. First time bow I would get a good hickory stave maybe $50 -$60 -That's a good buy -I cut my own and split it out- it will dam near kill you splitting a 8-10 in. log.  Hickory makes a fine bow and it more forgiving I have a few made from Hickory. OSAGE MAKES THE BEST BOW but harder to work.First time use Hickory and you will have a nice bow.

   I haven't the link any more but I'm sure one of the links I have posted will have the Stickbow site. You will like it. I have bought wood from Murray just be sure and tell him you want the best straightest stave he has, he will help you and if not happy he will make it right.

   You will like the links

   Ron

   http://www.student.utwente.nl/~sagi/artikel/

   http://www.primitivearcher.com/index.shtml

   http://www.murraygaskins.com/abw.html

4. 
   Petey | Jan 15, 2003 06:05pm | #28

   Ron,  The white oak is a board, roughly 2x6. If I were to try and split it , and it did follow a ring, it would probably work, right?? Thanks for the links, I'll check em out.  Petey

5. 
   ron61 | Jan 16, 2003 01:48am | #29

   Petey

   Hold on don't split it yet.

   Check out Murray's site theres an article about making a self bow there.

   When a board is sawn from a log- a lot of times the cut will cut across the growth rings. You need stay on one growth ring on the back of the bow" a stave is split from a log"- chasing a ring is not that easy. I do it with a Drawknife & scrapers .Theres lots of things to deal- with pin knots-reaction wood-moisture- + lots more.

   Like I said before A BOARD BOW TAKES MORE EXPERIENCE  THAN A STAVE BOW. If you want a shooter on the first one get a HICKORY STAVE. THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH A HICKORY BOW. READ up on what you are getting into the links I gave will help you.

   I know what its like when the Bowyer bug bites, study up on making of self bows it will save you lots of trouble.

   Good Luck You are in for a lot of work

   Ron

2. 
   GeeSeaWhy | Jan 13, 2003 09:16pm | #17

   Petey,

   "I dont think the spur comes off easily enough to drive it into the wood."

   Are you saying that you can't get the drive spur free of the lathe? If so, that's an important gap in your knowledge. Look at the outer end of the headstock, there should be a hole that's in line with the spindle. Put a rod through that and give it a tap, the spur centre will pop out.

   Sawick,

   That's a good idea with the chisel, and one I hadn't thought of. Like somebody said, you learn something new every day.

   Graeme

1. 
   Petey | Jan 13, 2003 11:34pm | #18

   Thanks again, I'll have to check it out , will let you know. By the way , it is an old Rockwell/Delta lathe, I think 42"    Petey

2. 
   DennisS | Jan 14, 2003 02:27am | #20

   Just a quick note to Petey -

   Make sure you hold your hand in front of the drive spur when you're tapping it out and tap very lightly. The first issue is to avoid having it fall on the floor and damage the spurs; the second it to avoid driving it into your hand and damaging ... your hand.

   The usual saying goes - "ask me how I know this" .... (grin)

   ...........

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

1. 
   ownersrep | Jan 14, 2003 04:41am | #22

   Dennis,

   Just have to put my 2cents in.  Make sure both the spur drive and the headworks are clean before you put the drive in.  I didn't and was glad the spur drive was all I ruined after I finally got it driven out!  Just another of my lessons learned the hard way.

   Jim

2. 
   DennisS | Jan 14, 2003 05:48am | #23

   >...was glad the

   spur drive was all I ruined after I finally got it driven out!

   Hard to imagine that it was stuck in there that hard, Jim. On the other hand, I'm also surprised that the knockout bar for the Powermatic is solid steel while the much less expensive Delta I had originally had a brass end to prevent, or at least minimize damage to the end of the drive spur.

   ...........

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

3. 
   ownersrep | Jan 15, 2003 02:21am | #24

   Matter of bad luck and stupidity on my part.  I bought the floor model lathe (got a great deal).  It was assembled and I assumed ready to use (first of many mistakes).  Then a series of dumb decisions on my part including tightening the tailstock to tight and the spur drive wouldn't budge with the (Delta) knockout rod.  I ended up having to drive it out with a wood dowel and a mallet (which I'm sure was real good on the bearings).  Catching the spur was the least of my worries.

   Much to learn,

   Jim

4. 
   DennisS | Jan 15, 2003 03:08am | #25

   Just an aside - I've seen, but not yet purchased, morse taper cleaners. They look like tapered reamers made out of plastic. Considering that the spur and tail stock centers do get dirty and that the dirt eventually accumulates inside the tapers, I suspect it would be worth picking up one of these relatively inexpensive little things to maintain the health and disposition of our lathes.

   ...........

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

5. 
   ownersrep | Jan 15, 2003 04:03am | #26

   Dennis,

   Thanks I did that (after my last fiasco).  Hopefully I won't make that mistake again.  I'm confident I can find another way to mess up.

   Still learnin,

   Jim