Replies

1. 
   JohnWW | Sep 18, 2004 05:49pm | #1

   Waivers and making sure the user has health insurance isn't a substitute for having liability insurance and without insurance you're setting yourself up for trouble. 

   Talk to an insurance agent and find out what it will cost to get coverage and factor that into how much you will need to charge per hour, it very likely won't be worth it.

   John W. 

1. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 18, 2004 05:57pm | #2

   John, sorry....should have mentioned that I do have that and will be upping after I move as I plan to hold some classes.  You're right.  It's the smart thing to do.

   Cheers

   Alison

2. 
   drhamel | Sep 18, 2004 11:05pm | #3

   Ok, let's see.  You bought the mahogany for $2.65 bdft. Does that include delivery?  If not, how much does delivery cost?  Are you going to haul it yourself? Do you have a vehicle to do that with? How many manhours are you going to expend getting wood to your storage area? How are you going to store it?  How much will that cost? How are you going to guard against insect infestation that can destroy large quantities of wood? Are you just going to let people root through the wood or are you planning to use up manhours helping them?  Are you going to help people load their vehicles? Do you need a business license to cover the wood sales operation?  Will the firecode require sprinklers, etc., to protect this large, flammable mass of wood?  How will you advertise?  Could the money tied up in wood that may not be sold for years better be used elsewhere?

   I'm not being negative but just pointing out some issues that need to be resolved before you can even be sure you are making a profit (if any) on the wood sales.

   On to the shop passes.  Figure you will have to expend some time familiarizing pass holders with machinery.  Your own production will be reduced because you will find yourself keeping half an eye on the other guy.  Can't ever have too much liability insurance (example: prominent young neurosurgeon loses fingers in woodshop machinery, alleges negligence on owner's part).  How much time will you lose BS-ing with pass holders? How are you going to handle damaged equipment?  Shop clean-up?

   Formerly just 'Don' but not the 'Glassmaster Don' or the lower-case 'don'.
1. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 25, 2004 02:55pm | #13

     Are you going to help people load their vehicles? Do you need a business license to cover the wood sales operation?  Will the firecode require sprinklers, etc., to protect this large, flammable mass of wood?  How will you advertise?  Could the money tied up in wood that may not be sold for years better be used elsewhere?

   First the mahogany.

   I drove to Miami in my van ($60 gas round trip, $20 food, stayed with friend overnight and had fun visiting with them).  Loaded van myself.  Spent approx.8 hrs driving @$40 = $320.  Total trip costs = $400

   Mahogany costs $1200

   Trip & Mahog = $1600

   P/Bdft price with trip costs included = $3.50

   It's mostly 8ft - 12ft long, 12" wide and all 8/4 or 12/4.  Market price seems to be around $6-7 bucks.  Storage is in my workshop.  Plenty of space.

   The insect infestation is a good question.  Particulary in this neck of the woods.  I need to address that one. Thanks for bringing it up.

   The sprinklers are also a good question.  I don't have a good answer to that one. 

   I checked on the biz license and apparantly do not need one.  My current license covers it.

   Yeah, I would probably help people load, even though it would take time out of my day.  They would have a pre sorted pile that they could pick through/pull from...I'm not planning to advertise but do word of mouth.  My classes will generate some sales, and I'm starting to know some other woodworkers around town.  I'm not worried about tying up money in never used stock...I have enough commission work coming in that over time it will get used.

   Shop Passes

   Shop passes will only be available for Tuesday afternoons and Saturday mornings. 

   You will not able to get a pass with out first taking a familiarization class($50) on the machines and also understanding shop policy.  Tuesdays are going to be my evening class days, so the afternoons when the pass folks are in will be considered part of that stream, so I'll be doing stuff in the shop, like drafting etc, but not tyring to do joinery/milling/finishing.  If they want to BS, it'll be ok, it's their time and if they want to waste it by yacking while paying that's up to them.   Believe me I want to keep an eye on these folks.  Shop clean up is part of the responsibility of the passholder.  They'll give me their pass and drivers license on arrival and don't get them back until they'll cleaned up and left tidy all their stuff. 

   Damaged equipment will be part of the cost of doing business.  I have a new contact that repairs all sorts of woodworking equipment, but I do have to recognize that I will have some down time.

   Don...good questions....I'm answering them to try and make sure I've thought through stuff.  If anything doesn't sound right, put my feet to the fire.

   Cheers

   Alison

   Formerly just 'Don' but not the 'Glassmaster Don' or the lower-case 'don'.

3. 
   mudman | Sep 19, 2004 12:17am | #4

   Alison,

   If there is a market for that kind of stock in your area then I'd say try it for a year and see haw it goes. If it is not worth it you can stop. I have found that most high end cabinet makers and furniture makers do this informally. I know a guy localy who will sell me stuff that he has on hand, as he orders weekly.

   I think the pass idea is a disaster. If you really are trying to make money sell furniture or cabinetry the last thing you need is a bunch of yahoos mulling around watching YOU work and asking questions, or worse telling you haw THEY would do it. Remember WWers can be real blabber mouths. I'm guilty. They will slow you down. I hate to be interupted when I am in the middle of setting up the tennoning jig by my wife, I'd go ape sh*$ if some guy asked my why I don't use the router instead!! I think you can imagine. Also most all shops offer a service simular to what you describe. It is called "Pay me to do it for you". For example to flatten a glued up table top I go to a large shop and they flatten it for me, usually for $60 or $80. If I need access to a 12" jointer I also go to them and they do it for a fee. I pay in cash and I'm sure the money is off the books. Everyone is happy.

   The liability you will incurr is staggering!! I doubt you insurance co. would be very hip to the idea unless they really stick it to you in the premium.

   I'd love to see pics of the shop when you are set up. I dream of something like that.

   Have fun,

   Mike

   please excuse my spelling.
1. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 19, 2004 02:08am | #5

   Dang!   You guys are no fun at all....talk about cold hard reality! I was so excited for about 10 seconds LOL...the questions and comments you pose are exactely what I needed and why I asked. 

   They are valid and important considerations.  I know what my mind will be turning over when I wake up at 2am and wander round the house as usual.

   Thanks for the tough talk.

   alison

1. 
   MichaelPB | Sep 19, 2004 08:10am | #6

   Alison,

   The holding classes is a good idea though, just remember you are selling dreams.  Just like all the guys buying 20" bandsaws and big cabinet saws so they can build bird houses.  Perhaps holding the classes on a weekend and that is when passholders are allowed to use the shop.

   You sure don't want them in there when you are working!

2. 
   mudman | Sep 21, 2004 07:35pm | #9

   Hey!!

   That's not fair, I am a lot of fun!! I actually considerd something simular with kids. Since the schools are all killing the wood shop programs I thought that it would be nice to offer something to the kids in my comunity. I love children and teaching, seems like a great idea. However the same realities occured to me. Perhaps when I am old and grey Ill try it. Of course by then my "class" will be filled with all my grand kids!

   enjoy the new digs, dont forget to post pics.

   Mikeplease excuse my spelling.

3. 
   SgianDubh | Sep 24, 2004 10:44pm | #11

   Alison, are you a trained and qualified woodworker with a teaching and/or supervisory certificate?

   If none of the above apply I'd think twice about putting yourself in the position of being responsible for trainee/inexperienced woodworkers you're not able to train properly because you don't have the necessary training, knowledge, certificates and experience.

   Experience in the self taught field is not always the same as having pukka qualifications you can hang your hat on. Slainte.

   RJFurniture

   Edited 9/24/2004 4:07 pm ET by Sgian Dubh

1. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 25, 2004 02:23pm | #12

   Well...I'm both - in a former life I was a trainer and ran corporate training departments and constructed lesson plans, materials, registration processes etc to widely diverse audiences.  I also have a Masters in Education.  Additionally, I've been making sawdust for nearly ten years now...and while I won't be great until I've been doing it for another forty, I have learnt a few things.  I feel competant enough, knowledgble enough and aware enough to do to...but your question bothers me on a different level.

   I don't think than any piece of paper "qualifies" someone.  Some of the greatest teachers I've ever had either had no "qualifications" or would have been great teachers with or without their pieces of paper.  I'm not saying that I fall into this category....but the question just doesn't seem applicable, particulary in this field where there is no "woodworkers teaching exam" - at least here in the States.  I know other countries do have stronger requirements (i.e., Germany).

   I'm planning on small very "controlled" classes.  Beginners will do very little without direct supervision...it's not an iron clad guarantee, but I intend for my classes to be as safe as they possibly can be. 

1. 
   SgianDubh | Sep 25, 2004 04:57pm | #16

   Interesting response Alison. Firstly you line up your qualifications in Education for  examination and then you proceed to suggest that qualifications aren't important. On the other hand we all do review a job applicants qualifications-- I look for a cabinetmakers City & Guilds or other qualifications, and a qualified cabinetmaker is always ahead of an unqualified one in the UK job market. Qualifications show that at some point you had to meet a set of standards well known in the industry.

   I'm aware of the lack of formal woodworking education and qualifications in the US-- I lived there for about ten years.

   I've met a lot of woodworkers over the decades, unqualified-- and qualified too but to a lesser extent, that I'm thankful never had the chance to teach me their less than impressive bag of tricks, ha, ha. Slainte.

   RJFurniture

   Edited 9/25/2004 10:08 am ET by Sgian Dubh

2. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 25, 2004 06:41pm | #17

   ouch!!

   Sgian...I promise that I will always be careful not to try and answer your questions :) 

   Seriously though, you asked and I tried to answer and in doing so got to thinking more what I thought of the question....

   I think we could go back and forth alot on this one, e.g., lots/little of formal qualifications/lousey or good  teacher etc.  I don't think that things are so black and white that I would out right dimiss a teacher who had no letters after their name.

3. 
   SgianDubh | Sep 25, 2004 07:59pm | #19

   I'm coming from the other direction Alison. I am a trained and qualified cabinetmaker. I started training back in 1973 and sat my various City & Guilds exams in the early '80's.

   After further years of experience in different furniture workshops including stints as a technician on a university furniture course, managing workshops and running my own furniture design and making business I've come full circle and I started teaching the subject on a HND and a Foundation Degree course about a year ago.

   My employer-- the college-- demands that I take teacher training exams to keep my job, perhaps all the way up to a Certificate of Education which might involve three years study and the submission of numerous assignments.

   I had no idea that teaching was so involved requiring so much knowledge that I'd never heard about-- cognitive learning, experiential learning, Kolb, equal opportunities, lesson planning, schemes of work, individual learning plans, initial assessments, blah-de-blah-de-blah-blah-blah.

   The same applies the other way. Many untrained woodworkers have little or no idea of government sanctioned safety regulations, alternative techniques that can be used on the same machine, the wide spectrum of historical precedent, design theory and design practice, drafting skills, sketching-- the list is almost endless. Those woodworking qualifications are a benchmark of expected knowledge, just as teacher training qualifications mean something to universities, schools and colleges.

   I can't see that there's much to discuss on the subject. Qualifications coupled with meaningful experience really do count. I'd generally rather be treated by a qualified doctor than by an unqualified one. Wouldn't you? Slainte.RJFurniture

4. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 26, 2004 03:40am | #20

   Sgain, you have some excellent credentials. 

   Alison

5. 
   MichaelPB | Sep 26, 2004 05:13pm | #22

   Alison,

   In thinking about the teaching idea, check with a lawyer about forming a seperate corporation to do the teaching and lease it the space to them.  That way if someone cuts their hand off you are somewhat protected by a corporation which you can just fold up.

   There must be a way to do it, woodcraft is offering classes all over the country to rank amatuers.  Heck the local one is so hard up for teachers they keep asking me to do a class on gunstock refinishing.

6. 
   MichaelPB | Sep 26, 2004 05:27pm | #23

   Richard,

   I loved your comment about not wanting to be treated by an unqualified doctor!  Of course, like many things there are licenced doctors who are hacks who passed all their exams with flying colors and act just like the doctors who actually know what they are doing.

   Today, many of those doctors are studying native Witch Doctors with no formal training or Guild exams to learn their secrets.  Natives who for years were laughed at as primitives with zero medical value or ability.

   I find it sad when people advance to some level, real or imagined, and use it to look down on others rather than remember where they came from, or worse yet use it as a club on others climbing a similar path.

   Don't you?

7. 
   DonaldCBrown | Sep 26, 2004 06:38pm | #24

   Michael-

   You say, "Today, many of those doctors are studying native Witch Doctors with no formal training or Guild exams to learn their secrets. Natives who for years were laughed at as primitives with zero medical value or ability."

   By citing these studies, you apparently believe that they have benefit for the progress of medical knowledge. If they do have benefit, then that is great.

   I am curious. Could you cite a couple of examples of non-trivial knowledge that has been learned from Witch Doctors that has not previously been gained from the more disciplined approach of scientific medicine? Please refer me to documentation so that I may learn more.

   Edited 9/26/2004 11:47 am ET by Donald C. Brown

8. 
   MichaelPB | Sep 26, 2004 07:29pm | #25

   I am not sure but you could check with the large pharmaceutical firms who are spending billions in the rain forests guided by witch doctors and the fight by those countries to retain rights to cures found using this knowledge.

   Another avenue of research would be to check with the universities now studying Chinese medicine, acupuncture, and holistic treatment of the body as a system rather than a group of unrelated functions.

   Science, in all its humble wisdom has finally realized that "bleeding" patients actually served a purpose by limiting the available iron in blood, a compound needed by the staph bacteria to thrive.

   Below is a link to a Berkely group working at looking at the ethics surrounding abuse of the ethnics.

   http://geography.berkeley.edu:16080/ProjectsResources/BRP/BRP.html

   Edited 9/26/2004 12:42 pm ET by Michael

9. 
   DonaldCBrown | Sep 26, 2004 07:40pm | #26

   "I am not sure but you could check with..."

   Dang. The positive nature of your original statement led me to believe that you had already done some research and knew the facts.

10. 
    MichaelPB | Sep 26, 2004 07:47pm | #27

    Donald,

    I am sorry the sarcasm was too thick for you to see through.

    I edited my post to add a link to a little backwater school called Berkeley that is working on establishing guidelines for doing this sort of research.  It also list the corporation and development banks involved, little companies like:

    4.* Bristol-Myers Squibb Company5. Eli Lilly Pharmaceutical6.* Glaxo Holdings p.l.c.7. Merck & Co., Inc.9. Monsato Co.11. Pfizer, Inc.

    I realize for some that until the AMA stamps it with their approval, it doesn't exist but for the rest of us there is a world of knowledge out there.

11. 
    lwj2 | Sep 27, 2004 02:33am | #31

    I am curious. Could you cite a couple of examples of non-trivial knowledge that has been learned from Witch Doctors that has not previously been gained from the more disciplined approach of scientific medicine? Please refer me to documentation so that I may learn more.

    Foxglove tea -- more commonly known nowadays as digitalis. For chest pain, angina pectoris. Vaso-dilator.

    Curare -- used as a paralytic agent.

    Willow bark tea -- chief ingredient in Asprin. NSAID. Muscle pain and headaches. (acetyl salicylic acid)

    Leon Jester

    Roanoke VA

    Edited 9/26/2004 7:34 pm ET by Leon Jester

12. 
    DonaldCBrown | Sep 27, 2004 02:43am | #32

    Are you contending that Western knowledge of these substances was obtained from Witch Doctors (the subject of my question)?

13. 
    lwj2 | Sep 27, 2004 04:22am | #34

    Yes. Or neigbourhood healers.

    Forgot one: Quinine

    Leon Jester

    Roanoke VA

    Edited 9/26/2004 9:23 pm ET by Leon Jester

14. 
    SgianDubh | Sep 26, 2004 11:20pm | #28

    I  know what you mean, Michael. There are many out there with no formal training that are renowned in their field for their knowledge.

    There are certainly crappy doctors that have been through the training system and can sport all the certificates on their wall, just as their are many crappy qualified woodworkers.

    And surely some of those intuitive native remedies for ailments are worth closer examination?

    There's a balance. Here in western culture we expect to see a certificated level of competence that to a greater or lesser extent we trust. In different cultures, inherited/self taught but undocumented knowledge is more important.

    I think it's natural to regard the work you did to qualify in your field as a benchmark from which you can look down. It may not be right or fair, but it's done. Slainte.RJFurniture

15. 
    MichaelPB | Sep 26, 2004 11:49pm | #29

    I just have to disagree, I don't think it is natural to use anything one does to look down on others.

    I prefer to use whatever skill I may have to teach and encourage others and to always be open to learning from anyone, regardless of credentials.

16. 
    SgianDubh | Sep 27, 2004 11:25pm | #36

    Well, I didn't say it was right or fair Michael. But it happens. I can only conclude it must come easily or naturally enough for many. Slainte.RJFurniture

17. 
    drhamel | Sep 26, 2004 11:57pm | #30

    I believe that I read somewhere that a full 50% of doctors graduated in the bottom half of their class.Formerly just 'Don' but not the 'Glassmaster Don' or the lower-case 'don'.

18. 
    SgianDubh | Sep 27, 2004 11:26pm | #37

    I'd say that sounds plausible Don, ha, ha. Slainte.RJFurniture

19. 
    vern | Sep 26, 2004 05:30am | #21

    hi --just caught your thread-- congrads on the move- are you up on a wood floor-- I know those old bldgs have old pine floors--the Tampa guild teaches a class at the Dale Mabry campass on Sat a.m. for six weeks-- there is a very nice shop -- we provide our own instructor-- a guild member-- we have lost a finger-- interesting story--tell you sometime-- all I can say about the rest is that I have been making furniture in the Tampa area since '86 and I think you have hit the nail on the head-- I have always said that the woods is full of woodworkers but the majority of them are week end warriors-- the serious ones make their own contacts--there are two types to zero in on --the woodworkers who are too busy to beat the bushes for the high quality wood and those woodworkers in transition from amateur to professional-- they are out there--especially if you spread out into surrounding counties--I want to teach also-- on a limited scale-- but you could lose everything you own -- take one step at a time -- you have a well established base to work from-- this area is virtually exploding with new residents and they seem to be pretty well off --maybe some of your ideas need a collective audience to explore all the possibilities-- talk to you soon-- I have got to watch jeannemaking sawdust

20. 
    eddiefromAustralia | Sep 27, 2004 02:55am | #33

    Alison,

    Against my better judgement, I'll buy in to this one - most of what needs to be said has been covered.

    I've got both a teaching degree and our equivalent of City and Guilds certification.

    I read a different undertone into what was being said [edit: in post #12], living in the most litigious state in the world here on a per capita basis.

    In the event (god forbid) of an accident, I read Sgian's comments as a caution on ensuring that you'd be able to win the negligence case. ie: how can you say that you had trained someone in accordance with the appropriate level of skill if you're not certified in the first place to that corresponding level of skill?

    Just food for thought and no response necessary - just a different take on things.

    Good luck, whichever way you decide.

    Cheers,

    eddie

    Edited 9/26/2004 8:03 pm ET by eddie (aust)

21. 
    SgianDubh | Sep 27, 2004 11:30pm | #38

    That's about where I was heading in my first post in this thread Eddie. Slainte.RJFurniture

4. 
   bill_1010 | Sep 20, 2004 07:07pm | #7

   youll incur probably double to triple your sharpening costs on blades, plus the your own downtime waiting for them to be resharpened on YOUR time. 

   Passholders wont treat your powertools like you treat them, some will, some wont.   Expect to do more maintence as some people force wood through a dull blade because they dont know better.

   Youll have to keep an eye on your material and your work items, somethings might wander off, others might fall over and break due to a curious pass holder.

   Youll have to make a locker room for your own pesonal tools, and would have to answer many times that you wont lend out your tools even for just one cut or a few passes with a plane.  This doesnt even take into consideration for your router or shaper bits that will have to be under lock and key.

   This observation just adds to the previous posters other observation.

   Will people come in and want to buy wood during the day while youre trying to make furniture. Are you willing to stop everything youre doing to sell 3-7 bdft of wood while you have a commisioned piece that has a deadline?  If not youll have to hire someone and that will incur more work to deal with payroll and added expenses.

1. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 25, 2004 03:02pm | #14

   youll incur probably double to triple your sharpening costs on blades, plus the your own downtime waiting for them to be resharpened on YOUR time. 

   I do have multiple blades and can get them sharpened for $8 each and picked up/returned with in 3 days (out on Thurs, back on Mon)...but $8 is $8 and that adds up after a time.  I believe that the cost of the class covers this expense, as well as utility costs, insurance costs, and my time.

   Passholders wont treat your powertools like you treat them, some will, some wont.   Expect to do more maintence as some people force wood through a dull blade because they dont know better - you're right...

   Youll have to keep an eye on your material and your work items, somethings might wander off, others might fall over and break due to a curious pass holder....you are absolutely right

   I'm planning to engrave everything, and put my tools under lock and key during pass/class time ....

   This doesnt even take into consideration for your router or shaper bits that will have to be under lock and key....yup, those things are easy to make dissapear...

1. 
   mudman | Sep 27, 2004 08:18am | #35

   Alison,

   Is that your last name or first? It looks like you have thought it out pretty well. I agree that teaching helps the master. I have trained three helpers in my business (remodeling). The act of teaching reminds me of old ideas I forgot and gives me a chance to rethink what I already know. Not to mention that they sometimes have a better way! I would imagine that you have already made a relationship with a lawer, talk this over with them. As I am sure you know, contrary to popular belief simply creating a new corporation is not going to magicly absolve you of liability. I am a LLC and that only offers minimal protection. One of my clients has a C corp ( the most removed from liability) and she is being sued right now. She will almost certinly loose. As was posted if woodcraft can do it.... why not you?

   Wanna see those pics,

   Mikeplease excuse my spelling.

5. 
   AlanTurner | Sep 20, 2004 10:11pm | #8

   Allison,

   I think your ideas are interesting, but as far as profitable, others have given some good thoughts. The question I have relates to your proposed classes. Have you found that you will be able to buy insurance for this risk? I made informal inquiry about a year ago, and was told that I would not be able to buy such insurance. No insurance company was preapred ot take this risk on.

   If you are able to purchase same, I would love to learn the name of the carrier or agent. Feel free to email me on this. Thanks.

   Alan

   http://www.alanturnerfurnituremaker.com

6. 
   forestgirl | Sep 24, 2004 06:41pm | #10

   Hey, Alison, great news on the new shop space.  I see others have doused you with serious amounts of reality here, LOL.  You haven't really said what your core business consists of, how much work you're doing currently and hope to do in the future, though, and that's be useful info.

   My general thoughts are that selling lumber and renting out time on machines could negatively impact the concentration on your work, and your interaction with clients, which always has to be done "on demand."  (This is assuming you're building for clients and not for a mass market).  My gut feeling is that you'll be spread too thin.  Monthly workshops might be an option to fulfill your desire to teach.  As emphasized above, insurance specific to these activities is paramount.  You might want to contact a local Woodcraft store and find out how they handle insurance -- they seem to give alot of classes at ours.

   As far as the lumber goes, based on what I've seen locally, I'd caution you not to overestimate demand.  There are two businesses (successful businesses) locally that have carried hardwoods for a period of time, and eventually closed them out for more profitable inventory.  There are alot of headaches involved with carrying expensive lumber, not the least of which is people's tendency to want the "perfect board" for the money you're charging.  They seem to forget that lumber is an organic material.

   Congrats on the new shop!

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
   Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   Indigo1557 | Sep 25, 2004 03:19pm | #15

   LOL...this has been a cold shower!  But a good one.  It's really making me think and I need to do my thinking now, not later when I'm hip deep in it all. 

   Yeah, I'm way excited about the new space.  It's just perfect.  Or at least will be - lots of sweat equity.

   Currently, my core business is one of a kind commissions for free standing furniture that has a "sculptural" aspect to it. I primarily work in figured woods or woods with a story (eg salvaged).  My work seems to be picking up....initially it was slow, then I had an article about me in the paper, got some more commissions, then I redesigned my site and got some more commissions and then some local designers heard bout me and got some more commissions etc.

   So right now, I have an entertainment center,  two tables, a bookcase, a bed and three 7ft glass display cases I'm working on.  I also have pending a large dining room table, chairs to go with it, a hunt board and a bar.  I have one person working with me right now and he's great.  I'd like to have a couple more, but I won't grow beyond that.  I don't want a production business ever.  Long term, I would like to continue doing the design work for the furniture, but let others do the building while I turn my attention to doing more sculptural work.  I am very interested in doing some large scale public art and installations....I have this whole obession going on about bent lamination forms that echo dancers....

   Long term...I'd also like to create a "center for artisans"...metal workers, pottery, glass etc.  .... and I'm already talking to someone about that...but first I have to move in! LOL.

   Given everyones thoughts about the lumber, including yours, I think I'm going to nix that idea.  But I do think that having a designated pass day might work - this way it wouldnt be a distraction.  It is at least worth trying. 

   I'm still working on the classes though...I think I'd get just as much out them as the students would.  I love teaching....and teaching about woodwork is just a deeply satisfying.

1. 
   forestgirl | Sep 25, 2004 07:01pm | #18

   Alison, sounds like you're doing great!  I remember when you moved to Florida and it was looking more like a desert than a tropical paradise vis a vis woodworking.  Surprise, surprise!!

   I can identify with the love for teaching.  I enjoyed it very, very much when I taught riding lessons for many years, and I miss it a great deal now that I'm out of the horse world.

   Your "center for artisans" idea sounds great!  Enjoy yourself.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   Indigo1557 | Oct 02, 2004 12:46am | #39

   The center for artisans will take longer...but I'd really like to do it.  I love being around thoughtful, focused, creative people even if they are on a path that I don't understand or have to learn to appreciate. 

   Yes...Tampa is not my favorite place in the world, but I'm starting to think I can make it work.  Especially with this new place. 

   I so miss the NW...really, deeply miss it. I miss the mountains, the seasons, the rainy days, St Helens belching steam (damn I wish I was there to see that!!!, climbed the south side and it was prehistoric from the rim), coffee, beer....engaged community, environmental awareness.  The list goes on.  You're a lucky woman.

   I'm gonna come out in Jan/Feb to go hunting for a big ol slab of claro walnut for a client.  We should try to go fishing, drink some wine or make some sawdust...or all three.

   Hope all is well.

1. 
   forestgirl | Oct 02, 2004 04:37am | #40

   Jan/Feb is a great time for me to take a day off -- it's generally pretty slow retail-wise, so drop me a line.  We can set sumpin' up!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)