Replies

1. 
   MBerger | Apr 23, 2008 01:55pm | #1

   That sounds right up my alley! Here's a few ideas that comes to mind.

   1. Layout is probably going to be the most challenging part of this. You want to fully utilize the lumber but also match grain and color where the miters join. If you can, cut all four sides with the same edge facing out to get a true continuous edge.

   If not, mark out the four sides so that you get two pairs of pieces with the same live edge. Then play around with those like puzzle pieces until you pick a favorite orientation. I'd first try arranging the two pairs so that matching live edges are opposite each other.

   2. When you first assemble the sides, the inside of the frame might not be a perfect square. That's okay. Once the corners are lined up, you can mark out a perfect square in the center, a bit larger than the existing one, and cut each piece along your marked lines before glue-up.

   EDIT - I deleted idea number three because it was wrong.

   Maybe someone else can chime in with additions or corrections...

   Matt Berger
   Fine Woodworking

   
   

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   Edited 4/23/2008 1:46 pm ET by MBerger

1. 
   xmike | Apr 23, 2008 07:33pm | #2

   A question for Matt,

   Since the frame members will be 16" wide, is there any chance that the differential expansion across the miter will be different from the inside corner to the outside corner?

   I seem to remember that wide mitered boards tend to open and close at the miter joint due to more seasonal expansion/contraction at the "thick" part of the miter, regardless of the way the miter is put together.   Is that right?

   Mike D

1. 
   saschafer | Apr 23, 2008 07:48pm | #3

   I agree that this is a concern with a miter that wide. Even over a very narrow humidity range, going from 35% to 45%, say, you can expect the miter to want to open up noticeably (1/32" or more). It's possible that you could constrain the movement with splines, but you'd always be fighting the wood.

   -Steve

    

2. 
   MBerger | Apr 23, 2008 08:44pm | #4

   I'm recinding my previous post. After asking around the office, everyone agreed with Mike_D, wood movement is a big problem here and will cause the miters to open up. (I've gone back and edited my previous post)

   A few solutions that people suggested:

   - Veneer the top to look like it's mitered, but use a MDF core, and then apply the live edge to the table like trim. 

   - Reduce the width of the frame significantly to lessen the amount of expansion, and then make the center panel more significant and float it in the frame.

   - Tell the client the idea is not possible with solid-wood lumber.

   -Matt

    

    

1. 
   BCJason | Apr 23, 2008 11:03pm | #6

   Thanks for help on this everyone.
   This design looks good on paper but when you start figuring the construction details it quickly gets troublesome.
   I'll reconsult with the interior designer who drew it up.
   I like the idea of applying the edge to the table.
   Or if I could just find a square tree.
   Thanks Jay

1. 
   saschafer | Apr 23, 2008 11:22pm | #7

   One approach that might pass muster with the designer: Instead of joining the pieces tightly together, insert gaps. That way, the variations with moisture level won't be noticeable:

   View Image

   -Steve

    

   
2. 
   MBerger | Apr 26, 2008 12:14am | #8

   This design looks nice, but you might end up with crumbs and dust stuck in the cracks :)

   Another idea based on your drawing would be to make the frame only about 3 or 4 in. thick and have most of the table be the center square. That way, you don't have to worry about movement at all.

   Let us know how it goes with the client.

2. 
   MBerger | Apr 23, 2008 08:46pm | #5

   Jason. I ammended my answer after asking around the office. Read my previous post in this thread for details.

   - matt