With my “new” pellet stove, I’m getting some stratification temp-wise that wasn’t so noticeable with the old wood stove. (NOTE: The stove has a fan that pushes air out away from it; what I need is miniature ceiling fans to keep the warm air from gathering at the top of the shop) I have one of those clip-on fans, about 7″D, clipped on a joist and pointing down, was thinking about adding another one further out from the stove. Question is, how safe are these cheap little fans to run and run and run and run??? Anyone have a clue?
forestgirl — you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can’t take the forest out of the girl 😉
Another proud member of the “I Rocked With ToolDoc Club” …. :>)
Edited 1/18/2006 12:31 pm by forestgirl
Replies
I couldn't swear to it, but I believe I've seen a really nice looking metal fan that is designed to sit on or near the stove and is powered by the heat rising from it. I think it was Lee Valley or Brookstone, one of the catalog retailers. I recall that it seemed rather pricey, but it might be a good solution.
forestgirl, GarretWade sells stove fans. They sit right on the heated surface so there is no need to plug them in. Segil is right - they are very expensive.
http://www.garrettwade.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=105749&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=0&iSubCat=0&iProductID=105749
Steve Pippins
Oooops, I didn't make myself clear. I don't need a fan on or near the pellet stove, it has one built in! But the air is rising after it gets blown out from the stove, and stratifying as it goes across the shop. So what I need is miniature versions of those big ceiling fans, really miniature versions. I'll edit my OP.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
FG
Can't say much about the effect of dust on the fan.
But, I have a small cheap fan in my attic that runs all summer and never has problems.
Jeff
Ah, but the question is: Is it as small and as cheap as the one I'm using. Too funny. Seriously though, I know some motors and fans are specifically designed to run constantly. I'm taking heart in JWW's post mentioning that the little things are pretty well safeguarded against melting for whatever reason.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
check this out:http://www.ucsofa.com/eco_fan.htm
I appreciate the tip, but (a) it's already been mentioned that those fans are next-to-worthless because they are so whimpy and (b) I need a fan up on the ceiling to keep the warm air from gathering up there. The pellet stove has it's own built-in fan to push the warm air out into the room.
I think I'll just get another clip fan and put it up there, hit it with an air hose every couple of weeks to keep the dust down.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Oops, sorry. I read this thread a few days ago, then saw information on the eco fan today. <blush>
A reason for heat stratification is that heat is lost through the ceiling. Heat will find it's easiest passage and is usually up resulting with the cold coming in from the bottom. Without circulation of air you will get stratification. How is the insulation above your ceiling -- walls. Maybe what you need more that a fan is a good insulation job. That would save on the fuel bills also.
" How is the insulation above your ceiling..." Oh, now that's a funny question! The upper part of the shop (ersatz, garage) is full of my hubby's and stepson's junk/stuff. It's not insulated at all, although a good part of it is covered by a "floor" of sorts. There is quite a bit of cold air coming down one side (the southwest corner) that I need to deal with. This summer, supposedly, we're going to pull virtually everything out of that attic-type space, sort through and cull, make a real floor over the joists, and put back what we need to keep. No, I'm not taking any bets.
I'm working on the walls a little at a time, have about 35% to go.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
If they are industrial fans, probably OK. On the other hand, I had an ancient, built- like-a-tank, window fan that was doing similar duty in an uninhabited structure across the street. One eve SWMTMH said there were funny noises outside; she looked out the window and gave a yell that should have had the fire department on the run... I ran over and yanked the cord that fed power to the building and all went dark. Whew! In this case the fan was consumer grade, and at least 40 years old. Your results may vary.
OK, I'll ask. Iv'e heard of SWMBO but what is SWMTMH?
;-) She Who Mostly Tolerates My Hobbies, of course! (and a lucky man am I)
Yes, and I also have heard of SWMBO and I think I know who she is, but what do the letters stand for?
Ahh, you missed one of the great PBS shows I fear. SWMBO = She Who MUST Be Obeyed.
Oh thank you. I think I like those other initials better. The one where she puts up with my hobbies.
Just so ya know, I got that one trade marked. ;-)
Forestgirl,
The little fans that sit on the stove are cute but useless, they are around 1/50 HP and are totally over whelmed by the air currents rising off the stove.
Most modern fans, even the little clip ons that you have, are designed to be fail safe in terms of fire risk, no matter what happens they shouldn't overheat and catch fire, but you are possibly pushing your luck if they get loaded up with shop dust. If you install a small fan in a piece of ductwork you can put the intake near the ceiling and the outlet near the floor and get much more efficient air circulation, this is commonly done in warehouses. I'd put a filter on the intake to keep the duct and fan from accumulating saw dust.
Another possible choice would be to use a commercial grade muffin fan, the type that are used to cool electronics, they are designed to run 24/7. The Grainger catalog is a good source for looking at the huge variety of fans available.
John W.
Hey, John, thanks for the ideas! I had not thought about dust, and that is an excellent point. Really about time for me to get a new Grainger catalog....forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hi FGI remember reading somewhere about a homeowner with high ceilings where the room heat would collect, leaving it cold down below. His solution was to use a long tube (cardboard? pvc?) that extended from near the floor to near the high point of the ceiling. At the bottom of the tube, he rigged a fan to suck the warm air down the tube to the floor.Hope this helps--T
[Avoid schadenfreude]
Forest:
this is my second posting, just wondering how I go about asking a general question. I have a shop made router table that I have installed a track into for my delta tenoning jig-which should work great for cutting sliding dovetails. The problem is that the delta jig is racked just a bit so that I don't get a true cut. I'm wondering if anybody knows how to adjust the thing-I've tried and haven't been able to figure it out...thanks
Hi Luke, welcome to Knots! Your question would fit into the Tools forum, probably General Tool Discussion. So, go up to the row of blue squares and click on Tools, then scroll down the list of thread titles (left side of your screen) until you see the orange bar that says General Tool Discussion. Just underneath the orange bar you should see "Post New" -- click on that.
Wait though! If you don't see the "Post New" then you must be in what they call Basic View. My suggestion is to change to Advanced View and keep it there. To do that, scroll down to the very bottom of the right side of the screen and look for an Advanced View link, click on that.
All this sounds more complicated than it is. Most people get much more confused in Basic View than they do in the Advanced, because so many things are missing in the basic view. If you have any problems, click on my name above, and send me an email.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Edited 1/19/2006 1:16 pm by forestgirl
I'll give it a try a little later...thank you very much.
I have a 10'6" high ceiling in my shop and have the same problem with the warm air rising. I have 2 air scrubbers mounted in the ceiling, they are configured to pull air in at both ends and discharge from the bottom. This solves the problem and cleans the air at the same time.
They move a lot of air so I don't have to run them when I'm not in the shop.
Ron
I too have a pellet stove and experianced the same problem. My solution was a garage sale fan. Household type with 4 16" blades. I leave it on low and never turn it off until summer time. It gets cleaned once a year,in the fall. With my dust collection and ambient air filter it does not get that dirty. Just remember it's there when carrying long material across the shop.
http://surpluscenter.com/
Give these guys a try. I ordered some 5" muffin fans a few weeks ago to do just what you are describing. I cut in floor grates between first floor with fireplace insert and bedrooms upstairs. Fans I got are rated for 108cfm and are running about 16 hours a day. I was also worried about heat build up but they run cool and do exactly what I need them to. Two fans in each vent was too much so I changed it to one each, wired in an inline roller switch and was good to go.
Hope this helps.
Andy
"It seemed like a good idea at the time"
Forest G.,
The size of the fan isn't the issue as much as how slow it will turn in reverse to keep you heat dispersed. My workshop has a 9' side wall with three trusses. When I enclosed my attic for storage, I didn't start the attic floor for about 8' from the side wall and therefore the ceiling has a slant from the 9' side wall up to where the attic wall starts. It gives me up to a 12' ceiling height for long boards and moldings...
I used some 48" ceiling fans that have a reverse and 3 speeds. The motor is sealed. Since I love airplanes, these were brand new at a flea market for $35 each. I bought 4, sold two for a profit, which made the others' actual cost $10 each..... I have super-insulated the ceiling and both the West and North walls where these two fans hang. In winter and on the slowest speed, I run one in reverse and one in a foward mode to keep the heat moving ever so lightly from the high ceiling and though out the 30' by 40' workshop. They work great and make almost no hum of a noise.
After "living with them" for 3 winters, I've decided to add a programable timer to the light switch circuit I have them on so when I leave the shop they will automaticly turn them on or off.... My heat system is our "Old but Working" 15 year old home's central HVAC that was taken out when our new Trane system was installed in 2000. The Lennox "Pulse Heat" system has a lifetime warranty and is like 90+% efficient and uses Propane. To get the bid for our home's new HVAC, the Trane company only charged $200 to move it out to the workshop in a corner closet I built. At the same time, they installed the air conditioning compressor where I had wired an outside 220v electrical box.
Bill
Edited 1/22/2006 5:20 pm ET by BilljustBill
Those little fans are not designed for long-term use. They are fine for continuous use (motor temp. hits equilibrium relatively quickly), but the bearings tend to dry out prematurely. Then they run slower, and eventually just crawl along. You can crack them open and relube, but I can't be bothered. A very small ceiling fan, or perhaps a gable vent type fan from the BORG would serve your long-term needs better.
Just passin' by.
Be seeing you...
GURL, Pick up a ceiling fan at a flea mkt. (or tag sale) There's many for sale cheaply by lots of 'couldn't do it yourselfers'
Before you mount it to the ceiling, either dont use the extension tube or cut it very short
As for the blades, cut each shorter with a saber saw.
When you cut the first 'vane', use the cut off piece to mark out the other vanes. Run it at slow speed
and don't worry about overheating. Ed.
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