Replies

1. 
   Midnight | Dec 07, 2003 04:34am | #1

   for that kinda cash I'd expect the vac to pelletise the waste into fuel for the shop stove........ sheesh......

   must be nice to have more money than sense huh....????

   Mike Wallace

   Stay safe....Have fun

2. 
   fdampier5 | Dec 08, 2003 03:58am | #2

   the small power planner is $2400 dollars, uses 240 volts.  don't let me evan discuss the larger ones!  

            In fact every tool that they sell is 5 to 6 times as expensive as their competition..

1. 
   Adrian | Dec 08, 2003 05:12am | #3

   I wasn't looking at prices, but i did spend some time in the Mafell booth at the Ligna show in Germany.....VERY nice tools.cabinetmaker/college woodworking instructor. Cape Breton, N.S

3. 
   Scrit | Dec 08, 2003 01:13pm | #4

   Hi

   I have the previous model of biscuit jointer (the LNF19 - current one is the LNF20, same front end just a different motor) as well as a couple of the small plunge routers (OF50e). They cost, in the UK, just under the £190 mark each ($320?) which includes 17.5% Vat (our sales tax), and at those prices they are a goodish buy. The same biscuit jointer front end is available on machines by AEG and Atlas-Copco (owners of Milwaulkee in the USA) so there might be a cheaper solution there. I reckon it's the best biscuit jointer around with the possible exception of the Lamello, it has a 3-position turret depth stop which is really useful.

   The OF50e routers are very similar to the Festool OF1000e (they even come off the same production line), but the base plate isn't as sophisticated and the dust extraction is a bit more fiddly to use - but then at 2/3 of the price here I'll live with that.

   Generally the machines are well made (certainly as good as pre-B&D Elus) and well well finished. They are also reliable - no breakages in 5 years on the routers or biscuit jointer (2-1/2 years of it commercial). Gotta say your prices look really high!

   Scrit

1. 
   Christian | Dec 08, 2003 01:57pm | #5

   Hi Scrit,

   as far as I know the LNF 19 was made by Kress, at least parts of it. This also applies to the AEG/Atlas Copco. I don't know about the current biscuit joiner LNF 20. It makes a good impression. How do you like the front handle?

   Regards,

   Christian

1. 
   Scrit | Dec 08, 2003 04:40pm | #6

   Christian

   The motor on the LNF19 was certainly a Kress (it had that peculiar barrel grip on-off switch), whilst the AEG/Atlas-Copco used one of the AEG grinder motors with a modified gearbox. I have talked with a Maffell representative on one of the trade shows who admitted the origin of the motor, although he was adamant that the front end was their design. He also told me that the Maffell 2000w router is built by Maffell and sold to Festool, with the smaller back-handle router being made by Festool and sold to Maffell......  BTW the front knob gives me no problems, but I tend to adopt a body grip in any case - the front grip requires a two-handed grip.

   Scrit

2. 
   jc21 | Dec 08, 2003 05:19pm | #7

   Wondered what you and/or Scrit could tell me about Pro Tool/ Holz Her tools? Quality, reputation vrs Mafell and others? Thanks http://www.timberwolftools.com/tools/holzher/holzher.html

1. 
   Christian | Dec 08, 2003 06:03pm | #8

   Hi JC,

   first, I've never used a Holz Her or Protool tool. Holz Her made high-end carpentry and woodworking tools. Offered nice plunge saws and guide rails. As far as I know TTS bought them in 2000 and now offers some of their tools. For example:Festool belt sander, Protool carpentry tools (beam planers, beam saws, ...).

   Tooltechnicsystems (TTS):

   Is the name of a company under which three individual companies work together:

   Festool (tools for woodworking, painting, automotive branch)

   Protool (concentrates on construction and carpentry)Tanos (invented the famous Systainer)Festool is a highly reputable German company which exists for more than 75 years. I'm not familiar with the Protool (hi-)story. Protool is a Czech company and offers two lines within Czechia - Narex (for the hobby worker) and Protool (for professionals).

    

   The link you offered provides more information about the Protool relations  http://www.timberwolftools.com/tools/holzher/aboutprotool.html

    

   One part of the HolzHer company still exists http://www.holzher.com/

    

   Are you looking for a specific tool?

    

   Sorry for the lack of precise information!

    

   Christian

2. 
   Scrit | Dec 08, 2003 07:16pm | #9

   As Christian says Holz-Her power tools is no more. Some of the power tools were already being made for and sold under the Festool badge and since the demise of the company other items (such as the belt sanders and the laminate trimmer) have been changed into Festool green/black and incorporated into their range. I've had a couple of Holz-Her tools in the past, notably the 4in belt sander and the 2350 laminate trimmer. They were well made, accurate and robust machines.

   The other part of Holz-Her which makes edgebanding machinery, CNC routers and point-to-point borers is still operating, I believe.

   Scrit

2. 
   numbfinger | Dec 14, 2003 07:19pm | #10

   Hi Scrit...

   Perhaps there is a major price difference when the tools come to the USA.

   I have the Mafell 2002/2003 price list right in front of me.

    Some examples:

   S 05 M - $910.00 Shop vacuum unit (All prices are USD without tax)

    LNF 20 - $515.00 Biscuit Jointer (yes - join-t-er)

   STA 65 E - $473.00 Jig Saw.

   Do these prices sound like what you guys are paying over there? If not... perhaps I could have you buy me a couple tools and just send them over? No, I'm serious :)

1. 
   Scrit | Dec 14, 2003 08:32pm | #11

   Wow!!!!

   The LNF20 and STA65E both work out at around £200 Sterling, INCLUDING 17.5% sales tax (you think sales tax in the USA is high....) , or circa $300 pre-tax (at today's rates) to which you'd have to add shipping, import duty and sales tax. Don't know about the shop vac as the UK importer doesn't list it. Even allowing for shipping, import duty, etc. it does seem as though the US importer is selling at a premium! Sadly, though, we only see 230volt/60Hz stuff here (no 120volt/50Hz in Europe), although I could always ask the importer if they can get US-spec. stuff (I live less than 15 miles from them).  Don't know about the jigsaw (I have a Metabo), but the biscuit jointer is superb.

   Normally it's we Europeans who complain about European made tools being cheaper pre-tax in the USA than they are here (we have a sneaking suspicion that people like Bosch and DeWalt are using buyers in the EU to subsidise you guys in the USA - seriously) - this is a real turn up for the books!

   Scrit

   Edited 12/14/2003 12:33:50 PM ET by Scrit

1. 
   numbfinger | Dec 15, 2003 02:18am | #12

   Maybe it costs quite a bit more to produce the tools with the 120v power requirements?

   Oh well, it is my goal to one day be able to justify a Mafell purchase. But my wife has been comparing prices and brands lately. I can't get away with as much as I used to!

1. 
   Scrit | Dec 15, 2003 03:50pm | #13

   I somehow doubt it. Until about 6 or 7 years ago all power tools used on construction sites in the UK had to be 110volt/60Hz (centre-tapped 55v+55v) on safety grounds -  that changed with the introduction of RCDs/RCBs although some places, such as railway lines, tunnels, etc still have to use 110volt stuff, I believe. This means that there is (still) a wide range of 110volt tools available here from companies such as DeWalt, Bosch,  Fein, Festool, Hilti and Metabo to name just a few. Almost any site tool available for 240volt is also in 110volt. Generally the price is either the same or at most 10% higher for 110volt, although you do sometimes lose one or two facilities, like the range of variable speeds. I have to say that Maffell is a recent introduction (6 or so years) to the UK market and that the 110volt rules never applied on mainland Europe, so they have never offered 110volt options on their power tools here.

   Scrit