Replies

1. 
   WillGeorge | Jan 25, 2006 02:21am | #1

   Not sure how old this post is.. BUT.. Me bein' Me... won't stop me..

   If you have a 'general' idea go for it.. Nothing magic.. except you want the blade stiff! Maybe be able to turn it a at a angle you want a LOCK IT IN PLACE.. (both ends?) I hope...

   I made a few and just used a sort of 'star wheel'at each end that 'locked' in with a pin to keep both ends from wandering off the angle set...

2. 
   eric314 | Jan 25, 2006 07:34am | #2

   Hi James,

   I never made one but I bought and use 3, one is 40cm long, one is 60cm (bow saw with a turbo cut blade option when used as a frame saw) and the last is 70cm (frame saw). While the longer ones are of better quality I found them more difficult to master. Their extra weight translates into inertia. Any deviation from a perfect motion is harder to correct.

   Have fun building yours,
   Eric

3. 
   AdamCherubini | Jan 25, 2006 08:55pm | #3

   I've made several of these things and rely on them (though I don't particularly prefer them).  There are a few pitfalls to watch out for:

   In the case of standard blade on one side, stretcher in the middle, string on the other sort of tool (I call this generically a frame saw, as distinguised from bow saws which use a bent bow for blade tension like a coping saw) the trick is to allow one of the joints between the arm and the stretcher to rotate.  Otherwise, string tension will only bend the upper portion of the arms and will produce no blade tension whatsoever. 

   N.B. English style frame saws typically use M&T joints between the stretcher and arms.

   The next thing to watch for is making the handle-to-arm fit nice and tight.  Forget what you hear about stopping rotation of the blade.  Rotation of the blade is generally a good thing.  If you don't want it to rotate, use a fixed blade design (no handles, just saw cuts in the arms.) Or you can install rubber o-rings between the handle and the arm.  Instead, what you want is a nice positive mechanical association between the blade and the handle, so that when you are trying to add a little down force, the handle isn't rocking in the arm (really annoying).

   After that, make sure the near side stretcher to arm joint is tight side to side. When the blade is turned ninety degrees, you don't want the near side arm to roll with respect to the stretcher.

   Back to turning saws and blade rotation:

   When you saw with a frame saw, you put one hand on the handle or on the arm near the handle, and the other hand on the frame above the stretcher.  The rigidity of the blade (or its resistance to rotation) has nothing to do with a square cut.  Cutting square is a simple matter of technique (laying the saw down into the kerf).  Ditto for keeping the line.You don't bend you saw to maintain the line, you lay the saw down. 

   CAUTION: RANT!

   I don't mean to put anyone down, but I'm always surprised (and frankly a little disappointed) to see experienced woodworkers who simply don't know how to use a hand saw.  Its really a very simple technique.  It doesn't matter how you hold the saw, whether it cuts on the push or pull, or where you stand.  If you want a curved cut you get as little of that blade (or teeth you could say) in the kerf as possible.  The blade will be perpendicular to the board.  If you want to saw straight you lower that angle to 45 degrees or so.  If you make a mistake, lower the angle to 20 degrees until you straighten it out.  The easiest way to saw accurately is to mark all around and saw the corners out.  Nothing to it.  END RANT

   Frame saws aren't a panacea.  I hope you are building yours with reasonable expectations.  That said, I love my little 12" turning saw.  I do a fair bit of scroll work .  I do all of my sawing by hand. I've only ever used a bandsaw once, but I can say this saw cuts faster than a jig saw (just I have used a few times!).  But I haven't used my jig saw since I built this saw probably 5 years ago.  For resawing, I use my English rip saw.  I can see where it would be nice to have a short framed pit saw or long felloe saw fo resawing wide stock.  But since the saw doesn't care how think the board is (it only knows its width and length) resawing wide stock is really the same effort as milling a log.  That's a job I generally avoid.  You could saw your own veneers ala Roubo.  But don't underestimate the level of effort required to produce a 12" long rip cut.  Took me about 20 minutes to resaw a 1'x4' pine board (and I had three to do).  I found sawing vertically worked best because the saw dust fell out of the kerf.  Sawing horizontally (ala Roubo) causes the saw to clog IME.

   Sorry this was so long.  Thanks for reading.

   Adam

1. 
   andynkp | Jan 27, 2006 02:59am | #4

   I am thinking of making a turning saw too and was wondering where you get the blades.  Do you buy them from a retailer or make them from bandsaw stock? 

   What type of cord is best for the tensioners?

   Thanks,

   Andy

1. 
   AdamCherubini | Jan 27, 2006 04:33am | #5

   I've bought blades from Highland hardware, made blades from band saw blades, and cut up rusty worn out hand saws. The store bought 12" turning saw blade is great. The other store bought blades aren't. The teeth are stamped out abd must be touched up with a file to be usable. No big deal really.I've tried many different cords. I'm currently using carpenters' string. I've tried silk, linen, and hemp. You really need something with a lile stretch to it. When you tension, the stiffer strings tend to break. Its also helpful not to wind the arms too tighly initially.Man! I have a lot to say about this, don't I? I saw by hand and I tried to give frame saws a real fair shake. I still use them, but not for ripping boards. Tenons, scroll work, and little else, frankly.Adam

2. 
   pzgren | Jan 28, 2006 05:29am | #9

   Adam, Thank you very much for the detailed reply; it was exactly the sort of detailed information I was hoping that someone would be able to post.<<Frame saws aren't a panacea. I hope you are building yours with reasonable expectations. >> I consider them to be somewhat specialised saws, so I don't look at them as being some sort of "be all" or "end all" in the saw world...and don't expect them to do anything above and beyond what they were designed to do. Since I also do all of my woodworking by handraulics (to borrow a phrase), I don't believe that I have unrealistic expectations of what a particular tool can do, and recognise that there is a learning curve to gain basic competence with a given tool, and then a serious learning curve to begin to master it.<<After that, make sure the near side stretcher to arm joint is tight side to side. When the blade is turned ninety degrees, you don't want the near side arm to roll with respect to the stretcher.>> Good point; it's one I hadn't thought about and don't recall being mentioned anywhere else. BTW, I enjoyed your article on the ultimate workshop. Great information!! Again, thanks for the detailed reply. I'll keep you (and the other posters) up to date.James

4. 
   andynkp | Jan 27, 2006 11:28pm | #6

   James,

   Do you have specific plans you are using or are you making them up on your own?  I didn't mean to short stop your thread but this is a project I've been interested in making for some time.  Would be interested in what articles you have read on the subject. 

   Thanks in advance,

   Andy

1. 
   pzgren | Jan 28, 2006 05:11am | #8

   Andy, I'm making them up as I go, based on some of the plans I've seen; kind of a "hybrid" if you will. I'll have to dig up the articles and the links; more to follow.James
   __________________Additional information posted 31 Jan 06:Here are the articles and links to them: "Bowsaw Making Class" http://userdata.acd.net/chesbrog/bowsaw/bowsaw.htm "The Craft of Tool Making" http://www.cornishworkshop.co.uk/wwbowsaw.html "The Turning Saw" http://www.medievalwood.org/charles/TurningSaw.htm "Constructing a Frame Saw" http://www.woodcentral.com/cgi-bin/readarticle.pl?dir=handtools&file=articles_416.shtml "Frame Saw" http://uk.geocities.com/sapele_bench/projects/framesaw.htm "Making a Frame Saw" http://www.hyperkitten.com/woodworking/frame_saw.php3Hope this will be of some use.JamesAll links tested; they work.Edited 1/31/2006 8:56 pm ET by pzgren

   Edited 1/31/2006 8:56 pm ET by pzgren

5. 
   pzgren | Jan 28, 2006 05:09am | #7

   Thanks to all for all of the informative replies so far!

   James