I am building a 3.0 x 6.8 exterior door made out of solid 2×8 rough old growth VG fir that I picked up for a good price of $5 a foot. The reason I am using solid is I am tired of buying a fancy exterior fir door that looks great but the veneer will not stand up to wx and sunshine. My problem is coming to a decision on depth of the mortices. Ideally I recognize that they should be around 4 inches deep more or less.
With a bottom rail of 15 inches wide, and a center and top rail of 7 1/2 inches ea this makes counting both stiles approx 5 feet of mortices. With my plunge router and longest 3/4 router bit I have as deep as I can go is 2 1/2 inches. Now I can go ahead and chop down after the plunge router to 4 inches but that is probably more choping that I want to do plus as sure as god made little green apples the part I chop won’t be absolutly square and even in width which likely makes assembly aggravating to say the least.
I am inclined to go with 2 1/2 inches of good glue and tight fitting tenons. I could add pins which won’t bother the outside which will be painted but I hesitate to have pins showing on the inside. I would be interested in hearing what the experts think of this approach and if anybody has any good suggestions on cutting deep mortices. Lee2
Replies
lee2,
Try maybe a forstner bit on the old drill press and a litlle clean up with a chisel.I used to make mine this way until I bought a mortising machine.If you have a drill press you can set up a fence to run the stile/rail across and that will keep you centered.Then you can bore a little,move your piece over about 3/4 of the dia. and bore again.Once you get all the way to the end you can clean it up with a chisel.I personally would go as deep as I could and then I would drill 2 round holes offset(19/32"dia.) and insert a square peg(1/2").That is my opinion and personal experience,there are alot of different ways wich you propablywill read on here.
Good luck,
superfly39
I thought about a forstner bit which would work but most forstner bits I see are only 2-3 inches long. Maybe I'm not looking in the right place.
Why a square peg?
Cicero,
The square peg is so that the joint will not move as easily if for some reason the glue should fail.And also with as much weight as one would have with a door this size your gonna need all you can get.Try to spin a square pin forced into a hole and then try the round pin.I have been building 18th and 19th century american reproduction furniture for only a few years now and if you look at originals most M/T joinery is square pinned.Like I said before though,this is the way I do it and I'm sure some will agree and some won't.If you ever get a chance to look at some of Glen Huey's work that is the man that I kinda look up to.
Edited 3/24/2005 1:06 pm ET by superfly39
Edited 3/24/2005 1:09 pm ET by superfly39
Thanks for that Super.
Sounds like it has merit,just wondered about the gaps left by square peg,do you just fill?
Cicero,
If you use a 1/32" or so smaller drill bit and taper the very end of the peg so that it starts in easier the peg takes up all of the space.When you sand it and add your finish the end grain on your peg will be a little darker and looks stunning.On my first post I said to use a 19/32"dia. drill bit,I meant 15/32"sorry.
superfly39
Edited 3/24/2005 2:37 pm ET by superfly39
I like the sound of it,will give it a go,thanks Super.
Sounds like oppurtunity knocking at the door to justify to SWMBO just how badly you need that mortising machine you have been eyeing in the catalog for the last 8 months. <big grin>
Michael Burton
Thunderbird Hardwoods
KD Mesquite
Llano, TX
Mikey: If I swear enough chopping the mortices maybe she might take pity on me and release funds for a mortice machine! Did make one discovery today. Rockler has carbide forstner type bits 4 1/2 inches long. Tried a couple of holes and seemed to work well. Thats a good improvement over the 2 1/2 deep router bit. Lee
why not forget the pins and wedge your tenons? Just let your mortises flare slightly with their depth. then, drill a tiny hole in the center of your tenon - close to the shoulder (this'll keep it from splitting later.) Make a 90 degree cut from the edge of the tenon to that hole with a japanese saw. make yourself a couple wedges sized appropriately and,after you pull the whole shooting match together with your clamps you have yourself a ridiculously strong joint.
I did this in some fir legs that I built ten years ago (on a jobsite workbench) that spends some time outside and has been abused pretty badly - and those joints are totally tight still, with no mechanical fasteners.
Ps I was arrogant and naiive enough when I did this to think I invented this technique. boy, was I wrong -- it's been around for ever.
I just got back from China last month.. I saw some doors on a Temple about 20 feet high by 5 feet wide.. That is a 10 foot opening (Two doors)! Panel and frame.. Door was about 4 inches thick.. All double/Quad tendon ... No PEGS! Best I could tell NO GLUE.. I asked.. Doors about 400 years old!
I forgot.. Back from the front ALOT.. SO out of the rain and sun..
Edited 3/25/2005 8:41 pm ET by Will George
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