People,
I have the scratch for one Lie-Neilson. Already have an old jointer plane. Which one should it be, 4, 4 1/2, 5? Isn’t there one that allows the use of two different iron angles?
Appreciate any advice
Tom
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Replies
Lie Nielsen's high angle frogs will fit any of their 2" wide planes. Give them a call.
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
Since you can only get one, and you want it to be versatile, pop for the low angle jack plane. By your definition, it is, without a doubt, the most versatile plane in the lineup. You can smooth end grain, you can joint with it. You can open the adjustable mouth, and with a more aggressive cut and cambered iron you can prep rough stock. You can put a nice 40° secondary bevel (or higher) on the cutter and use it as a super smoother for the toughest, gnarliest grain you can find.
All the other bench planes can do several tasks, but none can do ALL of them as well as the LA jack.
Jeff
I agree 100% with your choice.
Having quite a few LN planes and other toys, there are several that are stand-outs. The first would be the LN low angle jack. It is an extremely versatile tool, giving you the ability to hone different bevels on the blade to acheive great performance in a variety of wood species. Youy may want to opt for the hot dog handle for it also, so you can also use it for a shooting board. If you got some extra coins left over, I would strongly consider the little bronze LN 102 block plane. You would be surprised how much this plane is used and mine is never far from my hand when in the shop.
LN's are very addictive as you will find after your first purchase. Other LN's I have that perform well above initial expectations (and used more than I first thought I would use them) include the LN low angle jointer, the #4 with high angle frog and the 140 skew angle block plane.
This is a very slippery slope you're standing on, but it's a lot of fun!
T.Z.
You are the second one to recommend that plane. Ya, I am on that ol slippery slope. But not paying for a thickness planer, jointer, electicity, ear protection with built in radio and sound insulation for the cellar ceiling (altho the wife is already complaining about all the grunting coming from down there) will pay for a few more nice toys. And I'm gonna try to keep goin that way. Never heard of anybody losing a finger on a hand plane, altho if anybody could do it, it'd be me. I'll keep your list of the planes to eventually have and sneak out and buy them one at a time.
Thanks,
Tom
Edited 2/19/2008 1:46 pm ET by veggiefahmah123
I picked up a L-N 4-1/2 about 6 years ago and have loved it.
That said, I was recently surfacing a rather large white oak table top recently and was having trouble with a bit of tear-out. For some reason, I picked up my old Ulmia wooden plane (that I hadn't used since I got the L-N) to give it a go and darned if that thing didn't just breeze through the job slick as can be.
I find myself wondering which one I'd choose if I had lost both my smoothers and had to buy a new one. That woodie sure is fine, and it's a hundred bucks cheaper to boot!
Mike Hennessy
Pittsburgh, PA
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mike
is the ulmia you have inserted a 50* angled bed??
dan
"is the ulmia you have inserted a 50* angled bed??"
Nope -- just the standard wooden integral frog.
Mike HennessyPittsburgh, PA
The 4 1/2 uses the same optional hi-angle frog and blade as the #7 Jointer
Barry in WV
I have the #4 and love it, I have both frogs for it and it currently has the higher angle frog in it. Of course I am sure that a #4.5 which I don't have would be even better;)
Have fun
Troy
The 4 and 5 are both 2" irons, and the 4 1/2 and 7 are both 2 3/8" irons. LN makes 50° frogs in both widths. This only changes the angle 5°, but that's a significant difference in figured wood. You also want the throat really tight in figured wood (1/64" or less) and take very fine shavings. Highly figured wood may still tear our, but with a bevel-down plane, the only way to increase the angle is to put a back-bevel on the flat face of the iron; 5° or 10°. (That makes it a bevel-up plane.) Keep the back-bevel very small (1/32") and make sure the chip breaker is behind that corner. Otherwise, shavings will catch under the chip breaker and jam in the throat.
Tom
My recommendation is the same as Tony ... first the #62 (low angle jack), followed closely by either the #102 (low angle) or #103 (standard angle) block plane in bronze.
The #62 is a hugely versatile plane, being capable of smoothing the most difficult grain (with a high angle bevel) to shooting end grain (with a low angle bevel) and roughing out (with a strongly cambered mid angle bevel).
I have the #103. The bronze gives this tiny block plane a lot of authority. While standard angle, it cuts end grain extremely well (nearly as well as a low angle), while it is better controlled on face grain than the #102 (owiing to the higher cutting angle). The advantage of the #102 is that it is a tad more comfortable (having a lower profile) and can imitate a standard angle by simply honing a higher bevel angle (add 8 degrees to the bevel angle).
Best of all, get a couple of extra blades for the #62 (mildly cambered 50 degree for smoothing, moderately cambered 35 degree for work as a jack, and a straight 25 degree for end grain) and one extra for the #102 (25 degree for end grain, and 50 degree to convert the block plane into a mini smoother). With this combination you will be set for just about all tasks! That is versatility!
Regards from Perth
Derek
Hi Derekm
Would it be safe to assume that your recommendations would also hold true, to some degree, with the LV equivalent planes?
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 2/19/2008 9:14 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Hi Bob
Absolutely!
Actually, even more so. There are more options available with LV/Veritas. For example, the LA Block Plane can take an optional tote and knob which converts it into a #3 size bevel up smoother. With a high angle bevel it is one hell of a plane!
View Image
The LV LA Jack is a larger plane than the LN version - think #5 1/2 size (LV) verses #5 size (LN). More heft with the LV.
Regards from Perth
Derek
I would fully agree with Derek on this also. Both LN and LV are very fine companies with each having specific traits that are very attractive. For example, the LN are very traditionally styled, with the LV more modernistic, with some very nice improvements over the basic Bailey design.
One of my "unsung" heros of planes if the Lee Valley bevel up heavy smoother (part of the LV jack and jointer family). I have three blades for that plane including standard, high angle and toothing blade and I have yet to find a domestic wood that I couldn't work (now grant you, in Pennsylvania, we're talking cherry, walnut but also some knarly birdseye and curly maple).
Anyhow, hope you all have a good one today.
Tony Z.
Derek & Tony,
Thank you both. That confirms a purchase decision I have been wrestling with for quite some time. I will be adding to the herd very soon.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Bob, can i ask why you're looking at LV vs LN? I'm shopping for my next plane as well. I have a LV LA block plane, older stanley #4 I tuned up, and an older stanley #5c that i have yet to tune up. i'm considering the LV LA jack. Looking for your thoughts on LV vs LN.Thanks, Brad
Brad,
Price is one big reason for me.
All of the reasons Derek stated in his post.
These two planes would fill out my bench planes, satisfy my needs and I wouldn't need a herd of them to do it. I also like the idea of being able to add the parts to the block to make it into a smoother with all the angles from the various blades. It just seems like a lot of capability in these two planes.
The LV LA JAck makes a SWEEEEET shooting plane too!
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 2/20/2008 9:25 pm ET by KiddervilleAcres
Bob, thanks for the reply. I'm going back and forth on the LV vs LN and based on good experience, may side w/ the LV. Now, the higher angle blades may be a problem since I have a worksharp (limited angle choices) and I don't know how to sharpen w/o it.
Brad
Brad,
Veritas MK-II and Scary Sharp works right well for me. Not that difficult to learn either. Most of the time I freehand when I'm honing which is most of the time.
I have yet to try hollow grinding to prep a blade as I have way too many other priorities on my plate at the moment. Biggest one is getting the DC up and running, about 75% there.
Being a hobbiest my priorities tend to shift mainly because of the weather this time of year. Last week when it was relatively warm (35°F) I got to spend a fair amoun of time in the woodshop. This week it's just too darned cold (-12°F) this morning!
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Appreciate any advice? Really? How about this:
For the price of a single LN plane, you can afford a whole set of used Stanley bailey planes. True they're not going to perform as well in difficult woods as LN's and they aren't pretty. But you can get a whole set and have plenty of money left over for a new grinder, some good stones, and maybe a decent set of chisels.
The guys recommending LN LA jack work difficult woods. And these planes are required for those woods. Is that what you'll be using? My junk planes have no trouble dealing with walnut, cherry, mahogany, and pine.
Adam
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