New to here but not to woodworking.
The head of my ten year old Delta 15″ planer is out of parallel with the table. I doubt it’s fixable. Anyway, I’m looking at new machines: 15-20″. Budget $2k or less. Something with accuracy and a better knife set up.
- What machines should I be looking at?
- Should I go for helical or spiral as opposed to the old style?
Replies
I would repair the Delta. I'm not qualified to give you info on how to adjust the cutterhead for parallel.I've never had to, Delta should be able to help if your manual does not address the problem.Why buy another 15" planer if an adjustment or maybe a part is needed.
mike
Easier said than done. Ever try to get hold of these people? And if you can, you're talking to someone sitting there reading to you from the manual, which you can do on your own.
I know what you're saying. This is an older unit with additional problems. Extremely difficult knife changes and set up. No dust collection. Etc.
Appreciate the thoughts but I don't think I'd ever get satisfaction speaking with Delta.
It's definitely fixable. There are independent techs out there as well. It's not terribly difficult to align the table. You could put a helical head in there. Sunhill sells the with the gearbox so it's an easier changeover. Dust collection can be easily added. That's not true about the techs at Delta, atl least not all of them. I typically get a call back in an hour.
Another option is to go with quick change Esta knives. You could really fix the planer up and improve it easily.
As far as a new one. Shop Fox, Grizzly, Bridgewood...pretty much basic. With your experiences you might consider buying something local with service help available. Helical is especially useful for curly woods. Cost factor... even though the head is pricier consider carbide knives last 8 times longer and if you strugle with knife changes it might be worth it to you. Consider the Esta knives.
Edited 4/13/2007 12:44 pm ET by RickL
I wish I had your confidence. This unit has been disappointing from day one. I've had so many frustrations with this machine I've just been in a mood to take the hammer to it.
As to an independent rep, none in the area that I'm aware of. If I feel brave and overly energetic today I may pull the old manual out and see what it says. My suspicion is it says nothing, but I could be wrong.
I'm just in a mood. Thanks for your thoughts.
I have called Delta one time for a question about my own drill press.Actually I emailed them and they called me within a day or so.I spoke to a tech that was extremely helpful,my problem was solved over the phone. Also I used to work for Woodworkers Warehouse, (now defunct)and contacted Delta often for customer service .Always had prompt replies and courteous phone people.Sorry if you had a different experience.
From reading your later posts, I guess you might as well go another route if you really hate the thing.
mike
I'm not against refurbishing this thing. Just that while I've woodworked all my life, I'm piss poor at grasping mechanical stuff. It's gotta be pretty well spelled out for me. Somebody knows what they're doing and stands over me giving the orders, I'll do it all day long. Put me by myself and I'm in a state of confusion.
My experience twice with calling Delta was to get some fool who knew less than I did (which isn't much). I told them the problem. There was a pause. It was obvious they were looking up a response on a computer, then they proceeded to read to me what the owner's manual says. Yeah right. That helped a lot. That kind of stuff gets me hot under the collar.
If you read frustration, you're reading it right. I did find the manual and it reviews numerous adjustments. The photos are unclear and the explanations leave me with more questions as answers. If I decide to give it a try, and you hear a loud bang, that'll be either me hitting the planer with a sledge hammer, or me shooting myself. <g>
Thank you. I appreciate your efforts.
I have the spiral cutterhead 20" planer and 12" spiral jointer from Bridgewood and I have not changed the knives in 4 years. Not even rotated one cutter. I would definitely call Curtis Wilke at Wilke Machinery and see about the Byrd Shelix cutterhead on the 15" ($1500 total) and the 20"($2000 total). I don't know if they install them in their PA store or you have to, but the Shelix is a little better than the spiral because it hits the wood at a shearing angle instead of squarely like the spiral knives. If you have to install them,check out the Grizzly Extreme series spiral cutters. I will never install another straight knife again. These spirals put on a beautiful finish cut and I hear the Shelix are better. I have had machines that I have never liked and if that Delta planer is one of those putting a Shelix cutterhead in it might be throwing good money after bad. Wilke are good people to work with even when you live in Michigan.
Terry
Terry, this is the kind of information I'm looking for and I appreciate it.
Is Bridgewood and Wilke the same?
Any other issues such as roller problems or inadequate dust collection?
Bridgewood is the label that Wilke Machinery in York, PA has put on their machines since the 70's. They import from Taiwan and uncrate and setup their machines in PA. On some of their machines they buy without motors and controls and will install Baldor motors and Square D controls. Yorkcraft (thus York PA) is their consumer line and gives you a very good price advantage. You can check them out at wilkemach.com. I am sure you can get good stuff a Grizzly, but I have been to the Wilke plant in York, PA and have been very impressed with all the people there. I noticed you live in southern NJ, it might be worth a trip to York, PA and Muncy, PA (Grizzly) to check them out. You are probably 2-3 hours away. I had to drive 7.
Terry
Edited 4/14/2007 8:18 am ET by terrylee86
Thanks. I'm about 2.5 hours from York and 3 and change from Williamsport.
Road trip. (I'm a Harley guy).
Thanks again.
That is the way to spend a couple of spring days. Keep us posted
Terry
I live in Southern NJ and we arent having any spring days here lately!!! You may wanna just take the truck
Let me know how you make out. I'm looking for a 20'' too
-Lou
As a Cumberland County native, I'll second that. Weather's been awful.
Morning BC...
Anyone that rides a Harley needs some support of what Terry just told ya!
Yorkcraft planers are the exact as the Grizzly and Shopfox at much less price but the same quality. I paid $1049 for my "Yorkie" 20 planer plus $165 shipping. Good price... very good piece of equipment!
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Whoa, that looks like a nice hefty table. My Delta table is a junky piece of tin. I think I'm gonna have to take a ride to York. Thanks.
Morning BC...
Not only are the extensions heavy cast iron, they came up about .002 off of being "dead flat" when attached. Now... if you were to consider one have Curt Wilke crawl up under-neath with you and show you how ya get em that way. :>)
When I attached the first side, it came up drooping about 3/16"- 1/4" on the outer end. Whoa.... I could have engineered it better was my first thought and the second was I was going to have to shim it where the extension table attaches to the main. How could an engineer be so dumb and to have not provided a way to allow such a large variance?
I went to the plastic box that I had put all the hardware in as the machine was assembled except for the extensions. There were 6 set-screws left over that the manual doesn't mention. It simply says.. "Attach the extensions". Who writes these manuals anyway? Obviously someone that dis-likes anyone that is not machine oriented I do believe from my experience. Most would have been calling on Monday morning to tell Curt about the horrible alignment if the extensions. he......
I went over to the machine with a flash-light and took a look. Sure enough there were the small holes on the end of the extensions and there were the threaded receiver hole in the end of the table base it attaches to.
In ten minutes the set-screws were in place and with a Veritas straight edge the entire table was dialed in to .002. Might have squeezed out dead flat but .002 is close enough in WW for a country boy.
And... if you did purchase one, e-mail and I will tell you how to get a 770 lb. machine bolted to a 2" pallet which is strapped on top another 5" pallet down all by your lonesome in old age. ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Everybody talks about various brands. Any comment on the Powermatic 15" and 20" units. I have used the Powermatic 8" Jointer and I love it. It seems to be well made and works flawlessly. I would like some opinins on the Powermatic planers.
Morning Dave...
I looked at both when in the quest for the York I arrived at. The Power-matic 20" is a very nice machine. I do believe it and the Steel City come from the same assembly line in Taiwan. The Grizzly, Shop-fox and Yorkcraft come from the same assembly line in China.
From what I discovered both assembly lines are owned by the same company. That is hear-say from a fairly reliable source (Curt Wilke of Wilke Machinery). I did not see a great difference as I went over all of the above including the Power-matic and Steel City. I could not personally justify the $1895 to get a couple of extra speeds that the PM has and the Yorkie, Griz and Shop-fox don't. Other than that I saw no great difference in quality.
But to answer your question... yes, the PM is an excellent machine from what I saw. I have not run any stock through one though!
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
From what I discovered both assembly lines are owned by the same company. That is hear-say from a fairly reliable source (Curt Wilke of Wilke Machinery). I did not see a great difference as I went over all of the above including the Power-matic and Steel City. I could not personally justify the $1895 to get a couple of extra speeds that the PM has and the Yorkie, Griz and Shop-fox don't. Other than that I saw no great difference in quality.
Fine Woodworking did an article on this a few years ago and at that time at least Delta, Jet, and Grizzly were in fact made on the same assembly line. They even had a photo showing the different brands rolling down the line complete with pics of a few of the poor Chinese slaves that assembled them.
Edited 4/19/2007 11:22 am ET by ThePosterFormerlyKnownAs
Morning PFK...
I heard from the same source that the company is slowly shifting all operations to China as the labor is cheaper. Seems the Taiwanese are a democracy as ours and the workers keep demanding more and more as they have become more skilled and prefer our living standards.
At some point the Chinese will demand more also, IMO. And when they do they will face about a zillion Chinese Red Army troops sent with armored brigades to tell them to.. well.. ahhh... how can I say "shut up or be silenced by force" diplomatically. I suppose that's something you can't say and be diplomatic! :>)
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Edited 4/19/2007 11:58 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Thanks for the warning.
How is it that any other industry has everything is up and ready to run except for the wood industry? I mean, would the world accept a TV or a pickup that came 3/4 disassembled, and needed adjusting, honing, cleaning, etc? You pay $300 for a fancy hand plane: the baseplate has to be flattened, the frog has to have burrs removed, and the blade has to be sharpened?
Why do we tolerate this stuff?
Morning BC..
I think weight and bulk has to be considered in shipping a large piece of iron as some of these machines.. and that may be the main factor. I could not even imagine getting a 8" or 12" jointer on a crate already assembled. Too large, to heavy as is in two boxes for a single pallet which trucking companies base their rates on.
And... if most of the big machines were assembled and shipped, I believe you would see even more damage in shipment than you already do as that makes them larger and harder to hanlde in shipment. If you ever get the opportunity to go by a trucking company dock, watch them move things around with a fork-lift. We're not talking the fragility of the "new-born" ward at the local hospital! ha.. ha...
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
I hear ya, but they manage to do it with cars, computers, tvs, tractors and fine furniture.
Hey BC...
Take a close look at what it cost to transport a car on a car carrier. My neighbor had a company that just did that before he retired. That would drive the price up IMO.
Gotta get ready for work.. have a good day!
Regards..
Sarge.. jt
About a year ago, I stopped at Redmond (I think at your advice) and picked up a PM 882 jointer. It stuck out over the tail gate of my four door GMC. One piece and I got it to WV without a problem. Wouldn't you know when it was uncrated, the first thing I noticed was "three phase." They sent a single phase at their expense and we made the trade. The only thing we had to assemble was to change the position of the switch, mount the dust spout and the fence. After using the old Craftsman, this is really a pleasure. The only pain is that it is made for a dust collector which I don't have yet.
Edited 4/19/2007 10:23 pm ET by tinkerer2
Morning Tink..
If you have a 4 door p/up, I bet it did indeed stick out the end. That bed is 75" plus and add the cushioning in the end of the crated the table comes packed in.
Good folks at Redmond & Son as I have gotten to know them over the last year or so. They en-larged the show-room.. warehouse last fall and now have around 40,000 sq. feet. They just recently started having WW classes on given Saturdays. With all the various lines they distribute for, they have the south side of Atlanta covered.
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
"That bed is 75" plus and......." Actually the bed is 83 inches long. I don't know why I insisted the bed to be so long. But I did have a friend come over yesterday to use it. He had some humongously long boards. Redmond sent a catalogue some time after I bought the jointer that listed it at $ 1305.00. I think I paid something like $ 1800.00. I have a knack for paying the highest prices for things.
Morning Tink..
The longer the bed the better, IMO. I have a feeking that the model was closed out as the 60 A has just been.. or it was a demo model they sell each year to make way for the new years model. They have some pretty discounted prices each year when they do it. Best timie to pick up a General they distribute if you are looking for General.
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
blewcrowe
We accept it because it lowers the cost of shipping.. shipping isn't a minor consideration when you consider these usually get an ocean voyage included before they arrive..
I've never had to spend more than 15 minutes putting together any of the Grizzly equipment I've purchased. If it's a challenge to you, are you absolutely sure wood working is for you?
You would do well to understand that they also don't come with plug ends.. there are about a million differant outlets, I wired mine into a plug that goes into the dryer outlets, chances are your outlets are differant..
I'm going to assume that was not meant as an insult. Well sir, I've been woodworking just about all my 55 years. Not all that mechanical and electrical, but I've built some pretty fair stuff out of wood.
Cars and tractors and computers come from overseas. Doesn't seem to be a problem with them delivered to the consumer in functioning order. My washer and dryer came with a plug, too. Positively amazing.
blewcrowe,
First I'm glad you didn't take it as an offence, none was intended.
We all have issues that offend us. I have a whole shop full of equipment and still I must set up infeed and outfeed rollers at a differant height for every single piece of equipment!
It would be so simple to standardize at one height. Then I could roll my jointer up to the table saw and have an outfeed and use my shaper as in infeed table.. or visa versa.
I mean they are all the same brand and when I checked every single manufacture is guilty of the same thing.
Now if you don't ever work with long wood I can see where it's not an issue with you.. however since wood tends to come in 8 foot lengths either some people have helpful spouses or too many friends or they struggle to manhandle things that we just weren't meant to manhandle..
As for me I don't mind things needing some assembly.. it allows me to check everything over quickly before I use it.. It allows me to carry in major pieces by myself by simply uncrating them in the truck. I can thus carry in 4 pieces of 200 pounds each rather than 800 pounds that I cannot handle by myself..
Finally I can see how things fit and work together so if something goes wrong I can quickly find the problem and fix it or order the needed parts, It empowers me..
Knowledge is power!
The alignment should be readily fixable. Even if you're going to get a new planer, it would be nice to sell your old one for better than a "broken machine" price. If you post the model number, someone here may know what to do.
Pete
It is a Delta DC-380. Keep in mind this is a heavy machine and the machine must be be flipped and partly disassembled to do the fix. The repair directions are somewhat ambiguous as to how much adjustment will accomodate what degree of out-of-parallel. Seems that one must make a small adjustment, reassemble machine, re-right it, try it, repeat, repeat, etc. What I wouldn't give for some help. Probably a three person job to flip this thing.
Thanks.
Hi blewcrowe,
There's nothing like getting a new piece of woodworking equipment. But, unless there is something actually broken( grinding sound, pieces flying off, etc. ) everything is adjustable on your planer ( DC-380 or equivalent ) . Adjusting the height of both infeed and outfeed rollers and spring tension, table rollers, and cutterhead parallel to the table. The owners manual gives you step by step instructions on how to do this. If you don't have a copy you can download one at acetoolrepair.com ( I think ). If you can't find one and would like a copy let me know and I'll make a copy of mine and send it to you.
Paul
I appreciate the generous offer. Thank you.
I have the manual. As I was telling one of the other gents here, I wish I had some help. This machine is heavy and assembling/moving/disassembling is no one person job. That's for sure.
You're welcome blewcrowe. Wish I lived closer. I could probably have that thing trued in less than an hour. But, I do understand your frustration. It is a rather heavy piece of equipment.
Paul
Well, I appreciate the thoughts.
You guys can give up on the Yorkcraft stuff. I called today to order a 20" planer. Out of stock for "several" months. They seem to have no idea when they will get more in. They are literally on the "slow boat from China".
Same with the 15" planer and 12" jointer.
So much for a good deal!
Lee
http://woodmastertools.com/s/planers.cfm
Two motor varialble feed and much more.
Vic
Pretty good machine, huh?
Say, your name has a note about it.
Edited 4/17/2007 9:49 am ET by blewcrowe
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