Replies

1. 
   WayneL5 | Dec 21, 2003 06:17pm | #1

   I have an Oneida and like it a lot.  The fine micron filter cartridge is very effective.  The weak link is that few tools are manufactured for effective dust collection.

   Collection works really well on the planer and jointer which produce larger chips and are well enclosed.  The table saw and miter saw are very difficult.  On these the vast majority of dust is collected, but the blades sling dust in directions which can't be completely enclosed.  Also, building hoods that accomodate tilting the blades makes them less effective.

   An air compressor is the best way of cleaning the cartridge.  Brushing it off is tedious.

   I would recommend the Oneida system, recognizing the limitations at the collection ends.  I would definitely spring for the muffler on the discharge.  I bought it, and tried the unit with and without, and the improvement with the muffler is well worth the money.

   As far as remote control, the stardard remote controls will not switch a 1½ hp motor, even though they claim to.  The reason is that the dust collector is made with a low efficiency motor which draws more amps per horsepower than a high efficiency motor, and the amperage exceeds the rating of the remote.  I hooked my remote to operate the coil of a motor starter, and used the starter to operate the motor.  A low efficiency motor was selected because high efficiency motors are quite a bit more expensive, and in the few hours that a dust collector motor actually runs in a year, you'd never pay for the increased motor cost in electrical savings.

1. 
   DavidCockey | Dec 21, 2003 06:44pm | #5

   Which motor remote control didn't work for you because the motor drew too much current? Was it one Oneida sells or from elsewhere? Using a remote to control a motor starter sounds like a good idea though I wonder how the total cost compares to the unit Oneida sells. I'm interested since I'm going to be in the market for a remote start for our 2 HP dust collector.

   I'm not sure what your comparing the 1 1/2 HP Oneida motor to when you say it's low efficiency. If you're comparing it to a 1 1/2 HP vacuum cleaner or router then it's an not even an apples to oranges comparison, more like an apples to fish. The 1 1/2 HP rating on the motor in the Oneida unit is rated for continuous operation at 1 1/2 HP unit. Items like vacuums and routers are typically rated for a "peak" power which is hard to understand. It's not a power level reached in typical operation.

1. 
   WayneL5 | Dec 21, 2003 09:34pm | #9

   It was Oneida's remote control that would not operate the 1½ hp motor.  I think it was not noticed by their engineers.  They buy the remote, of course, from someone else.  The package said it was good to 1½hp, 15 amps max.  So, they were reasonable to think it would work with their 1½hp unit.  However, the motor on their 1½ hp unit draws 17.2 full load amps, which they may never have noticed, so it would not actually work.  I spoke to them about it, and I don't know if they ever investigated.  I looked in catalogs and could not find any brands that had a rating greater than 15 amps, so I went the motor starter route.

   The motor on my dust collector is rated at 66% efficiency.  In other words, 66% of the electricity it draws gets turned into horsepower at the shaft, the rest is wasted as heat.  If the motor had been 76% efficient it would only need to draw 15 amps to produce 1½ hp, in which case the remote control would have been fine.

   A premium efficiency motor might be 92% efficient, but they are quite expensive.  In a commercial operation, where the motor ran thousands of hours a year the cost of a premium efficiency motor would pay for itself in electrical savings.  But in a home shop where you might put only a couple dozen actual running hours on the motor in a year, you'd loose money with a more expensive motor.

   In a commercial operation an engineer would price several motors at various efficiencies and, using actual electrical rates and estimated running hours, select the most cost effective motor.  But, in a home-shop-sized unit you take what you get.

   In my case using a motor starter was a no-brainer because I got one free that was ripped out of a commercial enterprise. 

   Edited 12/21/2003 1:35:44 PM ET by WAYNEL5

2. 
   PeterDurand | Dec 21, 2003 06:25pm | #2

   Check out Penn State. They have a cyclone unit(s) and I think that their price is better. Better make sure that you know the price of shipping from Oneida - it is very expensive.

   Cheers,

   Peter

    

1. 
   DavidCockey | Dec 21, 2003 06:37pm | #4

   I bought a 2 HP unit from Oneida a year and a half ago, and I don't recall that the shipping was overly expensive. The unit came in about 4 boxes via UPS. I'd expect shipping on any comparable unit to be similar.

1. 
   PeterDurand | Dec 21, 2003 06:48pm | #6

   When I phoned them a few months ago they quoted me about $470.00 to ship a unit to Bellingham, Washington. If I wanted the floor bracket it was going to be an additional $250.00

   They only offered commercial trucking rates. However good their product, I will be going elsewhere for a cyclone.

   Cheers,

   Peter 

3. 
   joe.roth | Dec 21, 2003 06:32pm | #3

   Hi Jim:

   Check out this web site for EXTENSIVE cyclone/dust collection info.

   http://cnets.net/~eclectic/woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm

   Joe

4. 
   Albstn | Dec 21, 2003 07:06pm | #7

   Jim,

        I bought the 2HP internal filter for my 2 car garage.  I have been more than pleased with the quality of the product and Oneidas service.  My only complaint is that the internal filter clogs quickly.  I will try to convert it to an external filter once I convince my wife to park in the driveway.

   Al

5. 
   JMartinsky | Dec 21, 2003 08:09pm | #8

   Jim,

   I've had the Oneida 3HP system in my 28x24 shop and it is simply outstanding. I work commercially, so for me time is money and it has been a huge time saver. First, Oneida is a class act. I spent much time researching different systems and hands down this is the company that I want to deal with. When I spend my money, I expect a good product with service to match. My expectations were exceeded on both fronts. I faxed them a sketch of my shop and they designed the system, ductwork, blast gates, all that. Once I decided to order, the system showed up when they said it would, nicely crated. It is definitely a quality product, big, heavy cyclone, steel brackets, the works. They sent everything including hangers and a crimping tool, (Klien no less!). They even called me several times to see if I was pleased with the system! Overall a very pleasant experience. Now, granted they are not the cheapest game in town, but if you want to get a good product a that you will never have to replace, this is the unit. I opted for external exhaust with no filter. I have the exhaust running out the back of my shop, so I have no filter issues. Now, unless I let the drum overfill, pretty much nothing escapes the cyclone. It is really remarkable, the exhaust points down at the ground and even with a fresh snowfall, there is no dust mark even after working with MDF. Upon emptying the barrel, I find chips and dust that is as fine as flour. As far as remote control goes, I bought some cheap controller from Woodworkers Warehouse that worked infrequently at best, then bought the "Long Ranger" model and never looked back. My machines sometime sit for months at a time in bitter cold and humid heat (welcome to New England) and that dust collector just does its thing. It draws like a hurricane, even with two or even three blast gates open. Get a floor sweep and you can't go wrong.

   Peace,

   John

6. 
   MyTacoma | Dec 22, 2003 01:28am | #10

   I just received the Woodsucker II. It's a good alternative to the Oneida. UPS shipping from Indianapolis to Seattle for five boxes was around $150.

   http://www.woodsucker.com

1. 
   SCFrankland | Dec 22, 2003 04:36am | #11

   I am also looking at upgradeing my DC and was looking at the 2hp Oneida system. I was wondering if anyone has had one shipped to Canada and was wondering how the service was and what kind of duties were paid.Scott C. Frankland

   Scott's WOODWORKING Website"This all could have been prevented if their parents had just used birth control"

1. 
   PaulReuter | Dec 22, 2003 09:23am | #12

   Scott,

   Oneida has a CDN distributor, Wellbeck(?) Sawmill in the toronto area.  I don't have the details handy right now.  I think Oneida put me on to them when I questioned them about shipping & dealing with customs.  They work closely with Oneida & I got the same service through them I had with Oneida.

   Others,

   I've purchased two Oneidas. A 1.5 hp for myself & a 3 hp for the company I work for.  My thoughts now are:

   1. I would make both purchases again.  Quality products & they do all that a dust collector is capable of.  My experiences with two different setups have taught me that a dust collector is not the be-all & end-all of dust collection.  What some other posters in this thread have indicated is true, many machines do not allow for complete dust collection.  That said, it is imperitive to get the best dust collector you can afford to reduce that fault as much as possible.

   2. The internal filter is a great idea for giving great filtration with as small a footprint as possible.  That said, it's a real pain to clean.  It must be removed from the machine & then brushed, beaten vacuumed, or blasted with compressed air.  Which means you still have to deal with all that dust it did such a good of filtering out of the air.

   3. The external filter does require more space but it is much larger so it requires less frequant cleaning & it still requires beating or blasting with compressed air.  But, all that very fine dust is kept inside the filter & collected in a pan at the bottom of the filter that can be removed & dumped.

   4.IMO there is no alternative to having a dust collector in a shop with power machines.  Doesn't have to be an Oneida, but that is a good standard to shoot for.  A good air scrubber is second on the list, after the dust collector.  This is another place not to skimp.  I'm sorry, but a box fan with a furnace filter is just kidding yourself.  Yes, you'll find a lot of dust on it but it just doesn't have the capacity to really make a difference for your lungs.  My scrubber is an old furnace fan behind an 8 square foot filter panel made up of a 2" deep pleated filter backed up with a 3" deep pleated filter.  The filters I use are like pleated furnace filters on steroids.  The unit is built into an interior wall of my basement shop, sucking air out of the shop into the rest of the basement.  Air flows back through a panel at the other end of the shop.  The only complaint DW makes is that I carry too much dust out of the shop on my clothes.  The cost of my scrubber was under $100 CDN.

   Paul

1. 
   PeterDurand | Dec 22, 2003 08:45pm | #13

   Good point on cleaning out the dust it was supposed to keep from your lungs.

   For what its worth, I recently purchased a 20 inch canister type to retrofit over my run of the mill collector. It has internal paddles that you crank to loosen the dust, which falls into the can. That along with some compressed air from the outside should work. I have not had it long enough to need any cleaning out.

   Venting to outside is a good idea, however you need make up air in the shop and in cold climates that could be a problem.

   I will have to call Oneida back and see if they can do something about the shipping cost they quoted me.

   Cheers,

   Peter

   Edited 12/22/2003 1:02:21 PM ET by PeterDurand

2. 
   KMcColly | Dec 23, 2003 02:37am | #16

   Paul -

   What is the source for your filters?  I want to build my own scrubber and yours sounds like a good setup.

   Ken McColly

   [email protected]

3. 
   SCFrankland | Dec 23, 2003 03:05am | #17

   I to have built a scrubber out of an old furnace fan and filters. The only difference is I added baffles to the inside to diffuse the air flow so that it does not blow in any one direction with any amount of gusto. I will see if I can find a number for the CDN distributor.

   Thank'sScott C. Frankland

   Scott's WOODWORKING Website"This all could have been prevented if their parents had just used birth control"

7. 
   RandMCapozzi | Dec 22, 2003 09:40pm | #14

   I just received my new Oneida DC on Friday. It's the 2HP commercial cyclone with the 39" external cartridge filter. The unit arrived in about 1 week from when I ordered it via FedEx. It came in 8 boxes (2 of which where ducting).

   I just hung it up yesterday and turned it on. I haven't hooked up any duct work yet so I can't speak to its performance but I can provide the following observations of my experience.

   Dealing with Oneida has been excellent. Rich (the Oneida rep I worked with) worked with me to size the appropriate system based on my DC needs. I made several revisions and even created a "phased in" design for me so I didn't have to buy all the duct work at once.

   The unit arrived by FedEx (a new program they just started) and was very well packaged. The filter was shipped directly from the filter manufacturer and arrived a day later than the rest of the system. The fit and finish is outstanding. I even like the new painted look (white) of the DC. I believe the shipping to me (Leesburg, VA) was $250. This only includes the DC system itself and not any special fees that may apply to certain types of duct work (i.e. spiral duct has an additional shipping fee I believe).

   It took me about 4 hours to hang the system and get it up and running. The only thing extra I needed that didn't come with the system was some lag screws to hang it on the wall, a 12/3 extension cord and a 220 plug to wire up the motor. Everything else was included.

   I like the remote that Oneida sells with the system. It come in three modules (transmitter, relay, and the switch). The transmitter is a small key fob similar to an automobile security key fob. The relay plugs into a 110v outlet and the DC plugs into the switch which plugs into the 220 outlet (in my case). The remote works very well although I'm gonna need to be careful not to misplace the little thing.

   The foot print is very reasonable. I will place the DC in a "closet" within the shop that will measure about 4'x4'. This will provide plenty of access to clean the filter and empty the canister and reduce the noise in my 600sf machine room. The unit is not quite when standing under neath it but is very comfortable if around the corner or on the other side of a wall. The exhaust duct for the cartridge includes a "silencer" (foam wrapped around a mesh tube). I'm not sure how much this helps since I haven't run the system without the cartridge.

   Sorry for the long winded response but hope this helps in your future DC planning!

   --Rob

1. 
   mitch | Dec 23, 2003 02:34am | #15

   "WOOD" magazine just had a fairly extensive article on cyclones-  the 2hp oneidas did pretty well, the 1.5hp better than avg.

   m

8. 
   stephengaal | Dec 23, 2003 08:15pm | #18

   I have had the 1.5 HP Oneida for about 18 months.  Very happy, although I probably would have gone for the 2 HP were it available at the time.  Their engineering dept that lays out your dust collection system did a great job for me.  Installation was easy.

   Stephen J. Gaal