Origin of North American Long Rip Fence.
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Does anyone know the history of rip fence development in North America that led to the full-length fence common on virtually all table saws produced on this continent and in Asia? I suspect it started in the days when the fence had to be locked at both the front and the rear to prevent wandering, but I can’t find any citations.
Further, does anyone know why North American saws have continued to use the long rip fence, even though (thanks to Mr. Beisemeyer) the fence no longer requires anchoring at the rear? The long fence, while not the most dangerous aspect of table saw design, certainly can lead to kickback, and it has fostered all sorts of unsafe lore, such as “cock the rear of the fence (here insert your favorite number from 1/64″ to an inch) away from the blade”? And why are we always advised to put the rear out of parallel to the blade rather than the front, which is the same thing?
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Apart from the usefulness of a long rip fence in conjunction with a dado blade for forming grooves, I can't think of a good reason for using one.
As for 'cocking' the fence one way or another in relationship to the track of the the saw blade, I can't imagine where such an urban legend ever gained credence, for as any fule no, that can't possibly jive with the simplist laws of physics. After all, would anyone ever say that to steer your car correctly, you must have both front wheels pointing in slightly different directions, i.e., out of alignment, either toeing in, or toeing out, and that the perfect misalignment should be that both wheels point in or out by precisely 3°? I don't think so, not unless you want your car to be more difficult to control, and for the tyres to wear out quicker due to scrubbing one edge or another. Slainte, RJ.
*Bad news, Sgian. Cars are aligned with the tires intentionally "misaligned". The theory is that as the vehicle moves, the play in the system allows the tires to become properly aligned, if I recall correctly.This of course, does not apply to tablesaw fences though. The first time I recall hearing that bit of misadvice was from Forrest Manufacturing. As I recall, the misalignment is supposed to help keep their Woodworker II blade from burning, since it is made without proper side clearance on the teeth. ;-)Dave
*Oh, well Dave. I guess I'm wrong with that then. Next time I go in to get the 'tracking' checked, I'll ask them to make sure it's out of whack a bit. I wonder which way should they be out of whack? Slainte, RJ.
*North America is right whack, the rest of the world is left whack. Jeez, don you no nothin'?
*I've played around with the short fence, and I use it when doing heavy ripping. I still find the long fence useful when doing other tasks though. It's good for holding a sub-fence when rabbeting. It's better for cross-cutting using the fence instead of the T-square. And so on.Sgian's saw is set up so that the fence stops just where the teeth start cutting. I prefer to have the fence extend back the width of the blade to keep the board on track. I was confused about how Sgian made accurate rips with the short fence until I found out from other posts that he doesn't. In fact, he said in one post that he sometimes rips freehand, a no-no according to doctrine descending from Mt. Taunton.As to how this answers your question, Donald, I don't know. Perhaps it's cultural inertia. More likely other people are like me and continue to find uses that a short fence wouldn't be suitable for and expect manufacturers to supply long fences.BTW, can't the Delta Unifence be used in a short set-up?
*"which way"... Usually toe-in, I think. The setting varies by vehicle. Back when I worked on cars, I could tell if a front-end was misaligned, and which way, by the wear pattern on the tires. Couldn't do that now, been too long...On the fence subject, I wonder if that Amurrican long fence also has something to do with a question I'm often asked when helping out at the woodworking store."How will this stand up to plywood being slammed against it all day?"My answer is usually the same, "Why would you slam plywood against a tablesaw fence?" ;-)Dave
*In defense of the long fence, it is very useful in truing up the first edge on S2S stock. In fact, I use a long wooden fence attached to the regular metal one for this purpose. I also have a tall (6") attachable fence for use in cutting the bevel edges on floating panels. It helps keep the panel vertical, especially on the end grain passes. I guess the question I have is why would anyone use a short fence? I'm sure there must be a good reason. I do use a pivot-point type of fence when resawing on the bandsaw to give me better control in correcting for blade drift, but that's the only instance where I rip anything without the stock rigidly supported throughout the cut and beyond. What am I missing here?
*Donald, you might want to direct your questions to Delta. The original table saw was developed by them. All subsequent saws have been clones.Plus, I never heard about kicking out the back of a fence until about 1980 or so. I learned to have it parallel and feel the reasons are valid. Primarily, if the back is kicked out, the front is kicked in. Therefore you are running the board through the blade in a non-parallel manner which tends on longer boards to cut in somewhat of a taper.
*Howard, I've tried it all I think. I've changed my ways and now run true parallel. Kicking it out on the back side with a short board (shorter then the fence) works fine but once you get beyond that I began having trouble with the board showing a curved cut. Not bad if you don't mind jointing every thing but a real bear if your tight on wood.The problem seems to have gone away after bringing the fence back in dead on.
*FWIW, the Delta Unifence can be adjusted forward to avoid the ills that have been identified by the other posts.
*Chas and others-Yes, the Unifence will do it all. Short fence for ripping timbers, long fence for beveling panels and other shaping operations. I'm really surprised at its source. Delta designed the Unisaw back in the mid-thirties (that's 1930's) then sat back for several generations of people relying on others to develop improvements (a good rip fence, a good miter gauge, a useful splitter, etc.)Of course, the Unifence came after the Biesemeyer fence, but it was an advance. And it took many more years before Delta offered it as a standard piece of the Unisaw. But my hat's off to Delta for that one improvement to the Unisaw
*I was going to mention about the unifence. Thats why I sold my old saw(Beismeyer) and bought one with a unifence. I really do like the adjustment the Unifence has.Also I just wanted another saw heheheh.
*Not having the guide parallel to the blade will also cause a wider kerf and more strain on the motor.Ok, here is one for the experts. Eventho I have both parallel, when I run a kerf partway through the thickness of a board, the rear of the blade will cut a wider kerf when it comes out of the board. I've never figured this out???
*The Unifence is patterned after European fences. I've been using that style fence on SCM saws long before Delta came out with it. I've got an old cabinet making magazine from 1890 that shows some Egan machines before they were Fay and Eagan and the saw fence is long and very low while another ad shows the J Sagar company from England had a saw with a fence that stops just a few inches past the front of the blade but is very tall. Did you know that the saw blade was invented by a Shaker woman named Sister Tabitha Babbitthttp://www.toolsofthetrade.net/content/tools/2000/january/halloffame/default4.aspBabbit bearings were invented by Isaac Babbitthttp://www.whonamedit.com/doctor.cfm/363.html
*Long fence, short fence; this reminds me of high school locker room debates about whether girls with big butts or little butts looked best. It's whatever works for you. I've tried both and I like what I experienced first. I think that's the way it is with most of us.
*RJT-Which side of the debate were you on?
*As long as they had a pulse always worked for me.
*Mike,I would check to see if your blade is parallel with the miter slot.TDF
*All those tricks you get up to Jon are good reasons to use a long fence,............in the American manner.*If I want to straighten the edge of a board I use an overhand surface planer, AKA US jointer. I also might use the sliding table on my saw. Again I could go for the use of a chalk line and rip this on the table saw freehand, which no doubt will cause much shock, and tut-tutting, or I might use a jigsaw, handheld circular saw, bandsaw, or even a hand held power planer.*To cut raised and fielded panels I like to use a spindle moulder (shaper) such as the machine here,....not in this case being used to raise a panel of course, but the power feeder sitting in the left background has its uses, and I'll add the usual stuff about guards being removed for clarity, etc.. The table saw you can see in the right background would be the last choice I'd make as being the ideal tool for raising solid timber panels.I like the short fence for ripping, but it's always coupled with a riving knife and crown guard, as are all my sawing operations, whether they be ripping, cross cutting or freehand. Imagine, if you will, in ripping, a piece that bows even slightly after the cut. I'll take my short rip fence and guards set up over a long fence and no guards any day of the week. I don't think you are missing anything. Different cultures have different traditions. Mine is to use the short rip fence in conjunction with the guards. It works, I've been doing it for 25 years, and I'm not going to change now, and nor I suspect are you. Vive la difference. Slainte, RJ.
*Nathan, You're probably right. I know nothing. Slainte, RJ.
*i "Sgian's saw is set up so that the fence stops just where the teeth start cutting."Joseph, actually the fence is set up so that it holds the timber against the blade until just b after the point at which the downward chopping front teeth b stop cutting. A small, but important correction to the technique as you described it, but I knew what you were trying to say. ;-) Slainte, RJ.
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