Replies

1. 
   Oriole | Apr 21, 2003 11:17pm | #1

   I wouldn't paint cabinets with oil based paint again. It is harder, thou, I've been told that the new acrylic paints are just as hard. After, having lived in two houses and having painted two different kitchens with oil based paint I can say the following:

   1. Oil based paint yellows faster, I needed to repaint every three years.

   2. Oil based paint is hard to paint, harder to clean up, takes longer to dry.

   3. Oil based paint chips, even with the most through prep.

   Oriole

1. 
   Robbie | Apr 21, 2003 11:31pm | #2

   Ouch-

   At $70 per gallon, it sounds as if it would have to be something like an epoxy or linear polyurethane based finish.  These are typically used in marine applications.

   The first one I know of is Awl-grip.  This delightful 3-part product is tough as nails, but is hard to work with and may contain every carcinogen known to man.  There are others that are supposedly easier to shoot (Emron?) but look just as good.  From what I know, these products come only in high gloss.

   Hopefully, someone else will have superior product knowledge of other products that work.  I am tackling a similar project.

2. 
   RW | Apr 22, 2003 12:50am | #3

   If you're going to paint them, my votes on the acrylic. I don't know what paint stores you have yonder north, but here I really like Sherwin Williams Pro Classic line. It needs cutting, and substantially to spray, but it looks like oil when it's on and dries quickly and (when cut) smoothly. I'd wager without really knowing that the growing popularity of acrilics that look like the old oils would have Canadian paint manufacturers following the trend as well. If you don't have spray equip, you can do good things on the flats with those little foam rollerr. Some call them minis, I call them cigars, since that's about the size of them.

   "The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb "      lyrics by Roger Waters

1. 
   TomT226 | Apr 22, 2003 02:27pm | #4

   RW,

   Exactly right. Been using SW Pro Classic acrylic and primer for quite awhile, and it is exellent. Gotta cut it about 15% with water before I can run it thru my HVLP gun. Stuff is hard and durable.

3. 
   Mackwood | Apr 22, 2003 08:09pm | #5

   Ouch,

   Concur with RW!  We have used SW Pro Classic extensively and it is an exceptional product.  The small foam rollers (weenies, as we call them) will give you a surface that you can't tell from sprayed untill you're only about 18" from the surface.

   Oil based products are beginning to be favored less and less.  The acrylics have improved dramatically over the past 10 years and manufacturers have been forced to remove much of the "good stuff" from oil based products.  The "marine" products are excluded from many regulations; thus their high quality and high price.  Many of the "marine" products require a "forced air respirator" if you're working indoors.  They may give a more durable finish but you need to decide if the extra cost and precautions are worth the return.

   Good luck!

   Mack

1. 
   tdickhout | Apr 23, 2003 05:49pm | #6

   I went to the Sherwin Williams site and I found a product called :

   PROCLASSIC¯ WATERBORNE INTERIOR ACRYLIC SEMI-GLOSS

    I take it that the product everyone raves about.  I hope this is an answer to my prayers.  I have tried painting with latex on many of my projects and have never like the outcome. That's why I was thinking oil.  My wife thanks you, as we were going to have move out of the house while the paint was curing.

   One additional question: I am a very amateur craftsman.  I went to night school for a furniture course, and it was great. I built a shaker style sofa table out of cherry. But at home I own a circular saw, a drill, and a straight edge.  So at home I mainly use MDF, as I am unable to joint and plane my wood. (My kitchen project, cabinet grade Maple plywood, built at a theatre's scene shop)  According to the article in FineHomeBuilding, I would use an Oil base primer and then an oil paint to finish.  If I love this SW product would I still use an oil base primer? 

1. 
   Robbie | Apr 23, 2003 07:34pm | #7

   As described in the same article, there are other ways to seal MDF endgrain.

   Incidentally, I went to Sherwin Williams yesterday.  Bought some cigar rollers and some ProClassic Primer -- they suggested the Pro Block becuase it has better adhesion to previously clear finished substrates (after scuff sanding).  Will try it on the vanity in the kid's bathroom before tackling the kitchen.

   Interestingly, the ProClassic comes in both Oil and Acrylic.  Becuase he felt it was more durable, the salesman suggested the Oil enamel topcoat, unless I was using a very white color.   The aforementioned yellowing would show up in the white.

   Has anyone tested the difference between the acrylic and the oil based product?.

   Thanks again for all the help

2. 
   RW | Apr 24, 2003 12:43am | #8

   Pro Block is the primer. Bonding, sealing, etc. Good stuff. You can paint glass with the stuff and have a hard time chipping it off with a new razor. I still vote the acrylic latex over oil. Less odor, quicker cure, non yellow, easy cleanup.

   But I have to say it again, floetrol, evil word or not, does good things to that paint. I wouldn't put a brush into it without it. One of these days, I'm going to get a viscosity cup and see what I think it ought to run at. I hear 10 or 15 percent cut, I'm thinking the quart of eviltrol I got last got used up in about a gal and a half of ProClassic. On that product, thin is good. (I wonder if Gwyneth uses the stuff?)"The child is grown / The dream is gone / And I have become / Comfortably numb "      lyrics by Roger Waters

3. 
   Mackwood | Apr 24, 2003 05:02am | #10

   Ouch,

   We use oil based primers most of the time and I'm certain that the folks at SW will hook you up.  Ask them about the idea of putting some sort of "clear finish" over the Pro-Classic.  We've never done that but have talked about it once or twice. (Customer didn't want to pay for the extra step).

4. 
   Clay | Apr 24, 2003 07:07am | #11

   I recently repaired a cabinet door (MDF) that had worn to the point the finish was gone at some of the corners.  I patched the one area where it was puffed up with some acrylic gel and  pumice filler.  Then resprayed the whole front with "Breakthrough" (WB acrylic cross link).  I was very impressed.  No bleed through at all, even on the corners where the original finish was completely gone.  I got some orange peel as a result of careless thinning on one coat but it sanded out nicely.  The build was very good, very little odor, two coat coverage with pure white.  The Mfrs say this paint is as hard as baked on enamels but much more flexible.  My experience agrees with them.  I will use this paint for a lot of future projects (I have several waiting in the shop that it will be used on).  The customer was quite amazed and sent a couple more doors back with me for the same treatment.  I buy this finish from HPI and it is made by Vanex in Mount Vernon Illinois.  If you can't find it contact Vanex and ask for a distruibutor in your area.

   Vanex Color, Inc.

   1700-T S. Shawnee, P.O. Box 987Mount Vernon, IL 62864USA

   Tel: 618-244-1414Fax: 618-244-1461(note: I have no affiliation with them, I just like their paint)

4. 
   IanC | Apr 24, 2003 03:27am | #9

   Well call me old fashioned but I've not seen an acrylic that looks, feels and holds up like oil.  I think the paint manufactures would prefer to quit making oil so they make great claims for their acrylics, even calling them enamels on the can.

   I painted our cabinets white 8 years ago and can still bring them back to almost new with a little cleaning.  No chips, probably some yellowing but not noticable.  It was a Porter enamel, about $30 a gal.  back then.  I first cleaned them with TSP and primed with oil primer.  I sprayed the doors and drawer fronts and used a combination of mini roller and china bristle brush on the face frames.

   Ian Cummins