Replies

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Nov 09, 2003 07:38am | #1

   butch

      "I cannot get any stains, gel or penetrating to take to the wood".

       You need to explain what exactly that means Butch. Some color, no color, light penetration, splotchy penetration, etc., etc. I'm just guessing, but I interpret what you mean by not taking to the wood is the stain (even if dark) is not making much progress in darkening the wood at all. If that is the case, what grit did you sand to?? 320 or higher by chance?

      If so, you have probably burnished the wood and the pores have basically closed from over-heating. This is just a guess from what I think you mean. You need to explain so someone can hopefully pin-point the problem from more data.

   Regards...

   sarge..jt

1. 
   simchart | Nov 09, 2003 08:05am | #3

   I have sanded the pieces to 220 grit.  What I mean is that even if I apply a dark stain, it very light and blotchy.  Perhaps dye would be a better choice.

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Nov 09, 2003 08:45am | #4

   butch

      Poplar is tricky and will go blotch. You have to prep it. Back-wash or sanding sealer. I get good results from Bartley's gel stain, but I rarely sand past 180. Most of the time I will just use a hand scraper instead.

      Yep, Pauls pictures of the cherry dye look good. I haven't used dye on poplar, but I might give it a go if he got those results to see what happens.

      I would re-sand. Try leaving it at 180 or don't go over-board with 220. I think people spend too much time trying for a glass smooth surface and the wood gets burnished if you don't keep the ROS moving or you over-sand.

      Try Pauls dye or you might even try what you have again on a scrap. Remember if you test on scrap, sand or scrap to exactly what you will do with the real piece. If not, you won't get a correct read of the results.

   Good Luck...

   sarge..jt

2. 
   Paul_Snyder | Nov 09, 2003 07:57am | #2

   Butch - instead of stain, use a dye. Apply by brush and don't wipe the excess. It may take 2-3 applications to get the color you want. Poplar takes dye a lot better than stain.

   Here's a color sample on poplar using a "cherry" dye;

   View Image
   Cherry Dye on Poplar

   Paul

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Nov 09, 2003 08:48am | #5

   Paul

      Nice job with the dye there. I use dyes on various occasions, but have never tried it on poplar. I get pretty good results with gel. After seeing your results, I am going to try it on poplar and alder to see if I can duplicate the nice job you've done there.

   Regards...

   sarge..jt

1. 
   Paul_Snyder | Nov 09, 2003 10:19pm | #7

   Hi Sarge,

   Some woods take dye really well (poplar, walnut, mahogany). Others dye well but need a stain or glaze to color the pores (oak, ash(?)). Other woods do NOT dye well unless you take precautions to avoid blotching/splotching (maple, cherry, alder, etc.).

   I've tried a number of techniques on poplar, and dye does the best job with the least effort.

   Regards,

   Paul

   Edited 11/9/2003 2:21:21 PM ET by Paul S

1. 
   RANGERP75R | Nov 09, 2003 10:27pm | #8

   Paul

      Thanks for tip on the poplar. I am familar with the oaks and open pores. I use a bit of poplar now as I get scraps from cabinet shops to build charity pieces for give away. The tip with the dyes is excellent as I have never even consdered it on this wood.

   Regards...

   sarge..jt

2. 
   silver77 | Nov 09, 2003 05:21pm | #6

   Nice!!

   What is the name of the dye? I'd like to experiment on some poplar.

   Thanks,

   silver

1. 
   Paul_Snyder | Nov 09, 2003 10:35pm | #9

   silver,

   That dye is "cherry" from ML Campbell thinned 2-4 parts thinner (I don't remember the exact ratio) to 1 part liquid dye concentrate.

   But there are a number of suppliers that carry good dyes. The TransTints from Homestead Finishing (home of Jeff Jewitt, a frequent FWW contributor); ColorFX dyes from Wood Finishing Supplies (home of Russ Ramirez, moderator on the pro finishing forum); and Ultra Penetrating Dye Stains from Mohawk are a few examples. And they all have a wide color selection.

   Paul

3. 
   BOBABEUI | Nov 10, 2003 08:09pm | #10

   Paul S.

   That sample of dyed Poplar looks fantastic.. Wow, never though Poplar could look that good

   Do you do any pre-conditioning before the application of the dye?

   Edited 11/10/2003 12:28:06 PM ET by BOBABEUI

1. 
   Paul_Snyder | Nov 11, 2003 01:27am | #11

   I used the dye on bare wood. I tried spraying the dye, which is how I usually like to apply dye since it works so well on cherry and maple, but it didn't work on the poplar.

   Brushing or ragging the dye worked the best. I mopped on an even wet coat of dye and just let it soak in and dry. Then repeated twice more to get the color I wanted. Walnut dye, with reddish tones, looks very good also. A measure of red in the dye will combine with the green in the wood to make brown (red & green = brown). The green in the wood will turn various shades of brown on its own as the wood ages.

   Paul

1. 
   BOBABEUI | Nov 11, 2003 05:44pm | #13

   Paul S,

   Thanks for the information..

3. 
   Alan | Nov 11, 2003 04:48am | #12

   Butch,

   To fight the blotchies you can use a spit-coat or wash-coat of shellac.  About a 1, or even 1/2 pound cut will work wonders in evening out whatever colorant you wind up using.  (If you use a base coat of shellac do NOT use an alcohol based dye.)

   As for getting it darker, you can begin with a dark shellac.  You can then use another wash coat of shellac between coats of stain.  That way you can apply any number of stain coats--you can even vary the color of the stains between coats.  That can make some things absolutely gorgeous.  Different colors of stain can bring out and emphasize different shades of the wood.  Again though, don't use anything alcohol based on top of shellac.

   Alan