Replies

1. 
   Jellyrug | Apr 21, 2005 09:40pm | #1

   I'm certainly not an expert on the subject, but from personal observation, the beetles seem to need a certain amount of moisture to survive. They thrive just under the bark, when the logs are lying outside, in moist conditions.

   Once the lumber has dried, they seem to disappear.

1. 
   obertRo | Apr 21, 2005 09:50pm | #2

   Thanks for the input. Hoadley's book Understanding Wood tells me powderpost beetles will infest dried wood; even finished pieces...but he gives no remedy.
   I wondered if maybe baking the wood for an hour at perhaps 200 degrees might insure any beetles/eggs were killed. Robert

1. 
   Jellyrug | Apr 22, 2005 07:51am | #10

   I did not want to say anything, but I have kind of the same problem, with stickered Walnut, amongst some of my good expensive lumber, so there was a bit of panic on this end. I have done a little bit of research.

   I'm in central California, though and it looks as if my problem is Old House Borers. The Larvae seem to need enough starch and more than 10% moisture content to survive, so I believe at the end of summer my problems will be gone. Hope I'm correct.

   Here are a few links.

   http://www.doyourownpestcontrol.com/powderpostbeetles.htm#control

   http://www.agnr.umd.edu/MCE/Publications/Publication.cfm?ID=45&cat=L

   http://www.uky.edu/Agriculture/Entomology/entfacts/struct/ef616.htm

1. 
   6616 | Apr 22, 2005 12:25pm | #12

   Have delt with this problem for years as I buy all my lumber from the saw mill. Haven't tried it yet but have been told that swimming pool cleaner will do the trick. I would try it on a sample peice first through.   Adzman

2. 
   obertRo | Apr 22, 2005 04:40pm | #13

   Thanks to everyone for your help!
   The links from Jellyrug are especially helpful. I never thought about freezing the wood. If I put the wood into bags and into the deep-freezer for a couple days, I won't have to worry about the moisture content change like I would for baking the wood.
   Thanks again!
   Robert

1. 
   Gretchen | Apr 22, 2005 05:02pm | #14

   If you can put it in a freezer then you can put it in double trash bags and set off insecticide bombs inside and leave them tied up for several days.Gretchen

2. 
   tailsorpins | Apr 22, 2005 07:13pm | #15

   To All:

   I have had no success with freezing powder-post beetles, down to 10 below zero --- the lower limit of my chest freezer.  

   I once bought a bunch of 18" wide  5/4 curley maple with minor, but active infestation, quarrantined it outside, drenched it with Orthochlor from a garden sprayer and believe I truly exterminated them.  I wear a dust mask when milling it, do not let the dust settle on my skin, and wash well before eating, and experience no after effects.  I finish with varnishes and lacquer, solvent based, neither of which will halt an active infestation, so I doubt the oil finishes will have much effect on them.

   I regularly use a microwave, 3 minutes on high, to exterminate beetles and borers in otherwise servicable, small dimension complex molding planes, after removing the blades, of course. Works well for turning blanks also.

   John

3. 
   obertRo | Apr 22, 2005 08:55pm | #17

   Thanks John. The microwave idea is perfect! My wood pieces will be small enough to fit, and it makes sense to me that any beetle or egg would fry quite dead :-)The freeze idea is from Jellyrug's 3rd reference:
   "If furniture or art objects in the house are infested but the house is not, the individual items can be treated by professionals in a temporary fumigation vault or, in some cases, placed into a large freezer for a sufficient period to freeze and kill the insects."This is written by Nancy L. Breisch, Ph.D. Research Entomologist, Department of Entomology, University of Maryland. However, I am a little uneasy, about the lack of a recommended freezing temperature or duration.Thanks again. Robert

4. 
   ted | Apr 24, 2005 08:24pm | #18

   I don't know where you live but I used to live in Minnesota and never had a problem with the buggers. We'd get down to - 20 for a week at a time or so. Now I live in Ohio where it seldom gets down to -10 and only for a nite or two when it does. I had an infestation where I had to trash about 5oo bd. ft. :-( once and I learned a hard lesson. Now when I have a log cut up I make sure to have the bark stripped (even though I heard it's better for the air-drying process to leave it on) and I spray it all down with a water based sodium octo-tetraborate solution (boric acid) That way if the bugs munch through the sap wood they'll probably die and prevent further infestation. I also dry all my wood in a screened in porch. Btw, I've also found that powder post beetles aren't the only wood boring insect that'll trash your wet wood. I've had problems with wood wasps, and wood bees too.

5. 
   6616 | Apr 25, 2005 04:37am | #19

   Have recently been told to use a paint roller (1/4" nap) and roll your lumber with swimming pool cleaner. Haven't tied it yet, but plan to.

2. 
   tailsorpins | Apr 21, 2005 09:56pm | #3

   Vacuum up all the dust and watch for activity to be sure.  Mill some of the infested sapwood and look for the critters.

   For the most part, the beetles will initially infest only the sapwood of Walnut, but I have several wall clocks of heartwood that remain infested.  I suspect these 150 year old clocks are sooo very dry, the chemical the beetles dislike has dissipated.  Depending on temp & time of year (daylight duration) they may emerge from their continuous feasting and head for the nearest natural light source .... at which time you find the tiny cones of sawdust beneath the exit hole.  The only way to be sure they are dead, is either chemical or heat, and either must come into contact with them.  Steam/kiln drying temp must reach the center of the stock, or they must contact a surface chemical (like Chlordane) as they exit.  Other chemicals also work, but most of them will seriously stain the wood or affect the way it takes a finish.  Naturally, if you use Chlordane, you must protect yourself from breathing the dust as you machine the treated wood.  After it is finished, there might still be a hazard if children are allowed to chew on the item.  Your oven treatment of small pieces seems reasonable.  Good Luck

   John

1. 
   Jellyrug | Apr 21, 2005 11:15pm | #4

   That's good information.

   How did your clocks get infested, were they stored outside?

   Where did the wall clocks come from?

1. 
   tailsorpins | Apr 22, 2005 07:34pm | #16

   Hello!

   The clocks:  These are Westminster chime wall clocks that came from the basement storage of an active clockmaker(repairer) in central Tennessee, who still has a huge collection.  I suspect they became infested after he piled them down there.  The ones I obtained were in need of replacement case parts, but are otherwise fully operational three spring movements.  He will occasionally part with some of them through an auctioneer in Shelbyville, TN.  During the eight years that I lived near there, I tried to obtain all the "triple-winders", as the locals called them.  I have retained only two .... one oak, the other walnut that looks like you shot it with #11 shot from 30 yards.

   John in Texas

2. 
   cherryjohn | Apr 21, 2005 11:39pm | #5

   I dont know how accurate this is but I read somewhere that if you put a good dose of oil, like Linseed or even Watcos I guess, on the wood it smothers them

    Wicked Decent Woodworks

   (oldest woodworking shop in NH)

   Rochester NH

   " If the women dont find you handsome, they should at least find you handy........yessa!"

1. 
   Jimma | Apr 22, 2005 12:31am | #6

   When this has come up before (check the archives), fumigation was one of the options. For small pieces they could be piggy-backed with bigger items by the fumigation company.

1. 
   tms | Apr 22, 2005 02:05am | #7

   Hey Jim,I was wondering about fumigation. My gut instinct was that it shouldn't hurt the wood any, but I've no experience with fumigating wood. I had some wool rugs fumigated for carpet beatles, and it was quite reasonable. I'm sorry I don't remember the exact amount.If you live in, or near a big city, fumigation should be a pretty cheap option. Here in Seattle, there are two fumigators that stay pretty busy with matresses and blankets donated to the local charities. If they can afford fumigation, then it should be a pretty cheap option for woodworkers. We are at least one step above public assistance, ...aren't we?Tom

1. 
   Jimma | Apr 22, 2005 03:39am | #8

   I don't have any personal experience with fumigation -- just remember several discussions about powder post beatles a while back. What a revolting development to learn the furniture you just delivered is making little sawdust piles on the client's carpet! My daughter, who is a natural history museum director, routinely uses fumigation on objects that come into their collections from the field. Just today in the Wall Street Journal there's a story about bed lice becoming more common in hotels and how difficult it is to control when there are so many people from so many cultures today coming through the states. Pretty hard to get a whole hotel in a fumigation chamber, I guess, or to tent a twenty-storey structure. I would think up there in Seattle you could just drown the things in rainwater.

3. 
   KeithNewton | Apr 22, 2005 06:09am | #9

   Robert, If you are in one of those parts of the country where they have to fumigate a house, they can put your wood in with another job and take care of the little buggers.

   I think the gas is methylene bromide. I did a job out in LaJolla Ca. about 20 years ago and found where the termites were kicking out a frass onto some lumber that I had stored in the garage attic. The exterminator said that this is the same thing that they fumigate bananas with when they come into the country. It will go right into the wood, without leaving any residue. This is not something that you can go out and buy though.

4. 
   olopua | Apr 22, 2005 12:16pm | #11

   I remember reading somewhere that to kill powder post beetles and eggs in small pieces of wood in an oven, use 130 degrees for 8 hrs. I recently had my house tent fumigated for termites and the fumigator told me that for powder post beetles they have to use much higher concentration of the gas "Vikane" than they do for termites. I have used "Diazinon" or "TimBor " ( a borate compound) to prevent infestation in susceptible woods while air drying.