Replies

1. 
   HowardAcheson | Nov 30, 2005 07:38am | #1

   I'm not sure I understand your posting but it sounds like you may have had some cross grain glue joints.  If so, that could be part of the problem.  Maple is a very unstable wood and moves quite a bit with changes in relative humidity.  Cross grain joints will fail when movement occurs.

   Also, maple is a difficult wood to glue.  That's the reason it is generally used when testing adhesives.  If it holds maple together it is a good adhesive.

   Howie.........
1. 
   forestgirl | Dec 03, 2005 03:24am | #3

   "...maple is a difficult wood to glue."  Oh dear, just about to make a jersey case with maple.  Would you anticipate problems using a drawer-lock joint?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   Ramil | Dec 03, 2005 06:54am | #4

   try your regular glue on a test joint and then compare that with another glued with a premium CA glue.  With maple, I use Titebond for edge joints (board to board) and for mortice and tenon, but I suspect the small surface area you're dealing with CA  will do better.

2. 
   HowardAcheson | Dec 03, 2005 08:41pm | #7

   Maple is not a real problem with good glueing techniques.  Howie.........

2. 
   Pondfish | Dec 03, 2005 12:32am | #2

   You may have clamped the pieces too hard and starved the joint.  That will lead to a weak joint. 

   Another problem could be if you sanded the glued part with a very fine grit, you may have burnished the surface, making it impossible for the glue to seep into the wood.  A strong glue joint requires penetration of the glue into the joint.

   Recommending the use of "Hide Signatures" option under "My Preferences" since 2005
1. 
   Handrubbed | Dec 03, 2005 08:28am | #6

   Both of those situations are possible in this instance.

3. 
   DennisS | Dec 03, 2005 07:43am | #5

   VJ -

   What was the temperature in your shop? Heated or no?? Gotta be above 55, preferably much more for Titebond.

   I found out the hard way that temperature really really affects the strength of glue joints regardless of what type of glue you're using.

1. 
   forestgirl | Dec 04, 2005 01:11am | #8

   Dennis, Titebond III gives you a few more degrees -- gotta be above 47*  I figure 50* just for good measure.  That's a few pieces of firewood less than what's needed for TB II, LOL!!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   DennisS | Dec 05, 2005 06:26am | #9

   Jamie -I'm gluing up the ipe shower bench using Weldwood plastic resin glue. In a 38 degree shop!First I cover all the pieces with my trusty queen size electric blanket to let them toast for a few hours to bring everything up to temp. Then I draw some hot water from the tap in the house, quickly run to the shop, mix up the glue and, under a double halogen construction lamp standard for radiant heat apply glue, clamps and so forth, then put the whole assembly 'to bed' under the blankets again. Along with the finished piece I have some scrap material, ipe, glued up and clamped as well. My indoor outdoor thermometer (with the 'outdoor' probe nestled in with the glue-up) is reading anywhere from 75 to 80 degrees. 14+ hours later I retrieve the test pieces and totally ruin the edge on an old chisel splitting them apart.So far so good! But ipe is truely difficult to bond. Sanding all mating surfaces just prior to glue-up seems to have also been a benefit.

1. 
   forestgirl | Dec 05, 2005 09:28am | #10

   Wow, Dennis, you've really gotten the cold-shop-gluing thing down, eh?  Good job.  I'm really disappointed we didn't get the Ipe deck project going this year.  Next year, for sure, I think....   I want to order just a little extra and use it to replace the floor and side panels on our utility trailer.

   What physical characteristic(s) make the Ipe so difficult to glue?  I've never investigated that.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the  "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>) 

1. 
   DennisS | Dec 05, 2005 07:45pm | #11

   This is the first time I've tried gluing ipe, Jamie, so I'm not entirely sure what the issues are. Other than it's extremely dense. And it seems to have an oily feel to it. Not unlike lots of exotics I should think. If I didn't mention it before, a good sanding of mating surfaces just prior to gluing is advisable. I'll try some Titebond on scrap next time I'm in the glue-up process. Methinks epoxy would be mostly important on this stuff it it were truely a case of structural integrity.

2. 
   John_D | Dec 05, 2005 10:14pm | #12

   I've not worked with ipe, but I'm doing some work with pao ferro, and it's oily too.  I was advised to wipe with acetone prior to gluing, to make the bonds better.  It seems to be working... maybe it'll be applicable to ipe too.

3. 
   DennisS | Dec 06, 2005 06:46am | #13

   What type of glue are you useing for the pao ferro, FJ?

4. 
   John_D | Dec 06, 2005 09:04am | #14

   TiteBond I seems to be working well.

   EDIT: My application is not likely to be subjected to any water at all (toy chest).  I think for a shower bench application like that being discussed for the ipe, I would NOT choose TiteBond I!

   Edited 12/6/2005 1:09 am ET by FatherJohn

5. 
   DennisS | Dec 06, 2005 09:54am | #15

   The 'bench' is more a drying off/dressing bench; it's not in the shower proper. None the less, it is a humid environment which is why I used the plastic resin. I've had good luck with it on "regular" woods in the past but this is the first time I've tried gluing the more exotics with it. Plus I don't like the hassle of mixing epoxy unless it's absolutely necessary.