Most of the noise from my tablesaw comes from the actual cutting/ripping of wood as opposed the sound from the motor/blade spinning. I see some of the blades advertised as having noise reduction features such as those squiggly lines cut into the blade. I am using a Freud combination blade – 40 tooth, but was wondering if the advertising hype is just that or whether there are blades out there that are noticeably quiet because of quality or noise reduction features of the blade. Thanks, Tom
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Replies
Sounds like you're trying to avoid bothering others with the noise, right? If you're ripping, a rip blade should be quieter, even though it would be nice to have one blade that does most operations. A dedicated blade is usually going to be better at what it's designed for.
The Freud blades I have are about the quietest of any I have used. My WWII has been hanging on a nail for about ten years. It was really noisy but the newer ones are advertised to be quieter.
Those "squiggly lines" cut into the blade are meant to reduce distortion from heat, but they also reduce noise. Hold your Freud blade with just your finger through the hole and tap it lightly with a hammer. You will hear a dull "clunk". Tap a solid blade and it will ring like a bell.
Hi Tom - I've used alot of good blades, some with, some without the noise and vibration reduction features, and there are excellent examples of blades with and without. I honestly can't say as though it makes a whole lot of difference one way or the other....nothing that draws my attention anyway, since I tend to not pay any attention to the sound level. Some might be a "little" louder but are fairly quiet overall compared to tools like the planer and router. Plus I run my DC at the same time so it really masks whatever benefit there might actually be. I wear ear protection most of the time regardless.
My advice...buy a jhigh quality blade that fits the budget, compliments the saw, and suits the task...if it has noise reduction great, if not, great.... cut wood, be happy!
Edited 8/21/2007 9:31 am ET by Knotscott
Tom,
The primary purpose of the laser cut slots in Freud blades is vibration reduction to improve the cut quality. A side benefit of reducing the vibration is reducing noise.
Freud America, Inc.
Edited 8/21/2007 7:47 am ET by CharlesM
Charles,
Can't those fancy slots also make the blade whistle? I've a couple blades (dunno the make) whose singing positively make your ears hurt if you aren't wearing muffs, before the wood ever touches the blade.
Ray
Ray,Singing in the blade is primarily caused by improper tensioning and/or the air movement produced by the gullets reacting in the saw cabinet or guard. A large slot in the blade body could potentially cause this but is less likely. The anti-vibration slots we use are very narrow and are filled with a special resin so no wind is produced by them.
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
Ray,
I've a couple blades (dunno the make) whose singing positively make your ears hurt
Those blades go in the tablesaw, not on your turntable! Also, were you playing them at 45 or 33 1/3 RPM? They sound best at 78!
Regards,
Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Edited 8/21/2007 10:39 am ET by KiddervilleAcres
Edited 8/21/2007 10:40 am ET by KiddervilleAcres
"Those blades go in the tablesaw, not on your turntable! Also, were you playing them at 45 or 33 1/3 RPM? They sound best at 78!"Now that's just plain dumb. Those things have no grooves, so you have to play them back in your CD player. ;)
BruceT
Bob,
Wait...Diana Ross' "Theme from 'Mahogany' " doesn't play at 3450 rpm?
Ray
Ray & BruceT,
Too funny!
As I like to say, a little nonsense now and then is relished by the wisest men.
Best Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
They do sound best on a turntable, especially if your preamp and amplifier stages are vacuum tube! ;)
K-scott,
I think Ray might have carved an acanthus leaf into his blade and that's what is causing the screaming!? These old farts just have to tinker you know.......
I'll lone him my B&O turntable and all should be well. Now if he needs the Macintosh 60's vintage receiver that's another matter.
Regards,Bob @ Kidderville Acres
A Woodworkers mind should be the sharpest tool in the shop!
Macintosh is better known for computer gear and the principles of the company were in high school in the 60's. McIntosh on the other hand, now you're talk'in.
Solid state fan myself, but I never heard a Mc I did'nt like!------------------------------------
It would indeed be a tragedy if the history of the human race proved to be nothing more than the story of an ape playing with a box of matches on a petrol dump. ~David Ormsby Gore
Bob,
Not an acanthus leaf, but Scott Joplin's "Maple Leaf Rag". Sadly, it turns yellow and falls off the blade every autumn...
"She's broke, thats oak, that's why the lady has a clamp."
I own several Freud blades, all of them served me well. My problem is finding someone who can sharpen them and restore to new conditions. Other companies manufacture and service (sharpen and recondition) their blades. Why Freud does not offer such a service.
John Cabot
John,
Freud offers a sharpening service for their new P410 blade. The address is: Freud Sharpening, 2004 Bancroft Street, Charlotte, NC 28206. Perhaps they will also sharpen blades other than the 410?
While on the subject of Freud blades, the new P410 is a winner.
-Nazard
I would like to get a Fusion for my Hammer slider when the 12"/300mm blades are available. Do you cut mostly hardwoods and what do you like about the blade?
Life is what happens to you when you're making other plans .
I would like to get a Fusion for my Hammer slider when the 12"/300mm blades are available. Do you cut mostly hardwoods and what do you like about the blade?
Jerry,
<!----><!----> <!---->
I cut a variety of stuff: hard and softwoods, and also sheet goods. A while back I came by a few sheets of Chinese birch ply that was by far the worst of its kind. The stock blade that originally came on my Unisaw whacked up that Chinese crap like a chainsaw. Bad tear out and chipping. The Fusion blade, however, produced glass smooth cuts with no tear out. I’ve had similar results with everything that I have cut with the new blade. It’s a very good saw blade.
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Best!
<!----> <!---->
-Nazard
John,There are actually not many manufacturers that offer sharpening services and most of them are smaller US companies - some of which started with sharpening before they began manufacturing. All of our carbide tools are manufactured in Italy and our US facility is primarily for distribution and power tool repair. Any quality sharpening service should be able to bring an undamaged/un-abused blade back to like new performance. The service center that Nazard mentioned is one that is recommended by Freud but is not a Freud company. If you would like the name of a sharpener that will do quality work you can call Freud at (800) 334-4107 and our customer service reps will assist in finding one for you.
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
Charles, as always, thanks for your contributions to the general knowledge.
I was playing dental hygienist today, and cleaning the teeth on a Diablo 1080X, and noticed that the vibration slots are not completely clear. I grabbed a glue-line rip blade, and noticed that the slots also are not completely clear. Before I grab the dental floss and air compressor nozzle, I thought I should ask whether they are supposed to be clear, or whether some type of compound is put into the slots at the factory.
Thanks in advance.
Bob
Bob, read post 37306.8.
Life is what happens to you when you're making other plans .
DOH! (As I knock most of the few remaining hairs off my forhead.) I had to have read that post 3 or 4 days ago, and it apparently went in one eye and out the other. Thanks for politely pointing out what should have been obvious to me. Give yourself 10,000 bonus points, another life, and promotion to the next level, PacMan. (< o o
"That's it man, game over man, game over!" --Hudson
Aliens (1986)
Bob,I'm glad that JerryPacMan was around over the weekend to help. Definitely leave the resin in the grooves.
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
Charles, thanks for the kind words, do I get a small portion of last weeks paycheck? Seriously do you know if the 12" Fusion is available as I would like to get one for my Hammer slider.
Life is what happens to you when you're making other plans .
A small portion of MY paycheck wouldn't be worth the stamp to mail!The P412 has an ETA of mid-October and you can pre-order through our dealers.
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
My understanding re: quiet blades--
the quiet blades have variable pitch teeth, The teeth are not all the same distance from each other, so there is no regular harmonic disturbance.
My craftsman TS came with a Leitz variable pitch blade. A pretty nice combo blade and it did not "sing".
I apologize if this does not make sense or I'm just parroting back advertising B.S.--it's all I got.
peace, mark
Mark,The varied tooth spacing is used primarily by Leitz who only claims that they are low noise, not that they cut better or last longer. The Freud anti-vibration is accomplished by cutting dampening slots in the blade plate. The advantage of evenly spaced teeth is that the chip load and gullet size is the same on all tips.
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
HiI don't think I speak only for myself when I say that I appeciate the input of an expert in these threads concerning blades. However, I can't help but take it all with a grain of salt when the poster signs their posts with the name of a major company with interest in getting woodworkers to buy their (IMHO very nice) product. On the other hand, kudos to you for being up front about your affiliation. It lends an air of honesty and respectability. I haven't seen any posts from other major manufacturers communicating directly with their buying public. So thanks for that.The original question was about noise not anti-vibration (or am I showing my ignorance by seperating these as different issues?) In your opinion, is Leitz' "claim" of lower noise wrong or over-stated?I guess my question is: what makes a blade "sing", whir, yell, etc.?peace,
mark
Mark,Thank you for the support. You are correct that the original post was about noise reduction. My first response was to indicate that for Freud blades the noise reduction is a side benefit of our anti-vibration design. The blades with varied tooth spacing that I have tested are effective at reducing noise but the chip load is not consistent. Also, as the poster above noted, they are not as straight forward to sharpen. All blades produce some noise but in regards to blades that sing, this is usually the result of the tensioning of the blade being incorrect and setting up vibration in the blade or of the air produced by the gullets interacting with the saw to make a whistle.
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
Bear with me while I go into Mommy mode.... The real solution is to use ear muffs. I keep a set of muffs and glasses at every machine that needs it. Well, at least with in reaching distance.
The way the quieter blades work is by breaking up the spacing between teeth. Some are close and some are futher. They have in general gotten good reviews. One big issue for me, and most pros, is that my sharpening service cant sharpen them. They have to be done manually and most shops around here use automated machines.
Pardon my spelling,
Mike
Make sure that your next project is beyond your skill and requires tools you don't have. You won't regret it.
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