All,
I’m starting to play with my 2.5″ raised panel bit in my 3.25 hp router. I’ve got the speed turned down (10,000 rpm) but not sure how to set up the router table to feed the stock. For instance, do you set the depth of cut (say 1.5″, etc.) with the fence and then raise the bit in successive cuts to the desired profile? Or do you position the bit to allow the stock to contact the bearing and raise the bit with successive cuts to the desired profile.
It seems that if I use the first technique I may get a raised field that is too strong and conversely, no raised field at all using the other approach.
I’m wondering how you with experience do it. thanks
Discussion Forum
Get It All!
UNLIMITED Membership is like taking a master class in woodworking for less than $10 a month.
Start Your Free TrialCategories
Discussion Forum
Digital Plans Library
Member exclusive! – Plans for everyone – from beginners to experts – right at your fingertips.
Highlights
-
Shape Your Skills
when you sign up for our emails
This site is protected by reCAPTCHA and the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Service apply. -
Shop Talk Live Podcast -
Our favorite articles and videos -
E-Learning Courses from Fine Woodworking
-
-
Replies
If you are going to cut to the full profile of the bit, it doesn't matter whether you move the fence, the bit, or both. The type of lumber will tell you by the cut, how much to advance the depth. On the stile and rail cutters, you have to set the height and move the fence. On panel raisers, I normally set the fence and raise the bit.
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
hammer1,
Thanks. I'm especially concerned with the end grain and think your suggestion of lifting the cutter is the only way. However, it's a five inch opening across and I'm thinking I'll need to use a well supported miter guage to hold the stock. Is that how you would do it?
Don't depend on the bearing for guidance, move the fence over the bit with its face a tiny bit forward of the bearing edge, that way you have a large stable surface to guide the panel.
John White, Shop Manager, Fine Woodworking Magazine
Some tips.
Routerman,
Thanks. The last line of your tips was a killer...I better get out my hacksaw...lol. I like the idea of the 1/4" lifts but for the end grain position I'd need perfectly flat 1/4" panels large enough to support the stock and I'd still be facing a rather large opening....but it may turn out to be the only safe way...I'll experiment.
I use zero clearance faces attached to my primary fence. I set up everythng for the final cut, attach a stopblock behind and against one end of the fence. Then I privot that end of the fence out away from the stop block. This allows me to control how much material is removed in each pass. The final pass is made with the fence back against the stop block.
I also use this: http://www.benchdog.com/panelloc.htm. This guard keeps the panel against the table and your fingers well away from the bit. Well worth the money, imho.
I could'nt agree with you more, I love the benchdog panel loc system ,for safety it can't be beat. After all the panels I've run I can still count to ten. It also helps flatten down panels when doing end grains if you have a little bow in your wood. I would recommend it to anyone.
Paul
Hi BG ,
A most accurate and consistent method I use , set the ht. to leave the 1/4" or ? for the groove . I use feather boards for hold downs .
With the bit in the correct ht. as has been referred to earlier just pivot the fence .That way the ht . is always correct .
The actual profile can be cut by pivoting then fence while cutting through a sacrificial face , could be 1/4"-1/2" typically give you cleaner cuts as in zero clearance .
I use this method with shapers for raised panels and the router table for other details .
If your panel thickness is consistent they will all fit the same into the stiles and rails .
hope this helps dusty
Edited 3/26/2007 10:35 pm ET by oldusty
I tend to err on the side of caution... the first series of cuts I normally have the bit raised little more than 5-6mm, the bearing recessed well inside the fence, gradually withdrawing the fence with subsequent passes until the stock's barely touching the bearing. Beyond that point, I raise the bit in roughly 2-3mm stages.
Remember to cut end grain before long grain....
Mike Wallace
Stay safe....Have fun
Wow, thanks to all,
I'm getting the jist of this thing....zero clearance fence, swing fence perhaps with stop blocks, hold downs or bulldog add-on, about the only option is beginning cutter height (full or sneek up). Ive got about a half dozen poplar boards to go play with and experiment. I really appreciate the insights.
I made some doors today and took a few pictures. The first thing I do is mill and cut my stiles and rails to size. It helps if the pieces are flat and straight. I lay them out to choose the best face and try to arrange and mark them so that I can cut with the grain direction, when I cut the bead portion. #1The cope cut is the more difficult, I cut it first. I'm pretty low tech with my jigs, usually grabbing the closest piece of scrap. I make a zero clearance fence by drilling a hole back from the edge and cut a slot large enough for the bearing on the cope bit to fit through. I clamp a backer scrap to the fence and feed the router bit through the fence. The backer prevents blowing out a hunk of the fence. The tight fence won't allow the work to be pulled into the bit. If I didn't have a zero clearance fence, I'd wan't a sled that could clamp the work. #2I make small incremental cuts. I made four passes to cut the 7/16" copes. It's quicker to make an extra pass or two than to have to remake a piece. I use a blocks that are square as a backer and guide for cutting the cope. Hold the piece tight to the block and push by the bit. #3 The block prevents blow out also. I've found that you should turn the backer blocks for a fresh face every cut. If you don't you may get a little blow out as in picture #4.On raised panels, I use a similar backer block if the panel is narrow. With cope and bead cutters, you have to set the correct height and move the fence. With panel raising bits, I'll often move both the fence and adjust the bit height as I make incremental cuts. I think it's a little easier on the router, the bit and the work, not to be fully engaging the cutter as you would by raising the height only. You can't do this if the panel raiser has a back cutter. After the first pass, the backer won't help with blow out. It just serves as a "miter gauge" to guide the work, but you don't have to worry about setting the fence in line with a miter gauge. When you shape the panel, start on the end grain and work your way around the panel counterclockwise. The next cut will remove any blow out from the previous cut and the last cut will be on the long grain.If you have a new set of bits and haven't tried them out yet, get some scrap and go through the sequence. You will need to know how the profiles fit and how much to allow for the joint. Nice slow, controlled feeding helps keep things smooth and eliminates extra hand work. Don't try to take too small a cut, about 1/8" at a time is fine. Hope this helps.
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
Hammer1,
First of all, very nice doors, is that a quarter sawn ply panel? Second, thanks for the pictures.
If I may, a few questions:
It appears you cut the cope on the rail before the bead, is that correct?
Given that the cope is done in one pass, do you keep the cutter speed at the lower (ie. 10000 rpm) or do you jack it back up?
If you were doing M&T joints, do you just eliminate the cope step...and would you cut the beads before the tenons or vice versa?...and any thoughts on how to execute the 45's in the corners...Norm uses the TS..I'm a little confused by the picture with the clamps. It kinda looks like the clamps would be in the way and I'm not sure what they are doing. thanks for your thoughts
The plywood is plain sliced but the backside is quarter sawn, just by accident. It looks like leopard skin but this cabinet has to match some existing ones. Too bad I have to put the prettiest face inside. I cut the cope as well as all the other cuts a little at a time. You can't raise the bit with this cut, so you have to move the fence. The picture shows the cope after making four passes to cut it completely. I don't cut it in one shot.Because the bit can pull the cope cut in, I make a zero clearance fence. This means that I cut a hole in the fence that matches the profile of the bit. To do that, you move the fence into the bit. This will cause the edge of the fence to burst out and you won't get a nice clean hole. In order to cut a clean hole, I temporarily clamp a piece of scrap to the fence as I make the cut. The scrap then gets removed. Now I can move the fence in or out and only the cutting portion of the bit sticks through the fence. Making fences that fit your bit can be useful on other types of cuts. It can improve safety as well as helping get the best quality cuts. That's the only reason I showed that picture, I think it's important. The reason I cut the cope first is because you can get blow out on the cross grain cut, even with a backer. If I do get blow out, I can remove it when I cut the bead. It also gives me straight, square edges to put a backer block against. If I cut the bead first, I couldn't use a backer block to help prevent the tear out, not unless the backer was coped to fit the bead. If I was making full length tenons, not the "stub" variety you get with router bits, I would run the beads first, there are no copes. Where the rail meets the stile, the bead on the stile (vertical piece) will have to be removed where the rails comes in contact, and the corner of the bead gets cut on a 45°. This isn't an easy cut. You will have to cut back the bead and make the little 45° on both right and left pieces. You need to stop the cut precisely as well as have a straight cut for a good fit. To get the cut to stop where you want it to, you can either use a band saw or raise the blade on the table saw. The band saw will stop straight up and down. With the table saw, you will have a little left to finish by hand. I think I get a straighter cut with the table saw. It's a stop and back out cut, so you have to be on the ball. When I cut the little 45° on the beads, I often use the miter bar on the table saw and set the blade height so that it just misses the shoulder on the rail or stile. This may take just a small connecting cut with a knife or chisel to finish the cut. Some will make a guide for the chisel and cut everything by hand. It takes extra care to get things to fit correctly. I spent many years with a single speed router. We didn't know that high speeds were potentially dangerous and used large cutters at full tilt. Today, I run the bits to get the best cut. I like to run them as slow as I can just to cut down on noise. You can run a 3" panel raiser at 16,000RPMs. Bits like cope and rails can be run at 20,000. For the most part, I go by the feel of the cut and the visual results. Running a 3" bit at 10,000 can feel like you are hacking with an axe. You have to go very slow and take a very light cut at that speed. I prefer to go faster. I think it's a matter of the cut and adjusting the speed accordingly, within limits.As time goes by, you will find methods that suit you for the work at hand. You will also get to know your router bits and what makes them work the best. For example, on the doors I pictured, the bead will come to a sharp edge at the groove. With many species, especially red oak, this will cause splinters right where you would see them. I've learned with this particular bit, that I don't want to go to the full cut depth, against the bearing. Keeping the fence back just a touch leaves the edge slightly blunt and eliminates that problem. I don't like the cope cut to touch the bearing either. This is only because it interferes with smooth feeding. If the work rubs on the bearing, it just feels different and wants to scoot a bit. Don't be afraid to experiment, there is always more than one way to accomplish a task.
Beat it to fit / Paint it to match
hammer1,
Just want you to know your comments are appeciated. I've poured over your thoughts several times as I'm setting up and making modifications to my router fence, etc. It appears cutting the 45's with full tenons will be a white knuckler regardless.
I find a rough cut on the table saw helps a lot. Make one of those upright jigs, and take off most of the wood on the table saw. Once you get the setup all done, they only take a couple minutes or less per panel. This hugely cuts back the amount of stock you have to remove, which reduces the amount of work for the router. I started doing this when I realized I was getting, like 5 gallons of huge shavings per panel.
Piccioni,
Yes, I'll be using my tennon jig to precut the panel most likely. I add a couple of clamps and add a backer board to the jig...works well. I need to first determine how much stock to remove and its relationship to the curve, etc.
you can always tape the edges, wont that reduce splintering and tearout? using the tennoning jig really speed it up and depending on the level of quality the customer wants I have made raised panels with just the tennoning jig and a cove bit on the router. a little sanding to ease the edges and I am done. I very rarely use a panel bit and only for a specific detail.
If you use your table saw to remove as much of the material in advance you should not have a problem doing your cuts in one pass.
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled