Is there a concensus for which manufacturer is best?? Amana? Whiteside? Bosch? CMT? Freud? Other? What do you “guys” think is there one or maybe two that stand above the rest??
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Replies
Concensus?! You've got to be kidding! <g>
I've been very pleased with the Freud bits I have. CMT and Whiteside certainly get good reviews from users here. I was disappointed with two different Amana bits, but am stopping short of criticizing them since a couple people who do pretty serious work have had them perform quite well.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Whiteside and Freud are the best I've used....
A couple of years ago, I bought a "Whiteside" bit to make novelty siding for a barn. I made 2000 sq. ft. of siding that is the equivalent of nearly a mile of cuts in red pine. I took it to be sharpened and the guy looked at and asked if I had used the bit at all. Not bad!!!
"Best" means different things to different people.
I would feel comfortable buying the first four brands you mentioned -- but I am less partial to Freud -- but even that is a vague perception, rather than a firm position based on fact.
I end up buying a lot of bits from Eagle -- but only because they have profiles that no one else makes (or at least no one I have found). they are decent, medium priced bits -- but I certainly wouldn't put them in any "best" class.
On the cheap end, MLCS are favored by many -- particularly for bits that you will use infrequently or for short runs.
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"I tend to live in the past because most of my life is there."
-- Herb Caen (1916-1997)
Some perspective on best.
mikemd,
I have been extremely happy with Whiteside, Freud, MLCS, and Amana.
As far as which is best, I don't think there's a simple answer here.
Whiteside would come out on top for longevity. However, that's not all there is to it when it coms to router bits. Woodcraft carries Whitesie bits, which means they are accessible, and I have two Woodcraft stores near me. Still, I often can't find the bit I'm looking for at either store.
Freud bits are great also, very reliable. Freud makes some larger straight bits that come in handy for me. You can purchase Freud bits at Sears, Woodcraft, and Amazon. But again, I often find it difficult to locate the one I need.
MLCS bits are also terrific, roughly equal to Freud in my opinion. I disagree that MLCS bits are low quality. They are less expensive, which I think leads a lot of people to assume they aren't as good, but this is misleading. The thing that often puts MLCS above Whiteside and Freud for me is that they have a great selection, always available through an online catalog. Here's a link to the MLCS Web site:
http://www.mlcswoodworking.com/
Amana bits are also very good quality, again about equal to Freud and MLCS. Some of the Amana bits are more expensive than the other ones I mentioned, and some are three or even four times the price of an equivalent MLCS bit, or even Freud. But sometimes Amana makes a bit that I don't see with other manufacturers. I buy mine from Coastal Tool. Here's a link:
http://www.coastaltool.com/cgi-bin/SoftCart.exe/a/ab/aman/router-bits.htm?L+coastest+mlbk7634ff36c136+1123244821
There used to be a line of bits sold at Home Depot called Oldham Viper, and they were great, but they are no longer available. Don't believe the Home Depot people who tell you those Porter+Cable bits are the same. I learned the hard way that they are not! Actually, if anyone knows where Oldham Viper bits are being sold these days, if at all, please let me know.
Here is a link to an article Fine Woodworking did, ranking 17 brands of router bits. Make sure to check the link to the "Router-bit scorecard" mentioned in the article:
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00045.asp
So as you can see, it's not as simple as which one is "best." I do a lot of router work in my shop, and I have adopted a strategy of using all four of these brands as resources, depending on how fast I need the bit and which profile I need at the time.
Edited 8/4/2005 9:10 am ET by Matthew Schenker
"...if anyone knows where Oldham Viper bits are being sold these days...." I think Oldham went belly-up or got bought out or something, didn't they? If this is not true, someone tell me and I'll delete this post.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hi Jamie,Maybe this article will clear it up:
http://www.mountaintimes.com/mtweekly/2004/1028/oldham.php3
Charles M
Freud America, Inc.
I am absolutely shocked Black and Decker would take a good product (Oldham), close that down, sell a cheap knock off.
You have to shake your head at a company that will stop making a good product that has respect and opt instead for a joe home owner quality line. I was a fan of porter cable but because of B&D track record of revamping products, I seriously doubt I'll be buying anything Delta or PC in the near future. Can anything upset you more than buying a POS tool? The moment your using it and find out its a POS is tough.
I have been pleased with CMT and use them because I live near the Japan Woodworker store. Have used Eagle bits when a profile I wanted was not made by CMT. After looking at the bits in the whiteside and Eagle catolog I think that some of the Eagle bits maybe made by whiteside, The stair rail bits I looked at were the same in there catolog. For what its worth the stair rail bits from Eagle worked really well.
Troy
Once more - what is best depends on what you are doing, how much money you have to spend and a host of other factors.
I have some Freud and am happy with them
I also have some (rabbet and dado) from Infinity that I really like (and they claim to be American Made)
I have seen good posts for Whiteside and CMT but have not owned any of them
Anyone have experience with the Rockler and Woodcraft bits?
"Anyone have experience with the Rockler and Woodcraft bits?" I've used one Rockler bit and chipped (actually, fractured) the carbide. Probably my fault -- I was routing a through slot in a piece of oak and I think I either tried to go in the wrong direction or I just didn't keep the right control. Everything went flying, including a healthy piece of carbide. I tend to think most Rockler stuff is overpriced.
I have a handful of Woodcraft bits and they're pretty OK. The bearings don't seem as substantial as those on more expensive bits. Haven't used them extensively enough to testify about longevity, but they've produced a good surface.
If I were starting all over again, I'd get one of the big MLCS or Woodline sets, and then as the most-often-used bits wore out I'd replace them with Freud or Whiteside.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I swear by woodline. best bits for the money anywhere. great guaranty and customer service. Just ordered a mini panel bit 28 bucks plus 3.75 shipping. ya cant beat that. Even if it goes bad and I have to buy 2 more its still cheaper than some of the others Buckism: Will show you the the way
I bought a pack of router bits from Woodcraft - their branded line...
The 1/2" straight bit chipped on the second pass of a large cutting job. I mark that up to neanderthal router use and defective carbide. Replaced with a 3/4" Bosch and didn't have any other problems (no change in technique, mind you).
The rest of the profiles have been pretty good. My guess is if you pull a set of bits out every once in a while for profile work, etc, the Woodcraft are a good deal. For closer to regular use, they probably would be lacking to the task.
I do ALOT of routing.. AND I use ALOT of cheeeper bits.. I love cheap..For most I find them OK.. Not a Whiteside.. BUT satisfactory for what I payed for them... For most uses you will never notice...
I'm on record for supporting Ridge Carbide (Liberty) bits. On par with Whiteside, but I like them mostly because I can drive 45 minutes to their factory and select from over 1500 different bits and get a discount (and yes, that's hard to do without wetting your pants!)
I stay away from cheap bits as a rule. Too damn risky to use, in my opinion. Unless you consider that 10 fingers means "three plus seven spares." Grizzly bits break, CMT bits go dull faster than others I use. Never tried MLCS.
Thought I'd provide a few links:
Eagle America
MLCS
RouterBits.com (Whiteside source)
Woodline
I picked up a solid carbide Woodline straight bit at the show last spring, much better price than others I'd seen, and it has worked well in walnut, oak and alder.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Here is Infinity's address:
http://www.infinitytools.com
They also make a nice dado blade that has gotten some good reviews and which when I need to replace my Freus set I will look into more.1 - measure the board twice, 2 - cut it once, 3 - measure the space where it is supposed to go 4 - get a new board and go back to step 1
Mike,
I read most if not all of this post and do not believe that anyone mentioned Lee Valley bits. I own about 35 of their bits. I also have about 16 Whiteside's, 12 of which are either up or down-cut carbide spirals. I have half-a-dozen Oldham's which, if the size is correct, I use for the roughing, then switch to another brand for the finishing work.
From my experience, Lee Valley makes a very good bit. And, one thing I also like about LV is that included with each bit is a unique molded plastic holder which is screwed down and holds you bit very securely. Because of this I no longer have to drill holes all over a sacrificial board only to realize later that this is a never ending chore. With the LV holders all you have to do is unscrew the holder and move it where you want it. I realize that this has nothing to do with the performance of the bit, but is something that I appreciate in addition to getting good value in a router bit.
I've attached two images in case you're interested.
Regards,
Phillip
Phillip, I have one (or is it 2?) LV bits, just haven't used them enough to testify about them yet. Nice cut, though, and good prices. I like the holders too!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hi, Jamie,Nice to hear from you.I use my LV cutters nearly every day. And I cannot tell you how many router bit holders I have drilled which only survived until the next order of bits arrived. What a waste of time and wood. But happily, this is no longer the case with these wonderful bit holders from LV. In addition, - and I think that we both know this personally - their Customer Service Department rep's have no peer in the wood working industry. If I send them an email, I can bank on them responding in less than 24 hours which usually is the same day. Now for some old business. If you recall, I was having band saw tire problems awhile back. Well, I'm happy to tell you that the 3M adhesive that I purchased has more than done the job. This adhesive is '3M Fast Tack 8031' and it performs great. This adhesive was designed for adhering bicycle tires to their rims. So, if this subject comes up in the future, we can pass this on.Take care and have a great day.Regards,
Phillip
Gotcha, Phillip, I've bookmarked your post for future bandsaw tire reference! Glad to hear your worries (in that department) are over.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I've use Whiteside and Freud (A+ for Freud customer service) long life and crispness from both. I'm a believer that you generally get what you pay for.
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