I was talking with a sales person recently about some possible router choices for a table that I am making. I am looking at two Porter Cable models because of the good luck that I have had with PC in the past. The two that I am looking at are the PC7518(fixed base) and PC7539(plunge). Both are 3 1/4 HP 5 speed models. This sales person has given me a lot of good information in the past so his particular response to my question caught me a little off guard. He stated, very emphatically, that the PC7518 was the only choice between the two models. He could not give me any supporting information though. I am the first to admit that I do not know everything about the craft but I thought that because the router is mounted under the work surface that the latter would be a better choice for bit/height changes. I am just wondering if I am missing something? Thanks in advance for any information that you all can provide.
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Replies
american woodworker march of this year has a big section on routers, your model isn't in it but there is another one you might look at!!
yooper
Ditto Tom's idea with the router-raizer. If you can afford or warrant it from large usuage, this thing makes life a snap. I'm not sure why they cost that much. I have a little problem with the fact it cost as much as a router or good compound mitre saw as a few examples.
Again, good luck...
sarge..jt
They cost that much because this is the age of instant gratification. People do not even want to sand past 100 grit any more, etc. etc. You get my point, right?
Have a good day. The above is just a "soap box" comment.
dick
On that I agree. I really find it interesting how much things have changed in just 30 years since I started WW. The hand tools don't have the dominance as back then. I saw the power tools start to creep strongly on the market in the late 60's and they most definitely dominate at this point.
Funny how I have seen people buy a new tool when they have a satisfactory one because the new one has a new gimmick added. Seems the manufactures are aware of that point. Same thing in womens clothing, fishing gear and a host of other things. Today's is not good enough for tomorrow. Guess we'll catch a bigger fish or look better in that new and improved model.
BTW, I assume you built the soapbox with traditional tried and tested joints and sanded beyond 100. ha..ha..
Have a great evening...
sarge..jt
You forgot gimmicks with golf clubs and around the house hang it/store it items. I must admit that I have spent some money on gimmicks. The lesson learned is to call the catalog store and talk to the techies prior to deciding to buy or not.
The area that I believe has improved a lot are some of the hi-tech ergonomic safety devices. Lots of good router table items and my favorite is the International Orange Push Stick. Not only is it made well but it fits your hand and gives confidence while on the table saw. Note, I said confidence, not over confidence.
Have a good evening. dick
dick
I like the push sticks also. Being a po boy, I usually make my own with various tips. I custom the handles to fit my hand. I cut the outline an the BS, then carve the reliefs for my hand. Sand them to about 280 (ha..ha..) and I'm ready. My furniture is crappy, but those push sticks are first class. he....
Take care Dick and regards...
sarge..jt
woodmike
I think he was implying that the old rule of thumb was a fixed base makes a better table mount than a plunge. This info was probaly passed to him from his various customers who are WW. Sounds like if he couldn't give you a reason why, this logic might be sound.
I personally think the Hitachi M12V 3 1/2 HP is the best suited plunge for a table mount. At $194 with the height adjuster, it's a big bang for the buck. Milwaukee and the Bosch 1619EVS are also good candidates as they have a way to adjust height through the top of the table without removing the insert with router attached.
I suggest going to http://www.toolcrib.com (amazon supplier) and look at the various routers available and click the customer reviews. Then make a decision based on your home-work.
Good luck and any questions, squeeze the trigger... ha..ha.
sarge..jt
Sarge and others,
Thanks so much for all of the good information. This forum has always been a great source of information because of people like you all. Thanks again...
woodmike
Good luck with the decision and let us know what direction you went and how it worked out.
sarge..jt
Just got the new milwaukee for my home built table and love it. easy changes. My question to you is why so much HP? If your making cabinet doors all day I'de say ya 3 1/4 is right. But for everyday stuff 2-2 1/4.(12 amps) is more than sufficient. More is not neccesarily better or economically sound. Brian
PS- how are the kids Sarge?
Brian
Yes, 2 HP is sufficient in most situations. The 3 HP plus give you all the ability you need if you do hardwoods, thick and run constantly. They are just there if you need it to not overwork the smaller horse.
Same with variable speed. If you don't run big panel raising bits which have to run at slower speed to be efficeint, variable is really not required.
Have a good day...
sarge..jt
I'm struggling with the same thing exactly. I got the plans for Norm's router table and am in the process of building it but I am stuck on the choice of routers. The reviews I've read on the PC7518 are that it is a work horse but with no spindle lock, bit changes require two wrenches. this is a problem I don't like with my current router table. Changing bits is a knuckle buster.
Plunge routers under the table seem like they could be hard to adjust the hieght. The Bosch 1619EVS has a disable feature to the plunge spring specifically for this application.
For me the Triton seems too new and I don't like the fact that the on/off switch is tied to the spindle lock suach that an external power switch can't be used.
I think the Rockler solution, although expensive, of using a Router Raizer and the PC75182 motor (the same motor as used in the 7518) might be the best option. This allows for height adjustment from above the table as well as above the table bit changes as the height range allows adjusting the collet above the table. The use of the PC75182 motor also gives the power and reliability of the 7518 router. It still requires two wrenches but a bit simpler above the table.
TDF
I have heard this about using only using fixed base routers in a router table and I don't understand it. I have a Makita 3hp plunge router mounted in a router table and it has served me well for 15 years. I have built everything from shelves to a corner cupboard with this and it hasn't failed me yet. I have a knob extension for the depth control and other than occasionaly haveing to clean the sawdust out it works just fine. Stick with the plunge router as you are talking infintesimal if any difference between a fixed base router. It is not hard to change the depth.
Wharever router you buy, I can only offer one piece of advice. Bigger is better. You want enough power to handle the larger router bits that you will ultimately want to use
Edited 2/12/2003 7:07:44 AM ET by WARRENSPAHR
Pat Warner (his site is http://www.patwarner.com) is an advocate for the fixed base router in a table because in a plunge router, the motor cannot be removed from the base. You have to mount the whole thing in the table, and so you must have some way to access the router to change bits. This leads to router table inserts which, he maintains, cause flatness problems with the router tabletop. Don't know if that's actually true in practice because i have the 7518 mounted in my table with no insert. For me, simple is always better.
If you're interested in routers, Pat's site is definitely worth a look.
Peace,
kevin
Put my vote in the plunge column. I have had a Bosch 1611 mounted in a table since it was new. I can't recall ever removing it to use handleld, but I am sure I must have. I built a wooden device to assist with raising it, based on a lever principle. The weight and the spring (or even the weight alone) makes it a snap. Today, I would think in terms of one that could be height adjusted from the top, but mine just won't wear out. There is a picture of it somewhere on this forum, but I can't recall the thread. SEarch me as a poster and you may find it.
My swithch is permanently stuck in the on position. I use it with a switched receptacle. This works fine in my own basement, but I don't invite others to use it. Sort of wish teh 1611 would break. Must be about 10 years old.
Take a look at the new Milwaukee 3.5hp router that is designed for table use. It has everything the PC has plus a few refinements. Turning a knob on top for height adjustment and all bit changes are done on top of the table, not bending over underneath.
Good Luck in whichever you choose,
Lar
The old rule of thumb was fixed base for the table. Pat Warner has a legitimate argument about the flatness if you don't re-inforce the table-top properly, especially around the insert. I have an insert which gives me quick access to the router for changes. I also built a cabinet with doors that open for access for hieght adjustment. Works for me.
In three years my table-top is as flat as the day I built it. I have a tendency for over-kill and it is heavily re-inforced. In case of all-out war, I built it so our Armed Forces can use the top for an emergency runway for fighter jets in case theirs are knocked out. ha..ha..
Lar mentioned the Milwaukee. The features he mentioned make it an excellent candidate for a table mount. I would definitely consider. I use a Hitachi M12V plunge underneath and it is dedicated to the table. It is relatively simple to adjust and it has kick hinny power with variable speed for bigger bits. If you are going to run bigger bits, the varialble is a must.
Point being, if you use an insert definitely re-inforce. Also consider a building a cabinet as it reduces noise and I sectioned off the top to catch sawdust and that allows the bottom to be used for router related items.
Have a look and good day...
sarge..jt
Mighty pretty cabinet Sarge!!!
Lar
Lar
Thanks...
All
If you are gonna push large panel raising bits you need variable speed. They are designed to run low rpm.
sarge..jt
It seems like the companies (Jess' em, etc.) that are making the really serious router raising devices are making them to primarily fit the PC7518 without ANY base... just the motor. The Jess'em master lift is a prime example of this. The supposed advantage of these combinations are true accesibility to above the table bit changing and micro adjustment capability.
Other devices, like the Rout'r Lift will take just about any router, including plunge routers, with the bases still attached. The salesmen state that the problem is that you still can't change bits from the top with this type of device. The last device, the Router Raizer, is interesting since it is designed specifically for plunge routers. The Router Raizer, is just some hardware and a "key" that allows you to tie into plunge stop screw mechanism from above the table.
Spent the afternoon at Woodcraft looking at the many options that now are available and it is really confusing. I have a DeWalt 625 that I find cumbersome to use freehand due to the small base. But it seems like there might be much better options out there. Guess its just a question of how much $$ you want to sink in a router table. Seems like for all the money for a table, a lift, a fence and a router, you could buy a pretty good shaper.
Robbie
Co-incidentally, I have been doing a little research this afternoon waiting for some materials to be delivered. Yep, you weren't kiddin' about so many options out there. I keep up pretty extensively with tools, I thought. This router option thing is interesting. I had posted to Tom F about the router raizer being too much money, IMO. I was thinking of the thing Rockler sells called the master-lift or something at $250.
I wasn't even aware of which the router raizer was till this afternoon. Interesting at $89. This would be ideal for the Hitachi M12V. But you have now added $90 to the $194 for $284. Some of the others as you saw were lots more. By the time you add capability of quick changes and height adjustment, you got a small fortune invested. The Milwaukee is a great idea. The router is already set up for the above the table. But, price for the fixed base 3 1/2 HP $359. You don't have the option of pulling it off the table to double as a plunge. I want to pursue the Triton as I am not quite familar with it's features. Been busy since it hit the street. I understand there was some kind of a problem with the switch. Will post to above Triton owner for the scoop, as I'm interested.
The bottom line is, it looks like a shaper might not be that far off the horizon when you add all these things up. Seems like somebody said that. Oh, that was you. (kiddin') You may be close to being very correct. Give it some more thought and toss a coin if necessary. That seems as good a solution as any and a lot less stressful. ha..ha..
Good luck...
sarge..jt
Sarge,
Your exactly right. I had the name screwed up. It is the master-lift I was talking about. I still think this is the best option because I think the PC75182 motor is a great tool. As I said, I have looked also at the Bosch 1619EVS which I think is the next best thing. As I've always said.....Long after you've forgot what it cost your left with what you bought...
TDF
by the time you pay for a router and good table you are at shaper prices.. believe me a cheap shaper is better than any router and lift table..
Frenchy,
believe me a cheap shaper is better than any router and lift table..
What about a 3.5 hp router that does not need a lift table? All bit changes are done from above, height adjustment is done by turning a knob from atop. As Sarge says it's a good idea to have Variable speed which the Milwaukee has. But overall, I'd say a shaper is a better investment, but not a cheap shaper.
Lar
I bought a cheap (jet) shaper and I've used it to tongue and grove thousands of bd. ft. of flooring and and panels. I also made a few boxes with the lock joint bit as well as some freehand work.
It hasn't had a single hick-up. Now I could of spent more, but it is a matter of which I want to do, buy tools or work wood.. Everyone has a budget.. By buying modest priced tools like Jet and Grizzly I can afford a lot more of them and still have the quality of work I want.
A router table is just a cheap shaper.. except with it's small motor it won't last as long, the bits spin much faster and dull sooner. Besides would you feel comfortable with a 5 or 6 inch bit in a router? I wasn't and that's why I bought the shaper.
For $225 dollars you can buy the entry level shaper from grizzly. (which looks just like my more expensive Jet) Or if you want a better quality one to start with you can spend $425 dollars..( which is what I'd do if I had it all to do over again)
Well Frenchy you make some good points. So a rock solid Milwaukee router would run just a tad cheaper than the shaper but the bits for the router are less and the longevity of them is shorter. But I believe the Milwaukee would last just as long as a cheap shaper. I've never used a shaper but I would hope they are less of a noise factor on ones hearing. I haven't used a router much lately, been into the handplanes and beading tools. Contributing to L-N's profits.
Lar
I would never ever run my routers without good noise protection. ever...-- never ever!
However the shaper is quiet enough that I have run it briefly without noise protection..
I have a lot of Milwaukee equipment, I like their stuff. yet there is no way I would ever attempt to tongue and grove thousands of bd.ft. of flooring with a router.
Don't be mislead by the low price of Grizzly stuff. It's good decent well built equipment. it may not have all the bells and whistles of some of the competition, but if your intent is to run some molding or flooring it is pretty hard to beat..
For example,
the kiln where I sometimes get wood that's been dried if I'm in too much of a hurry to dry it myself, surface planes about 1 million bd.ft. of mostly hardwood a year on a 24 inch Grizzly that they've owned now for as long as I've been going there. I've never seen or heard of it breaking...
Frenchy,
I'd agree, if your going to do an enormous amount of board ft. especially if it's hardwood then yes, a shaper is the better tool no doubt. The particular brand of shaper is up to the individual.
You've had good luck with Grizzley and I've had the same with General so it's up to the worker. I still think those Milwaukee tools are built like tanks and will last as long if not longer than alot of shapers.
Lar
you know, it would certainly be interesting to use your General for a while and have you use my Grizzly I wonder in the end would one be that much superior to the other.......
I gota go the cord on my Milwaukee 3/8ths drill needs replacement (but then it's 15 years old....)
Probably the only noticeable difference would be in the start up. The General has a nice Porsche sounding idle to it. Once the wood hit the blade maybe no difference.
Wow, 15 years on the same cord, I killed a cord after three months once. The Milwaukee belt sander grabbed it and it was gone in a flash.
Jeez,,, My shaper is nice and quiet sounding too untill it hit's wood, that's why I'm such a fan...I don't know about porsche sound, I always thought porsches had a burble sound to them, maybe a Jaguar V12?
I did that once in 12 hours..
I had a cord replaced on my mikita belt sander and handed it to a guy and three minutes later it was ruined.. from the time the cord was replaced to it was ruined was exactly 12 hours. (and he ruined it in the first place,.... ahh! the help you get now days)
You've got the record on cord destruction!!!
Lar
Frenchy has some very valid points. I love the Milwaukee, Bosch, Hitachi and PC. They are all suitable with some help, but the shaper is an alternative if you do a lot of routing. If I were doing this for a living, no brainer. Shaper and router for hand-held operations. I have a dedicated table router and a dedicated hand held plunge and fixed base.
But the shaper has it's niche, and sometimes we over-look that fact.
G'day...
sarge..jt
Hey Sarge,
I agree with you about when it would be time to start up the shaper and shut off the router. I think the Milwaukee router can last as long if not longer than the cheaper shapers. Frenchy has had great luck with his shaper so he should stick with it. For someone who owns neither a router or shaper, then it depends on the volume of work they plan to do before deciding which tool to get.
How's the Sunhill running?
Lar
Lar
As "Tony the Tiger" says.... GRREEAATT!!!
sarge..jt
Sarge,
Just what I expected!
Lar
So what shaper do you currently have that you like so much
I'm usin' the little jet, (which looks like the grizzly G0510 except with a 1 1/2 hp motor) One of the advantages of the smaller shapers like this is I've got wood stacked up all over the house.. Now I could haul those stacks of wood to the shaper and then haul it back up to where I need it or... What I do is haul the shaper set it up and mill the wood where I'm gonna use it. Then I clean up the mess I made, haul the shaper back into the basement and put the wood in place..
Since I'll be using the shaper for flooring, wall panels, and window trim I expect the ease of moving it around will prove valuable.. (so far it already has)
Tom
I discovered today there are so many I had to go back over them about 3 times to make sure I had them straight. ha.. I just looked at the WoodPecker on the site.
This thing is impressive compared to the master-lift. They look like they put some quality into their price tag. If that's what your shooting for, this is a serious contender.
Good luck and let us know how this thing works if you purchase...
sarge..jt
Chris:
Woodcraft had about 7 of these lifts - different brands. The guy there also liked the Woodpecker because of the heavy top, the two lifting screws and the chain link mechanism. The Mast-R-Lift only has one lift screw and a rubber band time raising mechanism. The top on the Jess'em Mast-R-Lift is actually pretty thick - at least 3/8". The top on the Jess'em Rout-R-Lift (the one that will take a plunge router) is much less beefy and it is listed as 3/16".
Based on what I saw, however, I am with you. The Woodpecker was slick - particularly if it is compatable with a router you already own.
Yeah Sarge. I think I'm sold on the Woodpecker lift with the PC75182 motor. This looks like a real nice machine with I think much better features than others in the same price range. I'm not quite ready for it and have to wait for my bonus from work, but I'm pretty much sold on this as the way to go. I am working on the router table cabinet now and will be ready in a couple of weeks for the lift. I'll let you know how it works out.
TDF
Tom
Up on coffee break. I don't usually get to excited about the lift systems, but this thing on the website caught my attention. This thing looks like someone knew what they were doing and then did it well.
We've got a WW show here at the Gwinnett Civic Center at the end of the month, I hope they show up as I would like to see it up close. If they do, I will post to let you know my first hand impression. On paper, it's the most impressive I have seen. That's not to knock the others. It just looks like somebody decided to go heavy-duty.
Good luck on the cab and set-up...
sarge..jt
Boy I wish the shows were closer to me. The nearest one is in Springfield, MA about 2 hours away. Never seems convenient to go on the weekend. Always have chores to do.
Please let me know what it looks like close up though if you see it. I've been looking at a lot of them and this looks like the best.
By the way, how is the job at work coming? I don't think I read how you made out with the bonding rubber to the top.
TDF
Tom
The first 30' fo straight counter is installed. Came out great and the rubber bonded with non-solvent glue. It is 1/8" thick and weights a ton. I think it would stay put from the mass of weight without glue. Have the pattern formed to cut base and top for the last 10' of semi-round. Would be doing that right now except...ha..ha.. they called this morning to ask me to put it on temporary hold. They need 4 engine display cradles for the showroom by Monday. I have them cut to size and screwed and glued. Taking a coffee break and will do banding, etc. till the wee hours this morning. Should be complete by Sunday afternoon and back on the counter.
I am fortunate to have the International WW show here in Atlanta and the WW show that travels around here in late Feb. About 9 miles form my home in metro Atlanta. We also have Highland Hardware which has been a mecca for southern WW's since the early 70's. Seen Maloof, Kresnov, Frid, Odate and a host of others there at seminars. Hope to see Richard Jones there one day. Take the time to go. It's worth it and it only shows once a year. The chores can be juggled to accomodate. You will love it. Allow 4 or 5 hours if you really want to see everything.
Will comply if the WoodPecker shows his head at the show. I hope so adn guessing they will. This is a high intensity area for WW.
Back to the shop for engine work.. ha..ha..
sarge..jt BTW, check your e-mail.
Sarge,
Woodpecker is scheduled to be at the Atlanta Woodworking Show Feb. 28 to Mar. 2.
Phone number for Superior. 800-622-4462. They also have good prices on Makita & Bosch.
Edited 2/15/2003 8:21:29 PM ET by Chris
Chris
Now you tell me. Just bought a Bosch barrel grip jig-saw also. I'm always a day late and a dollar short. ha..ha.. Will call Monday and see if they have a cat to send.
How do you folks figure out that WoodPecker will be at the Atlanta WW Show. You know how to work these computers, huh. I'm illiterate with finding all that info. I have to rely on people like you to pass it along.
Thank you very, very much. I will have a look for Tom at the show.
sarge..jt
Sarge,
Woodpeckers has a link on there web page that gives a list of the shows they will attend. http://www.woodpeck.com/show.html
I am not sure if Superior has a Catalog. They have a store in Indianapolis & advertise in Woodshop News & maybe some others. They had one of the biggest booths at the Indianapolis Show. They sold alot of power tools.
Here is a link to future Woodworking Shows. http://www.thewoodshows.com/tjr/V33/index.cvn
Chris
Tom,
In addition to the Springfield, MA. WW show, there was a show in Worchester in late Nov. early Dec. and I believe another in the spring up in Billrica, MA at the Masonic Lodge.
The Worchester show was much better than the Springfield show but very poorly attended...
Thanks BG. Let me know when you hear about the Worchester show. I'll keep an ear to the ground for it.
TDF
Sarge:
Chris beat me to the punch. Superior has a web-site, but it is like a "cover page". It isn't interactive and doesn't have an electronic calendar. In fact, its only real utility is that it gives a phone number.
I got on their mailing list because I bought some things at the Chicago WW show. I would second what Chris' said. The have a very large booth and thing bring a ton of stock with them. When I have bought stuff from them, I just usually call to see what their price is.
Like for big Delta machines, I didn't find them to be much of a bargain. In fact, I'm not sure that I bought anything other than P-C from them.
Good luck and let us know how it works out.
Robbie
I called and a cat is on the way. Thanks to you and Chris. One more source never hurts, especially out of state where I don't have to pay tax.
Have a great day...
sarge..jt
Sarge: The pleasure was all mine.
I am looking forward to the woodworking show - it usually hits here around April. Superior usually has some great deals at the show and let's you buy them direct for a few weeks after the show.
Love to find a 75182 motor only for cheap. Who knows.
Hope it works out for you.
Sarge,
Is this a catalog for Superior Distrbuting? Let me know what you think. Could you pass along the number?
Thanks
TDF
Tom
It was posted a few messages above. That's where I got it. Have you dealt with them?
sarge..jt
Tom
Just go back from the WW show in Atlanta. Spent about 20 minutes or so with the WoodPecker and their rep. Results:
Well made chain drive, dual post and machined well. Smooth as silk and has a general look of well-built. That's cause is is well built. ha..ha..
Price $259 for the unit. This is the best lift for the money out there, IMO of course.
Good luck...
sarge..jt
Hey, Thanks for the info Sarge. I'm just itching to order it but still waiting for that bonus from work. The router table cabinet is complete except for the drawers, and I laminated the top last night in the shop at work. Came out really nice. I used a black laminate to match my PM side board and outfeed table. Will work on the drawers and the fence tomorrow.
Were they offering any discounts at the show? Why not start a thread to tell us about the show and other things you saw?
TDF
Edited 2/28/2003 8:42:08 PM ET by Tom Ferreira
Edited 2/28/2003 8:43:14 PM ET by Tom Ferreira
Tom
I used the black laminate also. No specials from WoodPecker at the show. Some of the people that sold it as distributors did have specials cheaper than WoodPecker itself.
Go to thread, Kudo's to Tom from Knots. I spent several hours with him and only visited Woodpecker, Mini-Max and Luguna. I was very limited on time and there was a Bruce Springsteen concert at 8 pm. I wanted to clear before that snarled traffic. Hope to go back Sunday if possible. It is only 12 minutes from my home.
Evening and will post if I go back...
sarge..jt
Tom
I went back and got it to save you some time. Thank Chris and Robbie for some good input on it. You might go back and read their comments on Superior.
800-622-4462
Stay in touch...
sarge..jt
Tom and Sarge:
I agree with you both regarding the PC and the Woodpecker lift. I saw the latter at Woodcraft and it is really a piece of machinery.
Also have a thought for you. If you are going to buy anything P-C, you may want to consider mail order through Superior Distributing (Indianapolis, IN). They have by far the best prices I have ever seen or heard about on Porter Cable. Also, no tax and no shipping charges. Finally, should anything go wrong, their customer service is impeccable - to the point of sending UPS to your house to pick-up and return anything that is wrong.
I've bought a PC compressor, nail gun, brad gun, random orbital sander / polisher kit and each time Superior has been about 15% lower than everywhere else I have tried. Hope it helps. I am planning on calling to see what price I can get for just the 7518 motor (no housing) for attaching to a Woodpecker.
Do you have Woodcraft up in your area? If you cannot get to the WW show, you may be able to see the Woodpecker set up there.
Have a nice weekend.
Robbie
I do have a Woodcraft here in Atlanta, along with Highland Hardware and Stone Mountain Tool. We are fortunate here. There is the WW show in about two weeks.
Does Superior have a toll-free or web-site. I buy quite a bit through Tool-Crib in ND when I catch sales to save the tax and shipping. Same as Amazon except I call direct as I prefer to talk to real people.
Thanks for the into adn I'm sure Tom especially will check it out as the is on the verge of a PC purchase. I just bought a PC circular saw to cut large panels down. Wish I had known. If you don't have web-site, I can call the standard LD info for Indianapolis and get it.
Have a great day...
sarge..jt
Sarge,
Don't get the E-Mail through Knots. What did you mean?
TDF
Tom
Will e-mail reply.
sarge..jt
Tom
Sorry, I'm dumb. I see where both of the e-mails I sent were unable to deliver. The messages were not of great importance but sensitive enough to not post.Just thought you would find it interesting. Not a big deal, but if you want to post an address for work I can send a note I will. Did you not have to enter your e-mail address when you first registered? I don't know much about how all this computer stuff works.
Have a good day...
Check your E-Mail.
TDF
Tom
Recieved and reply sent.
sarge..jt
Robbie,
Thanks for the tip. I hadn't heard of them. Do they have a web site. If so could pass along the URL.
Thanks
TDF
Sarge et al,
Marc Soomerfield was demoing his CMT router bits with the Hitachi and Router Raiser (they were also selling the Hitachi and Router raiser as a package in their booth). The suppliers that do the demos usually use whatever machine is going to make their product look best and I'm sure he makes a lot more off router bits than pushing someone elses product - so he evidently thought the Hitachi was a viable atternative.
Of course I went the Incra/Porter Cable route. (I did get the 1/32 thread on the raiser and it's great for accuracy but a real pain on changing bits). Incra offers it now with choice of 1/16 or 1/32 and would definetly recommend 1/16.
Just my 2 cents.
Jim
Jim
Yes, Sommerfield and his group do use the Hitachi. At $194 it is a real work-horse. The plunge is not the greatest and the tabs have to be cut (no problem) for a large bit. And you better order the bent wrench offered by Sommerfield in his cat. I live about 8 miles from the Hitachi service and distribution center here in Atlanta. The wrench is after-market, I think as the Jet BS quik-crank.
The PC is a good choice wth the proper set-up along with the Bosch 1619EVS (I have a 1617EVS fixed base, smooth). The Milwaukee is great out of the box as they have the patented adjust from above set-up (the D handles are ugly, but it's not a beauty contest). The DW 625F is a excellent hand held plunge but the base limits it to smaller bits (I have a DW 621 and the plunge is the smoothest on the market). I am not to familar with Makita, so I will leave that alone.
Looks like we got some great options here. I have never seen many tools that meet everyone's total expectations. I would be proud of any of the above in a table. Just have to factor in what you can afford, what you consider to be the most convenient for your style and of course, what matches your shop color scheme. ha..ha..
Yep, the more I think about it; looks like we are spoiled compared to what we could get 30 or even 20 years ago. I am glad to have these options, even though those days seemed less stressful. Just take whatever you could get your hands on and tinker to make it fit your expectations. Drop it in the table and go to work. Ahhh.... Life was simple.
Have a good day, Jim...
sarge..jt
Jim,
Have you tried taking the router/lift unit out of the table to chance the bits. I have an Eliminator chuck on my router. I just lay the unit on the table top & change bits with an allen wrench. I also like the 1/32 screws.
Chris,
Hadn't thought about the eliminator chuck. One of the advantages to the lift was not having to take the router/lift out of the table to change bits. Did think about cutting an allen wrench off that I could leave in cordless drill when I was going to be doing a bunch of changing.
Jim
Woodmike, the PC fixed base is the correct choice along with the Incra router lift.
The larger router is needed for larger bits as well, with the variable power adjustment you will be needing this PC Model. I use almost all 1/2" router bits now in my router table. Both Rockler and Woodline Arizona Inc. have very nice quality bits at affordable Prices.
Woodlines web site is http://www.woodbits.com 800-472-6950
The Web address for Incra is I think http://www.incra.com
With the router lift the Knuckle buster in not an issue because you just raise the router up and the bit changes can be made with the router in the table.
Sweet!
Good luck
Tony
Tony,
No router lifts needed with the new Milwaukee. Anyone looking to buy a router for the table and is thinking of a PC should also take a look at the Milwaukee, Bosch, Hitachi and whatever else is out there.
Lar
Edited 2/12/2003 4:40:18 PM ET by Lar
I'm going to chime in and cast my vote for the triton. I use a seperate switch with mine and the switch being tied to the spindle lock is a non issue. I don't think you will find another router/raizer combination that is faster or easier to adjust the bit height with. Easier to adjust than my shapers.
Tom
Edited 2/12/2003 3:36:14 PM ET by Tom
Woodmike,
I purchased the PC 7518 too. From all the articles I read and people I talked to, they all pushed the PC. FWW did an article several years back regarding table top routers and they too choose the PC. PC designed the router for that application ( table mounting) that is why the base screws so far down the motor, to provide as much room possible for bit changes, above the table, and to allow the user to utilize as much of the cutter (bit) as possible when in operation. The varible speed feature is great, however, keep in mind if you have it mounted in an enclosed cabinet adjusting the speed can be a hassle, unless you don't mind opening up the door each time. I am not sure if PC still offers the non-varible speed model, if they do you can pick up a speed controller from 'ToolCrib' at Amazon.com and the router for the same price as the 'Speed-a-matic' model, that would offer you the flexibilty of speed control without the hassle of adjusting the router control when mounted.
Take a look at the other models and makes mentioned, I am considering the Hitachi as a plunge router. I almost purchased this model before, great price, name, and features.
Good luck,
WoodMike,
I have had a router table in my shop for 14 years. I always used a plunge router in it. I never used the table alot because it was difficult to change bits & adjust the bit height. I have been looking at all the different router lifts that have been coming out over the last several years. Several of them looked nice, but they still did not impress me enough to buy one. 3 weeks ago while at a Woodworking Show looking at an Incra miter gauge at the Woodpecker Booth I noticed there router lifts. I was very impressed & purchased one that uses just the motor from a Porter cable 7518 router. They also have adapters for PC690 routers, Bosch & Makita fixed base routers. I have it setup with a PC7518 motor & an Eliminator chuck. Now I enjoy using the router table as much as using a shaper. Check out the link for Woodpecker. http://woodpeck.com/precisionrouterlift.html
Chris,
This is great. I like this better than the master-lift that Rockler sells. This has a 3/8" thick plate where the Rockler master-lift is only 1/8". Thanks for the info.
TDF
I've used a 1975 sears one horse router for years in a wing of my '50's sears 10" table saw (now for sale, watch the for sale column).
Having been given a new supersaw for Christmas, I've put a router table on the rails to the right side of the saw. The other routers I have are not variable speed, so I decided to get a new router for the table alone. After agonizing over routers and lifts, I bought the Triton, all the time worried about a new company that I knew nothing about. I bought it because the bit can be changed above the table and the height was easily adjustable with knobs right from the factory. Will I be happy? I'll post again if I'm not, being a bit of a curdmudgeon.
You should buy the Triton or wait a year for the porter cable, mikita, hitachi, bosch, etc copies of the Triton. They may even be better!
I bought a Royobi AP 10 when Royobi invented the portable planer; there's about two dozen better portable planers now. I suspect that Triton got the table mounted router right finally, and everyone else will copy ASAP! At least, they oughta.
Mike;
I don't know if you still need help but I have owned a PC 7539 for years. It is a great router and I still use it in my router table. I installed a router raizer in it two years ago and have been very happy with it since. I am now able to adjust the height of the bit with the turn of a screw in my router table. The installation of the raizer was easier than I thought. The variable speed and 3.5 HP motor of the 7539 comes in handy too. I own two other routers but like the 7539 the best. However, I keep it installed in my router table and use other routers for handy work. Hope this helps.
Mark
Tom F and Sarge:
Have enjoyed reading your posts back and forth. We were talking about Superior earlier in this post. I called them and their price for the 7518 was the same as others.
However, was at Woodcraft this week and they have 5 or 6 reconditioned models they were selling for $279. They looked brand spanking new and would think PC would really make double sure before returning a unit to market...
Would be the perfect router for that Woodpecker lift, which is slick.
Robbie
I called Superior and they do not have a catalog. They are a distributor. Instead of a catalog like Highland Hardware or Tool Crib for instance, they UPS'ed me Bosch, PC, Makita, etc. factory catalog. ha.. Surprised me as I did not tell them I was anything but a retail customer.
Yes, the WoodPecker is the nicest and best priced for it's quality lift on the market. I think Tom will get one. I still do it by hand as I don't get in a hurry.
Keep in touch...
sarge..jt
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