Replies

1. 
   philip_r | Nov 06, 2009 12:37am | #1

   climb cut.  Do it with a hand-held, if possible.

1. 
   ChrisB123 | Nov 06, 2009 02:31am | #3

   Thanks. I'm not familiar with a 'climb cut'- what is that?

1. 
   forestgirl | Nov 06, 2009 03:46am | #5

   A climb-cut is a cut made with the rotation of the bit -- it can be come a runaway-cut very easily and must be done with care.

   I'd suggest waiting a little while and see if there aren't some other tips that can help.  forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

2. 
   gofigure57 | Nov 06, 2009 03:53am | #6

   Chris ,

   When you pull the router from rite to left as opposed to pushing it from left to right like you normally would.  You have to keep a good grip on the router as it wants to pull itself from rite to left .  As mentioned a hand held router is much preferred, as well as sharp bits.  The cut will appear fuzzy on some material, another pass from rite to left will clean up the cut. 

   Get a feel for it on some scrap, when climb cutting on end grain you need to get good grip on the tool, ... The bit gets good traction and even more so wants to run away from you.  be careful,  light passes the bigger the bit.

   Tom

2. 
   RalphBarker | Nov 06, 2009 01:55am | #2

   I heard one needs a Buffalo router for Wenge. And, BBQ sauce. ;-)

3. 
   miserybob | Nov 06, 2009 03:23am | #4

   Dude, if you gave yourself a router wedgie, you are really, really doing it wrong.

   Oh.  WENGE.  Sorry.

    

   Here's some info on tearout.... http://www.patwarner.com/tearout.html

    

4. 
   dmdnk | Nov 06, 2009 05:26am | #7

   I've worked with quite a bit of wenge and routing it can be a pain- especially cove cuts. Use a new or freshly sharpened bit.  If the pieces are straight, you can remove most of the material on the tablesaw leaving much less wood for the router bit.  If the pieces have curves, use a starter pin to ease into the cut.

5. 
   forestgirl | Nov 06, 2009 06:32am | #8

   I wonder if Freud's new(ish) Quadracut bit would help at all.  The type of problem you're having may not respond, but it might be worth checking out, I'll see if Charle's can respond here.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

   
   

   ---

   Edited 11/5/2009 10:33 pm by forestgirl

1. 
   charlesm | Nov 06, 2009 11:55pm | #11

   QuadraCut could help a LOT with the tear out but, alas, we do not offer a cove bit profile with that feature at this time.
   Charles M

   Freud America, Inc.

1. 
   forestgirl | Nov 07, 2009 12:05am | #12

   Oh, well, good news/bad news, eh Charles?  Thanks for letting us know!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

1. 
   Ron01960 | Nov 08, 2009 07:20pm | #14

   I know this doesn't help you if the Quadracut is not yet being manufactured in your profile. I have several boards of an unknown species that was given to me because the guy couldn't profile the end grain, he said he used a quality bit and has some experience with working wood. It looks like some wenge veneer I have.

   I used a quadracut last week on some curly maple, WOW ! Smooth as a baby's bottom.I'm going to get a few more of the popular sizes I use. Best of luckRon in Peabody

6. 
   DonStephan | Nov 06, 2009 04:58pm | #9

   Not going to be as convenient as chucking a bit in an already owned router, but if that won't work would a molding plane work on wenge with and across the grain as a last resort?

7. 
   ChrisB123 | Nov 06, 2009 06:48pm | #10

   Thanks to all for your comments (even those regarding BBQ sauce and wedgies!). Have done some reading on climb cuts and indeed, caution is clearly advised. Planning to try both the technique of eliminating as much waste as practical with my tabel saw before applying the cove cut on the router table (normal direction of feed), and trying a climb cut with a plunge router.

8. 
   WillGeorge | Nov 08, 2009 07:06pm | #13

   Late reply but...

   I used ALOT of wenge (my wood was Panga-Panga) which is 'sort' of the same thing for my two Chinese style canopy beds. YES it splinters. But no worse than some other woods I use.

   I use my router more than any other tool I have. In fact, most of the woods I normally use require me to 'climb-cut'. I tend to like wild grain.

   If you have or do not have, experience 'climb-cutting' on a router, It can/will be dangerous, period. However, 'reasonably' safe if you only use very shallow cuts and the 'stick' you are cutting has some mass and your fingers are always well away from the bit.

   I recommend NEVER climb-cut using a hand held router. Only 'climb-cut' on a router table that has a starting pin and while using a bit with a ball bearing or a 'Anti-Kickbac' (Limits cut depth) profile. I for one only use a bit with a ball bearing AND anti-kickback design. I have no problem making multiple passes and changing bearing diameters to make a profile.

   I free-hand a profile often but I also often use a 'carrier board' made of 1/2 inch thick MDF with some toggle clamps to hold the board (if it is narrow) to safely hold the carrier with my hands. Sometimes I have to make a special carrier for a project. Little cost compared to the potential ER bill.

   Be aware that a climb cut can make the board take off like a rocket and has the potential to carry your fingers into the bit. AND sometimes the board will not shoot away from you! I have had a board hit my tablesaw fence and come back at me. (That was while I was learning) No fence, saw blade retracted and any other thing on top of my saw table these days. My router table is mounted onto my saw.

   I find it VERY hard to 'recommend' climb-cutting, but my experience tells me that it MAY be the only way profile some woods. As in curved 'sticks'...

   If you use a router table with a fence and your board profile is a straight path you can always NOT climb-cut. Be patient and make as many, many passes as you have to.

   I forgot! A sharp bit and paying attention to what the danger may be, makes all the difference! I have some advantage. Experience AND I still have some fear doing it to this day so I pay attention to what I am doing. NEVER be in a hurry!

   And then again, how does one learn how to do it? I practiced on a very large heavy scrap board. May I suggest that you find a local woodworking school and ask/watch somebody with experience doing it?

   Not sure they will but I think sometimes a climb-cut is the only way...

   Good luck and be SAFE!

    

   
   

   ---

   Edited 11/8/2009 11:14 am by WillGeorge

9. 
   glenaspen | Nov 08, 2009 11:44pm | #15

   The thing about climb cutting is don't even consider taking all the wood off in one pass. Make sure the board is secured and hold the router by both handles. Run the router down the right side of the board taking a very light cut, understanding that the deeper you dig in the harder it will push the router towards you. Unlike routing in the typical direction, during a climb cut the bit is trying to push the router away from the wood, which makes it very easy to take a light cut once you've practiced and gotten used to the feel of it. For a 3/16" cove bit I'd pull the router along the board 4 or 5 times. Only until I felt nearly all the wood was removed would I purposely dig into the wood to make sure it's all removed. I'd do that a couple times because it's very easy to leave a slight high spot while climb cutting. I would NEVER climb cut on a router table or shaper unless I was using a powerfeed. When you're holding a router by both handles the spinning bit is not a danger to your fingers; when you're holding a board over a spinning bit in a climb cut you're just a grabbed board away from nothing between you and the bit.

1. 
   WillGeorge | Nov 09, 2009 10:08pm | #16

   Sir.. No fight here. OK, sort o a fight....

   We seem to have different opinions. Maybe we are both right or maybe we are both wrong? I will state again, that the router table is a much safer way. I will leave it at that. But then again, I have doen things this way for many years. I have ALL my fingers... I do sometimes hand route but I just feel that the router table is a much safer way. No, I do not put the bit on the 'outside' of the wood so that the wood is between the fence and the bit!

   Again, Just my way.

1. 
   Eef | Nov 09, 2009 11:48pm | #17

   will,perhaps shaper/router table climb cuts should only be done employing very light cuts. if i want to fantasize something really, really scary one option is to picture this operation at the shaper using big old slick knives...
   eef