Hi Everyone,
Not exactly woodworking questions, but I think this is a good place to ask.
I’m in the process of choosing a table saw and trying to decide how much right side capacity I need. I do have some background in woodworking but have always done everything with a circular saw, edge-guide, router, etc. So I’m fairly naive about TS safety. I am on the waiting list at my local library for a TS book.
I need to come up with a fast/efficient yet SAFE way to crosscut some lightweight plastic sign board. The 1/4″ stuff only weights 15 lbs. for a full 4’x8′ sheet. I think it would tear before it would kickback, but I still want to be as safe as possible.
The cuts I need to make:
1) Crosscut the sheets into 32″x48″ panels (minus blade kerf).
2) Crosscutting those 32″x48″ panels into 47.5″
Regarding #1, I know it’s best if I make a rough cut with my circular saw, but speed/efficiency is a concern here. I have a few ideas, but want to hear what everyone has to say first.
Regarding #2, I assume just find a setting on my fence for 1/2″ and trim off the right amount. Or would a crosscut sled be better?
Thanks.
Replies
I recently cut 1/4" lucite plastic using a 1/8" spiral bit in my router and a straight edge. Worked like a charm. I think they even make special bits for cutting plastic.
PlaneWood by Mike_in_Katy (maker of fine sawdust!)
PlaneWood
chris,
I've had my worst kickbacks trying to cut 1/4" stuff...it's so thin it can slide under the fense (bies knockoff)and the next thing you know its twisted and ridng up the back side of the blade. SO I always attach an auxillary fense that goes tight to the table when cutting 1/4" material.
As for the cuts, you have several options: 1. cut 16"(about) off one side and 1/2" too, 2. when you set up your rails shift them 10" to the right giving you greater capacity on the right side( about 36"), 3. Take the fense off and make a jig that can be clamped to the TS top(somtimes I'll use a 48" level)
I agree with the kick back risk- also these are pretty large sheets to be fabricated- 32" x 47.5", that's kind of awkward on a cabinet saw. Short of a panel saw I'd cut them with a circular saw and guide. I have the Festool AT55 and it works well in this application- the guide system is very accurate in cutting sheet goods.Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
if i'm alone I never cut a full sheet on a table. I always use either a circular saw and a guide or if I have a helper i'll use the table but I still think on a big sheet I get a better cut with a straight edge (less likely to bump or move the panel when cutting).
The better suppliers in my area do those cuts on a panel saw for about a buck and a half a cut. I bought a 4x8 sheet of Formica recently and had them cut it to 3 pieces 48x32 (minus kerf). No muss or fuss, nice and clean.
Chris,
Stay away from the tablesaw on this one, in your minds eye you may imagine this to be the better aproach but in reality your better of moving the tool across the sheet rather than the other way around especially when you're talking about a thin flexible and potentially brittle material like plastic.
My advice to you is this, first rough cut the pieces to size with a NEW blade on your circular saw that has as many teeth as possible (40 if you have it) then using a bearing guided bit and a homemade wooden straight edge trim the pieces to size with your router. Do all of these operations on a large flat surface if you can and keep the plastic up off the table with some 2X2 spacers so your blade clears the tabletop.
Good Luck,
Brian
Stay away from the tablesaw on this one..I sort of agree but to me it would depend on how often you need to do it... I cut large panels all the time on my TS.I have a in-feed and out-feed table that fold up so they can be put away. Just a smooth top and electrical conduit for the structure.
Conduit is light and strong (well for this use).BUT.. It sure would be nice to have a 'helper' out there in back sometimes even with the tables......EDIT:: Sorry I went brain dead.. Somehow I never saw..
plastic sign board ... Geeee.. I cut very little sheet plastic..
GLAD.. I had some shatter once and sort of scarie...
Edited 8/5/2005 9:27 am ET by Will George
I agree with the other posts, don't use the TS. you would be tackling one of the tougher cuts right out of the box.
you have the right tools. just upgrade your edge guide to one that gives you a good finish on the cut.
I haven't cut the plastic sign board with my bosch saw and ez guide yet, but it does well on melamine and birch plywood. you might try ez's web page, there's a guy on there cutting some type of blue plastic sheets.
jericho
For speed and safety a Panel saw with a plastic cutting blade would do it in 1 pass. Re: Cut # 2 is too big for a sled. A sled any deeper than the top of the saw would be very hard to control. A slidng table would be a better way to go. What else do you need a TS for?
John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
The more things change ...
We trained hard, but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams, we would be reorganized. I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization.
Petronious Arbiter, 210 BC
Thanks to you and everyone else for their responses. I need the TS for some of the smaller panels I'll be cutting. The size mentioned in my first post is the largest. I'd also need smaller panels, down to about 12"x24".Maybe I'll just wait for Eurekazone's EZ Repeater to come out.Efficiency is of the essence so I may also look into a panel saw.
Laguna has some nice ones.John O'Connell - JKO Handcrafted Woodworking
The more things change ...
We trained hard, but it seemed that every time we were beginning to form up into teams, we would be reorganized. I was to learn later in life that we tend to meet any new situation by reorganizing; and a wonderful method it can be for creating the illusion of progress while producing confusion, inefficiency, and demoralization.
Petronious Arbiter, 210 BC
Chris,
that ez repeater is supposed be available soon. looks like the breaktime guys will get a peek preview at the riverfest next weekend. look forward to hearing about that. if the repeater works as good as the guide, forget about the table saw.
jericho
Edited 8/6/2005 7:39 am ET by jericho
Cut them into smaller pieces using a circular saw. I would also suggest using a plastic cutting blade. After you have cut them into smaller pieces, then you can fine tune them with the table saw.
If you're going to be cutting a lot of large panels, get an aftermarket Biesemeyer 50in. fence.
Hi Chris,
In addition to the terrific advice that's already been posted, I'll offer the following:
When I demonstrate the hazards of kickback at the tablesaw for students, I use a piece of foamcore that's about 12" X 12' - it's always an attention getter:
I hold the foamcore tight against the rip fence, ripping about an inch off of the left side (eleven inches between the fence and the blade).
As I slowly advance the foam core into the spinning blade (with all of my body parts, and all of the students, out of the line of fire), I watch for the telltale cushion of air to subtly begin lifting the panel like a hover craft. As soon as I relax my grip and allow the panel to drift away from the rip fence, the blade catches it and propels it across the shop at an astounding rate.
It's worth noting that I do this with the splitter in place - I cause the kickback to occur just before the stock reaches the splitter in an effort to drive home the point that, even with a splitter installed, kickback is possible.
Lightweight materials (like plastic sheet, 1/8" ply, masonite), tend to float on a cushion of air around the throat plate generated by the rotating saw blade (particularly if you don't have an effective dust collection system connected to your tablesaw).
When using the rip fence: it's generally safe to cut pieces that are longer than they are wide (garden variety ripping); and, while it's definitely dangerous to cross cut using the rip fence, it can also be dangerous to cut pieces in between the two extremes, i.e., pieces that are square - especially lightweight materials.
When it's necessary to cut thin stock on the tablesaw, it's prudent to use a zero-clearance throat plate to minimize updrafts, a featherboard to hold the stock down flat against the table, a tight-fitting (or auxiliary) fence to assure the work cannot slide beneath the fence, and a splitter or riving knife to limit the possibility of the stock climbing up and across the spinning blade.
As always, the most important piece of safety to have fully engaged is between your ears.
Good luck,
-Jazzdogg-
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie
Excellent points. They are definitely the wise man's code to life with 10 fingers and no head injuries...Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
There used to be a video of Kelly Mehler (or someone?) demonstrating the foam-core kickback thing right here at Knots. Can't find it now! Seems like there isn't much free stuff on the web site any longer. Anyhoo, even on the computer it was pretty darned impressive!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hi FG,
Yeah, it manages to get the adrenaline flowing - even for the person conducting the demonstration!
-Jazzdogg-
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie
Lightweight platic sign board would usually be cut with a utility knife. If it's one of the more rigid boards or plexiglass it would be scored and snapped. Sure, it can be cut with a saw, but why take the risk?
I have one of these in my shop - cuts any plastic board safely:
http://www.fletcher-terry.com/fletcherterry/ecatalog/viewfamily.jsp?level=4&parent_id=168&parent_id2=6&parent_id3=-1&family_id=40&tl_id=6&tab=2
Edited 8/7/2005 12:53 pm ET by Corners
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