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Let me start by saying that I am inexperienced with the finishing aspect of WWing, so any help is appreciated.
A n aquaintance told me he uses sanding ealer with great results, smoothness of subsequent coats the most noteable. Have read elsewhere mot to use it.
MY question is should I use it on some Kitchen cabinets, and if so any suggestions on a Waterbased product?
Thanks for your help.
Kelley Hamby
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I have used sanding sealers, but I don’t find them necessary. When I use them, I sand them off almost completely, since they are much softer than the actual topcoat. I really think it’s a better practice to use a thinned down topcoat as it’s own sanding sealer.
I can’t give you any advice on waterborne finishes; other than to say my one experiment with Oxford varnish was not very encouraging. It looked great, but scratched very easily, even more readily than shellac, but after using my favorite Rock Hard Varnish all finishes seem “soft”
*Kelley,I concur with Rob on this one. My personal feeling is that "sanding sealers" are for those who are too lazy to properly prepare the surface for finishing. They are not to be confused with "sealers".I have an intense aversion to water borne finishes but, Dave Arbuckle has many excellent postings here in regard to their use.IMHO, Min Wax Wipe On Poly in a satin or semi gloss would be an excellent choice for a final finish on kitchen cabinets.Dano
*Another "don't do it" recommendation....Putting sanding sealer under a good, strong topcoat reminds me of the old admonition to not build a house on sand. The whole finish is as strong as it's weakest link, and I can score sanding sealer with a thumbnail.It sounds like you've already picked your topcoat system?Dave
*If you're going to use Sanding Sealer, then use lacquer based only. You only need it if you are working with soft open grained woods and you are trying to achieve a high gloss finish without grain texture. I use it when I paint a surface which is only when I'm using wood that I would prefer not to see.There is a pretty cool trick that you can do with it. First precondition the surface with a stain pre-conditioner then stain the wood. Before the stain dries completely, hit it with a coat of lacquer based sanding sealer. In about an hour you'll start to notice a betina forming that cannot be sanded off. When the sealer dries, sand it then finish it with a Poly finish.Thank god it wasn't an expensive piece when I learned that trick....
*It is my opinion that using a sanding sealer sacrifices quality for expediency. Sanding sealer is used simply because it is fast and easy to sand. It contains a zinc stearate soap that sands like a jewel. Most are lacquer based so it dries fast and they can get to that final sanding sooner. However, adding the stearate to the sealer coat provides a very weak base and the stearates cause the product to have little or no resistance to water or water vapor. While one could use the finest finish ever made as the final finish it will never be better than the base it is on. One thing it does not do is "seal the wood".A shop I was involved with manufactured a line of semi-custom and custom designer furniture directly under the direction of the designer. We sub-contracted the finishing to a professional finishing shop that we chose after visiting 12-15 shops in a 300 mile radius. None would use sanding sealer and our specs specifically forbid it based on the tests performed by the designer firm. There are standard tests for adherence and you could easily see the decreased adherence associated with sanding sealer containing stearates. This was very pronounced when using polyurethane varnish which has low adherence anyway so never use a stearate based sanding sealer under poly varnish.Lacquer based sanding sealers are primarily used by high production furniture companies where time is money. They do not experience adhesion problems as they use lacquer finishes, not polyurethane varnishes. Things get even worse with multiple coats of sanding sealer. Now you have a very soft finish underneath a hard surface. This will cause cracking and crazing when the surface is dinged. If the finishing product requires a sealer coat (sealer is different than a sanding sealer) it will call for it in the directions. Generally, the sealer is a thinned coat of the final finish. Sanding sealer is just not needed.
*Oops. Just did what you guys are saying not to. Just finished a large entertainment center, and wanted a sprayable sealer so I sprayed laquer sanding sealer followed by poly varnish. Will do the final coat of poly tomorrow. As I was stirring my topcot, I read the directions (what a concept!) They don't reccomend it over sanding sealers. Called the tech line and the guy said it would fisheye over some sanding sealers, but I would know it right away. Tried it on the back and it was fine, did the whole piece and all is well, so far.So here's what I have gleaned: I like the smooth finish and fast easy application. I would probably just continue spraying laquer if I used it again. That's what professional painters have been doing forever, and it is adequate, but not great. Most people would not be willing to pay a painter to build up 3 or 4 coats of poly on an entire kitchen. It's quick and dirty. Perfectly suited to the dusty environment of a house under construction. Like any other tool we have available to us, it has it's place.After reading the previous posts though, personally I will be a lot pickier about where I use it from now on. I would still use it on large, hard to finish pieces. But for the smaller stuff, end tables, etc. I'm beginning to think it's not worth the trade-offs. I'll get my final coat of poly on tomorrow and let you guys know if I change my tune.
*Got the finish coat on last week. Let it dry and sanded out a couple of small runs, then some 0000 steel wool and wax. I have to say it gave a very nice finish without a lot of work. Given the lack of durability that has been pointed out, I don't think I will go this route again.
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