Was the ruler touching the teeth or the body on the blade? What make and model is the saw? Did you make sure there was no cosmoline, packing material or other foreign matter on the arbor where it contacts the blade? 1/16 is waaay too much. On a saw with new bearings it should be about half of a thousandth of an inch.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
~ Denis Diderot
Replies
The only reason I ask for the make and model is so I can pull up the manual and exploded view. Often by looking at the exploded view I can see possible causes for the problem.
Good luck and congratulations on your upgrade.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
~ Denis Diderot
I think the brand is as good as any and better than most in it's price range.
It looks like the inner flange is one piece with the arbor but it looks as if arbor replacement is pretty easy and straightforward.
I'm still a little leery of your method for checking runout. Can you borrow a mag base and dial indicator? If your runout is really that bad it should be really obvious when the saw is running. Have you made a test cut?
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
~ Denis Diderot
"The saw is Steel City, model 35905. I just looked at the manual and it looks like the arbor can be replaced, but it can be difficult to remove the arbor. Any ideas ?"
This sounds like a question for Sarge. Any thoughts re: this Steel City?
It would appear from the manual that you remove one jam nut and the arbor slides out in your hands.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
Absolutely. The "call" to Sarge is mainly due to his close association with Steel City, and maybe some insight as to the source of this particular problem.
Whatever it is I'd bet a months pay SC will make it right!
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
SC has a pretty good reputation for standing behind their products from what I've heard.
If I was in the market they would be on my short list.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
I can testify to that. I've required a new switch for my midi lathe and a new motor for my mini dust collector. They replaced both without hassle.Chris @ http://www.flairwoodwork.spaces.live.com(soon to be http://www.flairwoodworks.com)
- Success is not the key to happines. Happiness is the key to success. If you love what you are doing, you will be successful. - Albert Schweitzer
You are right, an arbor face not milled flat is a problem.
Let us know the outcome of your call, I bet they will make you happy.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
~ Denis Diderot
Quang,
I had a similar problem years back when I bought and set up my Jet cabinet saw.
Jet shipped me a new part and sent over a field service guy to install it and set me up. I suspect Steel City would do the same.
No manufacturer can guarantee perfection out of the box, every time. The way to measure them is on how they respond to an honest problem and stand behind their product and their brand.
I think when you are dealing with a more portable product, bringing it back or shipping it back to the retailer is the way to go. But when you are talking about a heavy machine that took hours to set up, I think you have to give the manufacturer a chance to respond.
Good luck, and let us know how it works out.
Frank
Have you started the saw yet? If you really have that much wobble, you'll definitely notice it when the saw is started.
With the blade guard in place, lower the blade below the tabletop. Stand away from the saw, hit the start switch, and listen. If you don't like what you hear, shut it down and call the vendor.
I've always heard that Steel City has great customer service and suspect that they will help you get this fixed.
Blades are all flat, right?
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Lately we have had a problem with folks putting a block of wood under the blade then really bearing down on the nut when they install the blade. This can warp a blade.
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Don’t know why this problem seems to come in waves but is does. <!----><!---->
I hadn't thought about non-flat blades, but that could sure cause a problem that would show up on any saw they're used on.I've never understood why some folks want to torque an arbor nut like it was a head bolt. I run mine down finger tight then use the wrench to give it a snug up of ~1/8 of a turn. That's always worked just fine and I've never had a problem - except once.The "once" was when I installed my new stacked dado cutter and one of the shims slipped into an arbor thread. I snugged it up like always and when I turned on the saw, it started vibrating something awful. I immediately shut it down and - after I realized what had happened - got a set of magnetic shims. Nary a problem since. - lol
You are correct, of course.
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However we find problems with blades often show up on new machines. People check them carefully and expect more out of them.
>Arbor nut and arborI hardly use a table saw. Am focusing on hand tools for now to get my basic skill level up and I do the ripping and resawing on my very nice/quality bandsaw. So the nice cabinet saw will happen in the distant future.I have a cheepy Delta that I have filed and flattened and tweaked to make it pretty darn accurate. On my arbor is a place for a wrench to hold the arbor from turning while I put another wrench on the nut and snug or remove as needed. I think the wrench sizes are 20 mm and 22 mm. I bought nice Craftsman open end wrenches that I only use on this saw.What I am getting at is why is it my cheepy has wrench flats but some nice saws people are using a block of wood rather than a wrench on each side of blade? Do the nice saws not have the wrench flats on the arbor or do the people not know they are there?PS: the run out on this Delta was about two thou or less measured with a dial indicator on carbides when saw was new. Yah I was shocked/happy especially since the saw had a broken plastic hand wheel on the blade tilt when I bought it off the showroom on good guy deal. It had taken a hit some time or another.
Edited 12/13/2008 12:59 am by roc
Great question. Opens up lots of issues.
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They should have flats. I would imagine there are some that do not. On those with flats I think that the block of wood is easier and they don’t realize the damage they could do.
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What features to put on a machine is a tough decision since features add cost. In the conventional retail structure the cost of any feature gets multiplied by 4 when the retail price is figured. Thus there is a prejudice towards features that will make the tool easier to sell.
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I have never designed woodworking machinery since there are a great number of really good companies doing that already. I have designed other machines and guessing what features the customer will like it always a bit of a guess. I have designed machines with features that customers didn’t like. I have designed machines that customers requested then didn’t like when they saw the prototype.
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On my really successful designs there have usually been a couple prototypes to put in front of the customer before they were truly happy. Last year I designed three prototypes for comment and then the customer bought 102 of the machines. This is pretty easy when you have one customer. It is a lot more complicated if you have 102 individual woodworkers.
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Finally the tool industry is an industry where price doesn’t equate to quality very readily.
That is why I think the FWW tool tests are so very valuable. We do our testing differently so our results don’t always agree. We put much more emphasis on how long a saw blade stays sharp, for example. This is much more important in a saw mill than for someone making fine furniture. However I do very much admire the methodology of the FWW results. They are also extremely important in the tool industry. After SystiMatic was ranked dead last in everything but price a few years ago there was a big shakeup at Simonds. The SystiMatic blades have been improved to the point where there is actually a problem keeping up with the demand.
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Good deal, are they sending a replacement?
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
~ Denis Diderot
After I described a few things, the SC folks determined that the saw were messed up due to shiping.
They're shipping a new saw.
It happens, glad they took good care of you and thanks for the update.
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Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.~ Denis Diderot
I'm sorry I missed this post but... sounds as if you got good advice to call Steel City with the issue. I don't anticipate any further problem after you did contact them but... if you are not satisfied at that point call SC again and specifically ask for Jim Box.. the technical department head. Just tell him Sarge sent you.
Again.. since you already contacted them there will likely be no need for that as Steel City is committed to customer service and the fact they provide quality equipment at a fair price.
Sarge..
Edited 12/9/2008 12:04 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
the priest is a tool doing GODS work,and a mighty fine tool he is.more on that later.A much better solusion wood be to use the entrails of satan.
aaahhh . . . ? aaaalllllrrrrriiiiigggghhhht ? sure.coarse you know all the problems we been having with priests of late. And they are so readily available and Satan entrails are so rare, practically nonexistent. To put it politely.Kings haven't been far behind in actual effectiveness to be human beings.I must say I am in Denis's camp on this one.
Quang, I've had occasional to contact Steel City customer support for their mortiser, and the service was beyond outstanding. Let us know how things turn out!
They were quick to reply to my questions. I received the replacement saw last Friday. While the delivery man was waiting, I started checking the saw out. The table was flat when I ran a straight edge on it. However the grand finale was when I installed the saw blade. I tried an used WWII, the wobble was 1/8 inch. Then I tried a brand new WII. The same wobble was seen. I rejected the package on the spot. I'm returning all SC stuffs this week. I'll shop for real equipment.
Edited 12/17/2008 12:21 am ET by Quang
I think the issue has been addressed through all the posts but it brings up another question. I used to see in catalogs extremely flat, round plates to use instead of a blade to test runout. There single purpose was eliminate blade imperfections when testing for runout. Now I don't see them anymore. Does anybody know of a source for them? How about blade stabalizers? I used to see them in catalogs and now don't see them anymore either.
Is this what you're looking for? http://www.amazon.com/Freud-CD008-CALIBRATION-SANDING-Arbor/dp/B00004RK0I I believe most sawblade makers, e.g. Freud, Forrest still offer stabilizers for thin kerf blades.
Jim
That's what I was referring to. I'll look for stabalizers as you suggested. Thanks.
I was looking for my stabilizers, but misplaced somewhere.
However I tried 2 WWI blades, with the same same results.
There are no many ways to install a saw blade correctly.
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