Has anyone seen a recent review/comparison on current model Scroll Saws in any of the woodworking magazines?
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Replies
FWW had one a while back on medium priced units. They reviewed Delta, DeWalt, and a few others.
December 03 Workbench reviewed 5 of them. The picked the Craftsman as best. I like my variable speed Ridgid, but it's the only one I've ever had and what do I know? They seem like pretty simple machines. I'm sure if I was really serious about it, I'd get a Hegner (?) for thousands of dollars and really get all worked up about telling everyone else how inadequate their machines were, but then,...maybe not.
Good luck. That's a good issue of Workbench - I've built just about all of those projects in there.
Has a sort of new Dremel? Works OK.. I do not use it much.. Not much better than my old 1970's Craftsmen cept it takes both pin and non-pinned blades AND has Variable speed.. Lately I saw a review that it was good.. Forget where.. DeWalters was rated VERY good but much more cash!
Guess you pay extra for that yellow paint,...
Using a scroll saw about 18 months ago was the first time that I realized that reading glasses were going to be an important part of my woodworking future. I kept thinking 'this thing's vibrating too much, I can't see the line.' Turns out the old 20-20 vision is just not happening for close-in work, now.
Forest Girl's a big time scroll sawyer - she's pointed out web sites that have been useful to me in the past. Which one is the best machine, FG?
"They seem like pretty simple machines." Yeah, right. It doesn't take long working with a crappy one to find out how "unsimple" they are. Trust me, I found out the hard way.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hey forestgirl; After reading your scroll saw reviews, I got the tool itch, so I had to go check them out. I didn't even know I wanted one till yesterday.
So it turns out, they are blowing out the Delta's at Home Depot. I ended up buying the 350LS with the leg set for $140.00 can. I hope I like it.
I'm glad I got one for a good price, but I'm annoyed, because now I have to convince myself that I actually needed it. View Image
Cheers. Walker1
"350LS with the leg set for $140.00" Oooooohhhh, I wish you handn't told me that!!
OK, seriously, if you don't like it, at least they'll take it back, no questions asked!! Home Depot? Hmmmm, they don't carry the Delta around here. One thing about scroll saws, you might not use one very often, but when that's what you need, that is what you need.
If you want to have fun with it right away, run down to the book store and pick up the current magazines that have holiday patterns in them -- I made a whole bunch of Christmas ornaments 2 years ago, and it was really fun! My favorite was the ones that hold a small round picture frame in them (how do you spell "Forstner"?) and I made dog bones, mouses....uhhhh, mice, and hunt caps for the horse owners. I custom-made one parrot. People put pics of their pets in them and hang them from the tree.
Hopefully, you've seen my admonition to buy the best blades. If not, they are found here:http://www.mikesworkshop.com
Have fun!!!
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Edited 10/26/2005 7:50 pm by forestgirl
Well I unpacked my Delta SS350 srollsaw, cleaned it up, and tried it out.
It was in perfect order right out of the box. The quality of cut it delivers is great, theres very little vibration, and it has a lot of nice features. It seems like Delta got it right here. I haven't made anything yet, but I made my scrap pile into a bunch of smaller curly scraps. View Image
Funny thing. I brought my daughter out to the shop to show it to her, and she said it's the same one they used in shop class. She said there was always a wait to get time on it, and it never broke down. So I guess if it can take a bunch of high school kids beating on it, it should last awhile. I still can't get over the price, I paid more than that for my Jigsaw.
Cheers. Walker1
Well, Walker, sounds like you're gonna have some fun! Have you picked up any patterns yet? Do you have the low-down on the basics?? Things like wrapping in packing tape, for instance. Darn it! This is making me want to scroll, and I can't get distracted with that right now. It's all your fault!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I have the Delta and have a great deal of difficulty with vibration. I notice it most when I cut 3-D ornaments, candle sticks... It has gotten so bad that it is not worth all the effort to make these kinds of items. They are a lot of the reason I bought the saw in the first place.
Which model Delta do you have, cskip. I am sincere in wanting to know the problems (or successes) people have with different models. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I'll be back home this evening and will check and update my post.
I have a 40-540 SS-11. To be fair to Delta, we lubricated it and let it run for a little while. Then I made sure I had the correct size saw blades..... The vibration was a little better but it was still difficult to cut accurately.
Hi again! I'll paste in my reply from the other thread. This is feeling like deja vu all over again! (Can't wait 'til Spring Training, can you tell?)
Cskip, your saw (the 40-540, SS-11) and mine (SS250) look remarkably alike, but I'm pretty sure that yours is one generation earlier than mine. Can't tell what the technical differences are just looking at pics, but sounds like one of two things may be the situation:
You got a lemon --or--
Delta made some definite improvements to the SS250
My condolences. I had a similar experience with the Dremel I bought many years ago (and paid nearly $160 for!) and I've never quite forgiven them for it. They really should stick to rotary tools, LOL. I'm sure the SS250 wouldn't keep me happy if I were doing fretwork and the like, but it's really a very capable saw for more routine scrolling, and the price is so "just right."forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I just got back from the woodworking show in Hickory, NC and talked to a Delta employee. He said that the saw I have (250) is not a big enough saw to cut 1 1/2" stock expecially not hard wood! He said that it is really intended for cutting wood of 3/4" or thinner. He also suggested that I check to see if any of bushings on the inside of the he have dry rotted (which I'll do later).
When I originally bought the saw I was only cutting little things like plywood Christmas ornaments and the saw was fine for that. I had no idea that it really couldn't handle thicker wood. In fact, it never occured to me to even ask what it's limitations were. Now I guess I'll have to save up for a bigger saw!
"the saw I have ... is not a big enough saw to cut 1 1/2" stock expecially not hard wood!" Holy Smokes, I'd say! Didn't realize what you were trying to do with it. One Universal Law to keep in mind: "A scroll saw is not a band saw." ROFL!! Methinks you'd better save up for one of them there Hegner's or sump'in.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
It's interesting though... I have cut 10 3-D ornaments and three candlesticks out of 1.5" stock (hardwood). It has become increasingly difficult - guess I wore it out, huh?
"guess I wore it out, huh?" Uhhh, yay'uh, sounds like it! Poor thing.
When I think back to the days during which I made the ill-fated Dremel purchase, it's hysterically funny. I had no, zero, nada shop to work in, thought I could use the little Dremel for lots more than a scroll saw was ever intended to do. Oh well, live and learn. It didn't even scroll well, let alone all that other stuff!
I'm going to wrap it up and put it under the tree for hubby this Christmas -- he can use it to cut antlers with when he's making his knife handles. Ooooooo, does that stuff stink!!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hi there. I've been using the DW788 for a couple of seasons now and have been having a good time with it. It is my first scrollsaw, so I have no experience to compare with. I got it on a lark a coupla years ago thinking I would get around to it one of these days and it just didn't take too long. I only use it seriously this time of year to bang out a bunch of Christmas ornaments for friends. Its nice to see people talking so much about scrolling while I have mine out and in full swing.If folks can afford that price of saw, it sure will help them enjoy the fun of scrolling. I've also gotten on line with Mike and the FD blades. Watching smoke come up from a small piece of work is no fun at all. I do have a question for you from some of your recent posts. I'm not a very savvy chatroom poster and I don't know what 'ROFL' means. Could you clue me in? And thanks for turning me on to Mike and the FDs.
Roll on the floor laughing. Who/what's Mike and FD's?
Oh, now, Cskip, you're not rhyming things with blue duck are you? Too funny. I thought I posted the link all over God's creaton, but here we go again. Flying Dutchman blades, found at Mikes' Workshop:
http://www.mikesworkshop.com
If anyone finds another brand of scroll saw blades that are as good, let alone better, please let me know.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Oops. Rhyming was unintentional!
Now I'm confused (like that's new??) I went backj to the beginning of this discussion and read the comparison of the Delta 250 and 350. Mine is a 350 - wonder why the manual says 250 on it? Regardless, I've killed it, or at least severely injured it. I'll try FD blades and see if that helps until I can find the money for a new one. Are there significant reasons to spend the extra $ for a Hawk, Hegner or Excaliber instead of DeWalt? (remember, this is the killer of saws asking!) The most obvious thing for me right now is how long I would have to wait in order to be able to afford the bigger dogs.
Cskip, for the type of scrolling you do, I'd think a DeWalt or Delta 22" would be minimum. The smaller Deltas (smaller in more than simply throat depth) just aren't going to stand up to that type of sawing in the long haul. Having never ventured into the mid-range saws, I have no idea if they'd hold up over time or not. Someone around here probably knows, though. Bearfret (or is it Fretbear? sorry!) just started using one, so he'll hopefully keep us posted.
I have no idea why your owner's manual doesn't match your saw. You sure? Ooops. You can download the OM from the deltawoodworking.com site. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
"I'll try FD blades and see if that helps...." Based on what you said about the severe vibration, don't expect blades to make any difference. You need to find the source of the vibration -- bushings, bearings? something bent? whatever -- and fix it (if possible). Since it sounds like you kinda(!) pushed the saw behond its capabilities, we can only hope the injury isn't fatal. Oh dear.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
forestgirl; No patterns yet, and not much in the way of scrollsawing know how either. I guess I'll have to do some reading and net surfing. First I have to finish the overhaul on my shop, it's progressing at a snails pace. One things for sure though, it's only a good buy if I produce some nice work with it.
Speaking of good buys, that sale on Bessys at Lee Valley is killing me.
I need mooooore clamps!!!
Cheers. Walker1
Well, at least you have snails with their little back-pack houses. We're stuck with the lowly slug.
There are just a few little things that make beginning scrolling so much easier to tackle. Among them are learning to do a 180* and learning how to accomodate to blade lead/drift which, unlike the bandsaw, is an unavoidable fact of life with SS blades. One of the books I have, can't remember which off-hand, stood above the others in its presentation of learning beginning techniques, really took the frustration level way down. I'll sit down with them some time this weekend and refresh the ol' neurons.
I was dumb enough to select, as my first project, something with a nearly-complete circle as the base of the design. That's like the hardest thing to do! ROFL. And to top it off, it required a subsequent perfectly centered Forstner hole dead-center. Got me some kindling out of that project, LOL.
"First I have to finish the overhaul on my shop...." Best of luck! Overhaul's are exciting when they're done! but the process.....aaarrrrgh!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
My guess is you will be very happy with it. I've had one for a little over a year now and have probably put it to more use than it is designed for with over 800 completed pieces (I stack cut a bunch for production runs) using primarily hardwoods (walnut, cherry, maple, oak, ash, hickory, purpleheart, cocobolo, sapele, lacewood, etc....) ! I've had to replace both blade holders a couple of times, as well as various springs and spacers in the top blade holder assembly. The lower arm bent, most likely due to the 1,200 or so blade changes I've made. Trying to clamp spirals tight enough to hold in the Delta quick change system with sideways pressure is my guess at the cause of the bent arm.
All that said, it is a very, very good entry level machine. Runs quiet and very smooth thru the different speeds. Table is pretty solid, although my tilt adjustment is starting to "go". Cuts are true, and it handled 1 1/2" thick walnut and maple (candlestick holders) with no noticable strain on the motor.
Blades are the most important "accessory" you can get. Forestgirl is spot on recommending Flying Dutchman and Mikes Woodshop. I busted thru 4 or 500 Olson blades (probably the reason for many of the part failures!) before discovering them. Also, Mikes description of the different type of blades and their uses is priceless.
I have also used Craftsman (not bad), Ryobi, and Dremel entry level scroll saws. While they also cut wood, my preference was the Delta, with Craftsman a close second.
I just upgraded to a DeWalt 788. Time will tell if I made as good a choice the second time around as I did the first. Can't wait for my next internal debate over whether I should purchase a Hawk or Hegner, although that Excalibur looks good too.!!! Good (or bad?) thing that won't happen for a couple years.
bearfretworks,
Thanks for your post. I'm looking to get a scroll saw into my shop as well. I've had a chance to run the Ryobi 16", Craftsman 16", and DeWalt 20" models.The Ryobi is out for me. The DeWalt obviously has more capacity, but I actually found the Craftsman to be pretty good. Maybe I haven't used it enough, but at the moment it seems like a good deal, especially when I consider that the Craftsman is $150, versus $500 for the DeWalt.I'd be interested to hear what ohers have to say about how the DeWalt compares to the Craftsman.
Both are good saws. I cut a few stacks of ornaments last night on the new Dewalt and WOW, what a complete night and day difference from the Delta 350. Quiet, smooth, stable, perfectly perpendicular cuts from top to bottom (stacks made up of 1/8" thick pieces of hard maple - 3, QS white oak - 3, and ash - 3) I think the DeWalt is more of a "commercial" grade saw intended to be run day in and day out, hour after hour while the Craftsman is a "hobby" saw intended for intermittent use. Don't discount the Dremel 1800 either. One of my relatives has it and it is also very smooth.
bearfretworks,
You put your finger on the main question. I don't know how far I will take the scroll work. I may just do it occasionally, but if it is like other aspects of my woodworking, I might end up doing it a lot more than I at first thought I would.
Bear, if you have the time, would you mind surfing over to WWA and give your impressions of the DW788 to one of the guys there? He posted last night asking about it, but no one is answering. Here's the link:http://www.woodworking.org/InfoExchange/viewtopic.php?t=5085
Thanks!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I could, and might later, but it would be just what I've already typed. I'd prefer to wait until I run it hard for a few weeks so I can give a more balanced review. Now if they were asking about the Delta 350, I'd feel more comfortable as I literally ran that poor thing into the ground and it held up admirably - considering the purchase price. I expect a whole lot more out of the Dewalt as it cost a whole lot more.
Also, in case anyone cares, paid 434 with UPS next day delivery to Alaska from Amazon.com. Could't come within $100 of that locally. Now if I could get the same shipping cost on thin hardwoods........
" UPS next day delivery to Alaska" wow!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
The review mentioned above covers most of the intro-level saws. I totally disagree with them on their choice of Craftsman as the top saw in the group. They picked it primarily because (a) the table tilts both ways and (b) it has a light (of all things) built in. Don't get me wrong, a light is nice, but c'mon! it's not near as important as a quality blade-gripping system, quick-release and a few other things. As far as the table-tilt goes, most people (vast majority) don't need the bi-directional thing.
To correct a statement from above, I'm not a "big time" scroll sawyer, but I did get into it for a Christmas marketing thing and learned a heck of a lot during that time. There are 3 tiers of saws: Intro level, intermediate and "Wow, you paid how much??!"
As critical and the choice of saw is the choice of blades. Again, I know this from agonizing experience. Don't even bother picking up anything in a store, it'll be a waste of time. Order Flying Dutchman Blades from:
http://www.mikesworkshop.com The only other blade I've been tempted to use is the PS Wood blades, but I haven't tried one yet.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Edited 10/26/2005 2:46 am by forestgirl
forestgirl,
You wrote this:
"I totally disagree with them on their choice of Craftsman as the top saw in the group."Have you used the Craftsman scroll saw? I assume you wouldn't post such an opinion without actually using the saw.
Edited 10/26/2005 4:36 pm ET by MatthewSchenker
Forestgirl,
Still waiting for you to explain your criticism of Craftsman:
"I totally disagree with them on their choice of Craftsman as the top saw in the group."Starting to sound like you citicized without actual experience. But please correct me if I am wrong.
I'm still waiting to hear how Forestgirl arrived at her negative appraisal of the Craftsman saw.She wrote this:
"I totally disagree with them on their choice of Craftsman as the top saw in the group."Since she's shielding her eyes from my posts, perhaps someone else could inquire about her assessment. Seems like a reasonable request to ask how someone arrives at a conclusion about a scroll saw -- in a discussion about scroll saws!
Edited 10/28/2005 1:42 pm ET by MatthewSchenker
Matt,
I guess it takes a brick to fall on some people before they finally get the message: your taunting is being ignored, and rightfully so.
-Jazzdogg-
"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie
<I guess it takes a brick to fall on some people before they finally get the message...>
A brick seems rather small and underpowered actually.Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
Ardmore, I just finished a web page on the Delta's. Click here to see it.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Thanks everyone and especially forestgirl, for the reviews on Delta. I was also wondering if the "variable speed" is a desirable/usable feature to consider? The only scrollsaw I have used was a DeWalt at Marc Adams School of Woodworking. Don't know what model it was.
Don
Variable speed is an absolute must on a scroll saw.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Take a look at the Dewalt saw. More expensive that what you find in a home center, but worth it. Saw is actually made by Excalibur. I know my Woodcraft store has it set up to try out.
I'll do that if I can locate a dealer in my area, there is no Woodcraft locally.
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