I am going to make around ten raised panel doors in the next year – Will a 3hp router handle that or is it a shaper job all the way. I am leaning towards the shaper because this is a fairly heavy-duty application and also I am having trouble finding router bit sets for doors (I want to use cope and stick bits) and there are numerous shaper cutters for this. That in itself should probably tell me something. What do you all think?
Thanks, Terry
Replies
Terry, I have a Freud raised panel door router bit set that includes the raised panel bit, the cope and the stick bit. They also threw in a multi purpose bit that I haven't had time to play with yet. I've done at least 50 raised panel doors with them and haven't had any problems. I have a 3 1/4 hp PC router in a table and it works fine. Although it is certainly possible to do this without a router table, I would not recommend it.
Just as you would with a shaper, make a few practice runs with the stick bit to get the height correct then run all of your sticks at once. Once the sticks are done, you can cut your rails and stiles but remember to compensate for the cope.
Then, practice the copes on some scrap so that they fit the sticks precisely. You'll know you have it right when the tennon of the cope seats fully into the mortise of the stick and the cope matches the stick profile perfectly. It will take a couple of practice runs but its not that difficult. Take a look on the FWW main website, there are two jigs for router tables that work great for this type of application.
When you cut the raised panels, take a few passes to get to the final dimensions. Run all the panels through for each depth change. Cut the sides of the panels first then the endgrain. This will prevent tearout since the material that would have torn is already gone.
Steve - in Northern California
Steve,
I meant to say "interior and exterior raised panel doors". I have made many cabinets with my router with a CMT set - works very nice. I am concerned that cutting 1 3/8" and 1 3/4" may be too much for the router for that many doors.
Terry
Yeah, I see your point. I don't have a lot of time on a shaper so I really can't tell you if it would work any better or not.Steve - in Northern California
Steve,
Newbie taking notes here...cut endgrain second?
thanks, BG
It works for me but then I tend to do things that work for me and may not be whats in the book. As a beginner I would recommend you not listen to me but do it the way the book says. Steve - in Northern California
End grain first, less tear out. Can do it second but why would you if there is a better way?
BrentTOOLz,
I'll try not to jump to conclusions, but your post seems very, how shall I say it...commercial...
Edited 7/19/2002 2:12:00 PM ET by MattSchenker
....Along with 5 others on this forum posted this morning by the same person.
Be seeing you...
Edited 7/19/2002 2:22:06 PM ET by TDKPE
Terry,
Check out the "shaper vs. router table" discussion currently going on under "Tools For Woodworking" here. There's some good info. there about routers/shapers that you might find helpful and informative as far as which way to go.
When it comes to building passage doors, there's no doubt that having a shaper is a plus. Actually, if you're going to do it on a regular basis, it's better to have more than one. However, you can build these doors with a router, table saw, or with hand tools if you have the time, energy, skill, and patience. As for me, I opt for the shapers on passage doors. There is the cost, of course; the machine,the tooling, more tooling, a power feeder maybe later, jigs, and so on, but in my book, it will all be money well spent because of the superior capability and quality of cut that is possible with a shaper. Don't forget the time involved in learning a new machine either; but that is one of the pleasures of woodworking, IMO.
Let me take exception here to some comments that were made earlier in this thread. First of all, I cut copes first, almost always. That way when the pattern or edge cut is done, any tear out from the cope(or end grain cut) is cleaned up. I recommend(on the pattern or edge cut) for the best cut and best fit, that you offset the infeed to outfeed fences by about 1/16".This assures a full profile cut and cleans up any tear out from your cope cuts. If the rails are under about 7", as in many cabinet doors, they become difficult and unsafe to run on edge without a jig. In this case, I just run some random length pieces on edge, cut to length, make a coped out backing board to mate w/ the short rail's edge, and then cut the cope. Pieces this short don't usually happen on passage doors, but sometimes on sidelites this is necessary.
With regard to raised panels; I always cut the end grain before the edges. I can think of no exceptions to this. There can be significant tear out when raising the ends of panels, as you no doubt are aware, therefore, I highly stress that these cuts be done first. The edge cut will clean up the tear out and you will be on your way.wb
WB,
Thanks for info - that is exactly what I have been looking for. Sounds as if you have built more than a few doors. I have decided to go with a shaper. Could you recommend any cutters that you have experience with? Have you used any of the Grizzly cutters? On passage doors do you use any other joints like a mortise and tenon?
Terry
Anyone have any experience with the Delta benchtop router/shaper that sells for under $300?
Don't buy that Delta router/shaper it is junk. Either get a Shaper or a good router.
Thanks for the info.
Why do you say it is junk. I and my neighbor ,who is also an experenced woodworker ,are amazed at the performance and price. It does not have the problems of dust build up in the motor like the table setup with a router and we both have had no problems with the units performance. For $229 at Lowes is is a bargan. It is not made to compare to a $500 stationary shaper. We have used 1 1/2 diameter ogee bits in hard wood in one pass with no change in motor speed. Can you explain what is junk about it?
I agree. Bought my Delta shaper as an alternative to a new (powerful) router and shop built or manufactured table. Very happy with it, does everything I need a router table for and keeps the router free for other tasks. The way I read the posts, many W Workers have two or more routers, one of which is permanently mounted in a table.
I am in the process of designing a fence att. to make it one piece and add t-track. The fact that it is an belt driven induction motor geared to 12.5k rpm allows it to be smooth and have more power than a 15 amp. universal motor router with a speed control. I also plan to build the top extenstion.
Edited 12/15/2002 11:04:14 AM ET by AMBDDDS
Terry,
I use mostly Freeborn tool of Spokane, Wash. You can reach them at 1 800 523 8988 or wwwfreeborntool.com. I don't believe they sell direct. I buy through a dealer. They offer matched sets for doors, and they also do custom work. You should be able to get the name of a dealer in your area and a catalog with a call. I have no experience w/Grizzly.
The door sets that I use are cope and pattern and the tenon made with these sets is about 5/8"x3/4" (on a 1 3/4" door). I use 5/8"x4" hardwood dowels also. An "average" door has about 24 of these dowels in it, connecting the stiles to the rails. Coupled w/ the small tenons, there is plenty of strength.
If you don't have a convenient way to dowel, you might make m&t joints with a router and a mortising template. I think if I was going to do this, I would most likely make loose tenons, mortising into both the end of the rails and the edge of the stiles at appropriate locations. If done properly, it's probably superior to dowels anyway. At any rate, good luck and have fun with the project! wb
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