Replies

1. 
   Ricks503 | Jun 19, 2006 09:37pm | #1

   Actually, for the kitchen, you want a little jaggedness in the edge (as seen under a good microscope) - that is where you get your cutting from 

   ( I am also a cook and have reseached sharpening knives )  I do agree that a super sharp edge on a chisel will dull or chip almost on the first pass though.  That is where the secondary bevel comes in.

   1 - measure the board twice, 2 - cut it once, 3 - measure the space where it is supposed to go        4 - get a new board and go back to step 1
1. 
   philip | Jun 20, 2006 10:49am | #2

   Rick, you are dead right. I suspect Comrade Seatoe is being mischievous. In addition I would hate to see the state of his nail varnish if he were a full time cabinet maker(;)Philip Marcou

2. 
   seatoe | Jun 20, 2006 06:20pm | #3

   I was using Japanese style knives as the sharpness criteria and also the knives made by Furi. Furi knives use a sharp vee edge without any secondary angle. They are  made in Australia and have a special sharpening tool for their maintenance. I do use a secondary angle on chisels and plane blades. I don't press very hard on the fingernail. Just enough that it will slide (not sharp) and tendency to dig-in (sharp enough). I use the scary/sharp method of sharpening these tools. When sharp, I then buff them on a cotton wheel charged with jewelers rouge until they are mirror bright. I find they stay sharp a long time.

   Edited 6/21/2006 12:24 pm ET by seatoe

   Edited 6/21/2006 12:36 pm ET by seatoe

1. 
   BossCrunk | Jun 20, 2006 08:13pm | #4

   The fingernail test is as good as any.  I use it all the time.

   I consider sharpening a necessary nuisance.  Some here make a career of it.

   Edited 6/20/2006 2:25 pm ET by BossCrunk

2. 
   joeBleau | Jun 22, 2006 06:34am | #8

   Curious.  My experience has been that buffing (particularly with a cotton buffingwheel) a honed edge rounds it over and destroys the sharpness.  Not only my experience but pretty much the concensus of everything I have read on sharpening.  Carvers sometimes buff (preferably with a jute buffing wheel), but it will certainly round over a plane iron or a newly sharpened chisel.  It does make them nice and shiny though.

3. 
   jazzdogg | Jun 21, 2006 04:32am | #5

   "I do agree that a super sharp edge on a chisel will dull or chip almost on the first pass though.  That is where the secondary bevel comes in."

   I'm not trying to pick a fight, but it sound to me as though you may be confusing sharpness with the appropriate bevel angle. I can hone a mortising chisel to just as fine an edge as a paring chisel, but I wouldn't think if striking the paring chisel with a mallet - not because of the sharpness, but because of the bevel angle.

    

    -Jazzdogg-

   "Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie

1. 
   RMillard | Jun 21, 2006 12:48pm | #6

   I agree with Jazzdog. Sharpness is a loosely defined term; so I think more of the quality of the honing . My carving tools and plane blades are equally well honed, but the carving tools are by definition “sharper” because of the more acute grind angle, and therefore they are more fragile than the plane blades.

   I’m a fanatic about sharpening, but I don’t invest a significant amount of time doing it. I go through two grits on an oil stone, 4 grits of sandpaper and a polish with diamond paste. I don’t bother with jigs; they just get in the way.

   Rob Millard

1. 
   jazzdogg | Jun 21, 2006 06:31pm | #7

   Not surprisingly, you and I appear to see eye-to-eye on this one, Rob.

   I see sharpening as comprising two processes: (1) Shaping the cutting tool to a shape suitable for the task at hand, and (2) Honing (replacing larger scratches with smaller scratches) - also to a level suitable to the task at hand.

   I wouldn't describe a tool that has a razor-sharp edge, but the incorrect geometry (shape), as properly sharpened any more than I would describe an obviously dull tool with the proper geometry as properly sharpened.

   Many turners don't spend any time honing their gouges - they go back to work immediately after grinding; that's the level of sharpening (shaping & polishing)suitable to the task they are performing.

   I've seen novice carvers hone parting tools until they shined like a mirror without first correcting the basic shape; despite the fact that these tools were undeniably well-polished (honed), their shape wasn't suitable for the task at hand - their tools weren't suitably sharp.

   At its most basic, Knotheads can probably agree that a sharp tool has two surfaces (e.g., the back and bevel of a plane iron) with an intersection of zero width.

   However, it seems to me that any meaningful discussion of sharpening must acknowledge the suitability of both the shape and polish (level of honing) of the tool under discussion.

   Thanks for sharing your valuable experience!

    

   -Jazzdogg-

   "Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie

   Edited 6/21/2006 11:36 am by jazzdogg

   Edited 6/21/2006 11:38 am by jazzdogg

   Edited 6/21/2006 11:39 am by jazzdogg