Its 32 degrees in S.W.Mich this morning and I am trying to decide on the heat for my 22X22 garage workshop. Not a garage any more it’s unattached, insulated and a slab floor. Been using a 240V. space heater but I am really interested in the Enerjoy radiant heat panels. Just not sure if they would be good as a primary heat source. To maintain 50 degree or so temp. Does anyone have any advise or comments?
One particular question is whether the slab floor would act as a heat sink and decrease the efficiency.
Replies
You bet the slab will act as a heat sink. More like a heat sucker.
No matter what you do in terms of adding heat, if you can afford it or have ceiling height to spare, you'd be well advised to do something to thermally isolate the slab from the rest of the space.
An insulated, raised wood floor would be ideal. But I've done it in my own shop by recycling carpet pad and actual carpet in certain areas in my shop. It makes a big difference, not only in how well the shop holds heat, but also on how it feels on my feet and legs.
Incidentally, I use a wall-hung direct vent natural gas heater in my shop, made by Empire. Easy to install, not all that expensive (if there is a gas line to the shop already), and it comes with a thermostat so it will keep the shop at a constant temperature. I never use it that way though, because I'm only out there sporadically in the winter...
Zolton
* Some people say I have a problem because I drink hydraulic brake fluid. But I can stop any time I want.
I helped a friend build a 20 X24 shop with a slab floor here in Maine and we've found that the floor stays much warmer than expected.
He uses a bottled gas fired wall furnace to keep the temp reasonable (40 -50 degrees) at night and a wood stove during work times. It takes very little wood to keep it warm with a cheap, cast iron airtight stove.
Six inch walls with fiberglass. Can't remember how much in the ceiling. Composition floor mats at work stations.
Fewer accidental fire worries with a slab when using a wood stove.
My smart-aleck answer used to be when I read stuff like this was "move to where it's warmer"! Can't even think of the last time it got down to 32 here in sunny Florida. However, after all the trouble with the insurance industry in the Gulf Coast states I'm ready to more where you are. I'd build twice the shop, half the house, and swap my big AC for a big heater!
Guess this didn't answer your question at all, just wanted to vent a little bit, sorry!
Can't even think of the last time a hurricane hit Minnesota.
a Couple of questions/comments. First off is the issue of getting a furnace (I am looking for one right now, I have (between me and my father) installed a few furnaces over the years but right now it is getting vary hard to find anyone that will sell you one with out doing the full install. So unless you want to have someone install it for you, you may have issues, keep this in mind.
As for the peaple that use a wood heater, how do you keep the place warm when you are not in it? If I tried to bring a shop up to warm temp after I got home from work it would be ok about bed time (if I was lucky) and that does not consider the condensation on the tools and issues with finishes and glues getting to cold.
I would love a "better" idea then to put in a furnace myself but I (Like the OP) do not see a lot of other options.
Doug
Dear Doug,
I am not a hobbiest so, quickly bring the shop up to temp is not an issue. When I am working out there it is a seven to ten hour shift. The stove actually does a pretty good job of bringing the shop up to temp, from let's say 20 degrees to fifty in about an hour and seventy or so in two hours. As to condensation, I have none. The woodstove dries everything out, but in the summer, I run an AC mainly to keep things dry. I wouldn't recommend spraying anything volatile, unless you have a VERY good spray booth with excellent ventilation. I don't typically apply finishes, but when I do, it is easy to maintain shop temp with a few logs.Best,John
Not sure if this is the right way to reply to all who responded. but here goes.
I guess I have to decide on the amount of investment in heating. Need to be an engineer to assess all the data involved -cost to install ,run verses the diferent types of heat ,heaters fuel safety, insurance,............
the radiant heat(elec) sounds good. but after getting info fron the maker that says to cover 10-15% of the ceiliing it got pretty costly I'ld need 40+ Sq ft. Min. don't have room for a furnace without adding on. Gas fired radiant is great but I have a 7ft. ceiling in half the shop and I'm already bald don't want to scourch my shiny head. I am now thinking about a hanging electric unit with fan in it. It's a toss up which will go up faster gas or electricity. Maybe I should just confine myself to improviing my lathe skills in the winter and only heating a small area when I'm out there.(weekends ususally).
I'm sooo confused ????? but that's nothing unusual.
thanks to all
Dear J,
I use a wood burning stove which you mentioned may be too slow to heat up for you, but there is an alternative: a pellet stove. If you are unfamiliar with them they are similar to a wood stove, in that they burn material in what is essentially an iron or steel box. the difference is that a pellet stove burns wood pellets (compressed sawdust) that are purchased commercially. Another advantage is that the pellets are loaded in a hopper and fed automatically to as a thermostat dictates. You set the thermostat and it burns as needed. Some have electric blowers and whatnot. one other advantage is that the installations can be fairly inexpensive as they don't dump the type of heat that a wood-stove will burn, so (check with local codes, etc.) I have seen some with a simple sidewall exit similar to a gas furnace. The downside is that the stoves are not cheap and you will need to purchase pellets, which, right now, are pretty inexpensive. Just a thought.Best,Johnhttp://www.hometips.com/cs-protected/guides/pellet.html
http://hearth.com/what/pellet/pellet1.html
http://www.quadrafire.com/Products/Pellet_Burning/Pellet_Stoves.asp
You've hit on something I do in my shop each winter - reduce the size of the area I heat. I purchase inexpensive 3 mil clear plastic "painters drop cloths" and staple them to wood strapping I've got screwed to my ceiling. The stuff hangs down and effectively portions off half the shop. I use clear plastic so light from one part of the shop is able to illuminate the other, and so I can see things on the other side...
I cut an access slit in the plastic in order to be able to move easily into the "cold" area - and I hang another partial sheet over that slit so it seals up reasonably well. Then, my (inadequately sized) direct vent gas wall hung heater has a fighting chance to get the "heated" part of the shop warm enough to work in. For about a four dollar investment in plastic each fall, it sure saves a lot of energy, and it makes my shop "livable" in the winter.
I use the "cold" side of my shop mainly for storage and for doing some cutting. The "warm" side is where I spend the bulk of the time at the bench, lathe, and tablesaw.
Zolton
* Some people say I have a problem because I drink hydraulic brake fluid. But I can stop any time I want.
When I go to new shop ( next spring ) I am thinking of going with an overhead infrared system. I have seen these in a couple of places and really liked the effect. Where are you at in S.W. Michigan? I am originally from Kalamazoo area and am there often to visit family.
Dear J,
I have a 40x 30 space with 9' ceilings that is reasonably well insulated, here in CT. I heat the whole thing with a wood burning stove. Quiet, quaint, and a great way to rid the shop of scrap and mistakes (Like I make mistakes), it required no external power and I can maintain 70 degrees pretty much all winter. Like yourself, my concrete floor acts like a large heat sink, but even so, I can do glue ups, whatever.
Best,
John
I live in Ann Arbor, following 10 years in Ada. I know what your weather is like.
I heat my shop with a gas fueled, infra red heater - one panel at 45 degrees at the far end of the shop. (They are available for Propane) I can't think of a better source of heat. It warms "things", not the air. Consequently I've never had ANY rust or condensation problems.
I bought mine from Graingers and also got a thermostat and a very small fan from them. When the thermostat calls for heat, the little fan kicks on at the far end of the shop and vents any possible exhaust odor. You do need a high ceiling though to use these.
Frosty
"I sometimes think we consider the good fortune of the early bird and overlook the bad fortune of the early worm." FDR - 1922
I’m not a heating engineer, I’m just speaking from my own experience. Up until January of this year I was heating the garage with a 240V construction site heater on a thermostat (an accident waiting to happen). The heater burned out on one of the coldest days in the winter -4F (-20C). I noticed the chill in the air almost immediately, however it took almost a 4 days for the shop to cool. There are other factors involved, but I think the large warm cement slab helped out. On the flip side, it took a long time for the shop to warm back up when the new gas heater was installed.
Scientifically speaking, concrete has a high heat capacitance and low thermal conductivity. So it should make a decent heat sink… However if it’s not insulated below you’ll be losing heat that way as well…
I looked into them last year, and price wise it was cheaper for me to go with a forced air gas heater (I already had gas to the shop). I think one panel cost close to what the heater cost me installed. I looked into radiant gas heaters, and the really didn’t work for me either. Again cost was much higher, and installation was much more complicated for me. My second reason was that they take up took up too much ceiling space in my small (non-dedicated) wood shop. I had poor lighting, and poor storage. The roof is needed to solve both of those problems.
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