Hi everybody,
I have a budget of $1500 (less is better) and I am shopping for a bandsaw.
My main usage of the saw is going to be resawing (a 12″ resaw capacity should be plenty enough for me). I am also looking for a saw with decent dust collection.
I want to be able to fit and tension properly a 3/4 inch blade.
There are tons of saw that fit that seems to fit the description so I am a little lost.
Any advice ?
Replies
If you want to tension a 3/4in blade then look for a fabricated machine which will tension a 1in blade in the manufacturer's specs - the makers are always optimistic. I'd suggest looking for a 20in or larger machine, partly because they're generally heavy enough, partly to get at least 12in under the guides. When I bought new a few years back I went for an Agazanni over the Centauro (Minimax/SCM in USA?) or Meber, although there wasn't that much in it. My hit list of features included cast iron trunions, fence capable of adjustment to accommodate drift and Euro guides. You're probably best going with the one who can offer the best service in the short term - there's little to choose between the machines on the market
Scrit
The agazzani seems out of budget.
I found the B-18 with 12" capacity that can fit blades > 1" for $2300 and it goes up from there.
I purchased the minimax/centauro 3hp model. This machine was not worth what I paid for it. While it has plenty of power, it's rough around the edges.
The machine arrives covered in cosmoline. It took me a day to clean all this crap out of it. I questioned them on this. They said that cleaning it up was a right of passage. What a load of crap. LMAO.
Fit and finish are crude. The cage (where blade meets table) is a poor fit, allowing your cutting piece to fall and catch on the table. The fence is so far off 90 degrees to the table it's hilarious. Also, the fence is not adjustable for drift. The upper guide assembly goes out of parallel with the blade. These are the major things.
Guess what I'm saying is be choosey. Many will buy a machine and live with the concept that it must be grossly readjusted, rebuilt, reconfigured. And with some equipment, I suppose some of that is unavoidable. But I feel as if when you're spending hard earned money, most of this stuff should have been done right by the manufacturer to start with.
I have a 14" Laguna and have been very impressed with the fit and finish. Never had any problems - it is quality throughout. It has heavy cast iron wheels and I was afraid I would cut my fingers on the rough edges I expected to find on the spokes. There were none - smooth as glass! The dust collection is great. They have taken every precaution to keep dust inside the machine where it can flow to the exit pipe.
Frosty
In the laguna line of bandsaw I see the LT16 which is supposed to have a 12" resaw capacity, a 3HP motor and can fit a 1" blade. It cost $1495. Of course after adding accessories and delivery it goes a little over $2000.
Any feedback on this one?
What accessories do you need? It comes with an adjustable fence and some blades. The blades are awful but the fence is good. The only thing I had to buy was a "plumbers boot" (at the hardware store) to connect their non-standard dust outlet to my 4" hose. I think that was $15.I also spliced into the power feed so that I have a magnetically mounted light on the wheel housing.FrostyIf you call for "information", ask the salesman what he will do if you give him and order 'right now'. It should be worth $100 to $200.
I mainly need a mobile base, blades and dust collection fittings.
And of course have the saw delivered
I can't argue about the delivery charges - unless you plan on using it at their place. As for the mobile base, I don't remember if it was included or I got them to throw it in. There is an axle with 2 wheels at the blade end of the saw. A long iron handle with 2 wheels at the bottom pivots a pin up into a plate mounted on the other end of the saw base. Then it is a snap to roll the unit wherever you wasnt it. I hang the handle on the wall. If you do have to buy it, it surely it can't cost much. (It's a lot harder to describe than it is to use.) Frosty
Morning E W...
Hmmmm..... $1500 or less.. Yep!
Excellent dust collection.. Yep!
I normally cut a second hole in the bottom right corner of a band-saw and Y port it to get that dust that always rides the blade down after escaping the port just under the table and accumulates in the rear corner.. could you find one that is so dust efficient that is un-necessary? I didn't think that was possible but the guys that designed said it was and they were proved to right!
Fit and tension a 3/4" blade.. Yep!
Have a look inside the upper case and compare to all others in the price range. Could you use double springs. And while your in there, have a look at the re-enforced upper arm chassis that the springs mount to. The heaviest springs in the world are useless unless they are properly mounted to something that won't flex.
Look carefully over the entire machine and compare it to others in it's class. And don't be fooled by machines that are a few hundred more and made by higher line manufacturers to give those in your price range a shot at their name on the outer case. They aren't even close in quality to their higher dollar range of machines which do boast the quality to fit their $2000 + price tags. The fact that they are also made in Europe doesn't reflect the fact they are made rather cheaply in Europe, IMO.
Not only have a look but physically compare it to the competition as the machine speaks for itself. Have a look at how the motor is stauchly re-enforced in the lower case to avoid shaft play. And fully adjustable along with the upper guide bar. And if you might consider a 5 Year Warranty backing it up with out-standing customer service!
Did I mention you might have a look at the Steel City 18" band-saw!
Sarge.. jt
Thanks Sarge, this is definitively a lot of machine for the price and will definitively have a look.
Your quite welcome, E W. Now have fun shopping as I have to go figure out how to ground PVC piping and an am beginning to realize that absolutely nobody knows for sure. ha.. ha...
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Anybody owns one of the grizzly model G0513X or G0514X ?
I have read several good reviews on the G0513X but can't find any feedback on the G0514X.
Also I am looking at the Steel City 18" closely. They currently have a promotional introductory price which is very tempting. I did find several good reviews about the saw (including Sarge that seems to be very enthusiastic about it) but it got a pretty bad review in FWW. Did anybody faced any of the issue described in this review ?
Evening ewber...
"but it got a pretty bad review in FWW. Did anybody faced any of the issue described in this review"? ..... ew
Run a search here in the archives for January I believe. Use the key words.. " Steel City Smear"
Take a while and read that thread and you will discover that not all you read in FWW is the truth and nothing but the truth. I presume you missed the follow up letter printed the next month with the author of the review apologizing to Steel City on one of the points he referred to as Flaws. On the other major point he sticks by it and he is wrong on it also. Just read the thread I mentioned and form your own opinion if the SC has flaws... and the author has a clue for that matter. ha.. ha...
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Edited 4/22/2007 9:34 pm ET by SARGEgrinder47
Sarge
I don't believe that you need to ground PVCu pipework at all. Take a look at this piece by Rod Cole from MIT: http://mywebpages.comcast.net/rodec/woodworking/articles/DC_myths.html#who
Just trying to put another myth to bed ;-)
Scrit
Morning Scrit...
Thanks very much as that was probably the most extensive and best explained sum of the effects of grounding I have read under one roof. I was not concerned with ignition as I already felt it to be a myth in home systems where the chances are very slim. My my concern was shock caused by static.
In effect... I think I won't do a thing to the short 10' run of over-head PVC I have used to see what happens. I do have 10' of somewhat flexible 6" CVD also that is spiraled with a self grounding wire. If the shock factor is great, I may just wrap the whole thing in aluminum foiled self adhesive tape which is simple enough to do and won't cost and arm and leg with only a total of about 20' run.
Again.... mucho gracious!
Sarge.. jt
Thanks Sarge
I took a deep breath and order the saw this morning through woodworker's supply.
Morning E W...
I think any fear you have will be eliminated when you get the BS put together which requires very little. Keep in mind that the guide bar is fully adjustable and the original manuals didn't state that. There are other fine adjustments that weren't in the manual that have now be added because of the review.
And if you get one (before the change to thumb screw) that has a set-screw under-neath for the lower rear thrust bearing, you will find that it is a PITA to see with dim light to get an allen wrench on.
This was discussed in a conversation with Jim Box (Scott Box the co-owners brother and heads the technical dept) and turned into a conference call with Scott box, Jim and their head designer. Scott and the head designer went and crawled under the saw on the floor to see what I was talking about. When they came back they thanked me for the "heads up" and said a call would be placed to the factory the following Monday to correct the minor problem.
But.. if you do get the set-screw and that is likely till all current stock is depleted, replace it with a $1.25 M 6 x 1 thumb screw. If you can't find one locally, PM me here on the site and I will mail you one as I have several. The small thumb screws that were on the other guides have already been replaced with larger ones as I pointed that out to them in the fall. These guys do listen to the consumer.. trust me on that one!
Enjoy...
Sarge.. jt
Thanks for the advice Sarge.
Sarge,
If you are still interested in grounding PVC pipe, there is a way other than buying the special conductive PVC pipe which is to paint the PVC with conductive paint. Of course the paint is only available through industrial paint suppliers.<!----><!----><!---->
Evening jawx..
Thanks jawx, I was not aware of that. Actually there is a lot I was not aware of that I am now.
Just paint it and you are grounded. Usually you are grounded by your wife and then you have to paint it to get un-grounded! ha.. ha...
Thanks again as that is useful information. Getting something from an industrial supply is quick order with my BIL being a shop foreman in the machine shop at Delta Air Lines here in Atlanta.
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Hey, Sarge. All this talk about "grounding" PVC takes me back to this guy's take on the whole thing. What's your take on his take? For a shortcut to "grounding" click here. I'm sure you've read all that before, just curious.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Afternoon FG...
I read that whole article at least twice and based my opinion mainly on it because he has done such extensive home-work. I only have a short run of PVC and started not to ground it to see what happens as I live in a warm and relatively dry climate.
Then after smacking my honey on the lips (just after touching the pipe with cyclone running) as she was headed to the library and igniting a small static shock, I decided to go ahead and bite the bullet.
I just stripped copper wire laying around and bought 4 25' rolls of 18 gauge which I doubled. Had sheet metal screws on hand and I placed them every 3" through the pipe. Then I wound copper around the pipe and around the head of the screws before putting them all the way down. Tapped into each machine and made a continuous connection from cyclone to machine.
Don't know what the real truth is, but I havent' been shocked since. If I do get a tap though, I will post it..
Regards as I have to get to work ...
Sarge.. jt
Hey Sarge,
I found a pretty good way to ground PVC pipe (although conductive paint sounds pretty good). 3M makes a copper foil adhesive tape generally used in Electronics industry- its about 20 bucks before shipping for 1/4" X 54' roll. Apply a strip down the outside length of your hard pipe, allowing 3 or 4 " on each end. On the ends, fold the tape back into the interior of the PVC. Tape your joint pieces so the tape strip on the connector contacts the tape strip on the PVC (in other words, they overlap the entire OD or ID length where the pieces plug into one another). When you make your connections, match up the strips. Ground the tape on both ends.
3M copper tape: http://www.mouser.com/catalog/629/1804.pdf
Stewart Macdonald also has conductive tape (although I have never seen it or used it) for a fraction of the cost and also carries conductive water based paint:
http://www.stewmac.com/cgi-bin/hazel.cgi?action=SERVE&sku=0028&ITEM=catalog/sku.html
KB
Evening Keef..
And now and you and EW tell me..
I stripped about 60 feet of 14 gauge wire this morning before pressure washing the house. :<)
And I could have just painted it or run a couple of pieces of tape through it. Oh well... I may be the worlds fastest and and experienced wire stripper at this point is the good news. ha.. ha...
Seriously, thanks for the info as I am going to explore both your possibility and E W's. And if nothing else.. whoever reads this might be better informed when they reach the same cross-road.
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Keef
I really liked this tip and ordered some of the tape from Stew-Mac. Got to wondering though if I should put a strip of this both outside and inside the PVC and make sure they all connect up together. What do you think?
TIA - Doug
If you build it he will come.
<<I really liked this tip and ordered some of the tape from Stew-Mac. Got to wondering though if I should put a strip of this both outside and inside the PVC and make sure they all connect up together. What do you think?>>
I'm no expert, but if you put the tape on the outside, and bend it over to the inside for 3 or 4 inches I think that would be beneficial. Bending it over on the inside is going to be mandatory anyway to get electrical continuity from piece to piece, if you know what I mean.
When I was in avionics, sophisticated airplanes had carbon fiber strands, encased in plastic "sticks" attached to the trailing edges of the wings etc. Some had hard, carbon impregnated, plastic sticks, maybe 12" long that had 4 or 5 small thumb tack size metal probes near the end of the stick, that stuck out into the wind stream. This disipated the static built up on the skin, generated by air flow. Similarly, one could insert some small pointed brass screws through the metal tape on the outside, so they just stuck out on the inside. I've not done it, but I've sure thought about it. Maybe next winter, when I get the $hit shocked out of me from a static discharge......would that qualify as scientific data?
scientific data? Isn't that the android guy on StarTrek Next Generation? :-))
I started in on it this afternoon. So far I only had about 6-7 short pieces or fittings put together, and nothing sealed up or even anchored down yet. I put pencil marks on the joints before disassembly with the plan of putting the tape along those marks. I ended up just running a continous loop around each piece trying to match each piece together at the tape but somewhere in the process a couple of pencil marks must have rubbed off. So I had a couple pieces not mate up correctly when re-assembled. But I sort of came to the conclusion, that doing it this way means I probably dont need to be as concerned about it. I can just apply a bridge piece of tape on the outside to connect them together. Once I get the longer runs, get the tape on the inside will be a bit more challenging but I don't think it's insurmountable. You mentioned earlier you just connected the outer ends up to the shop ground. Did you just tape a bare wire end down on top of the copper tape? Or a screw through the tape with the wire around that? Just curious how you did those ends.
Anyway, this seems like a real elegant and easy to apply solution. Merci Beacoup for the tip.
If you build it he will come.
Sarge, are the wheels on the SC 18" bandsaw aluminum?
Jeff
Morning Jeff...
Cast iron...
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
I received the saw today.
No time to set it up yet but so far I don't regret my purchase
Morning E W...
Looks like you got ripped off to me. Mine came with a table. ha.. ha...
Seriously (which isn't often) seeing the picture, after you get it set up and make some cuts.. take note of how far down that blade safety shield comes down over the upper bearing. That is true with most Band-saws as some type of safety thingy from the point of manufacture to get it out of country. Especially true with the Euro BS's where safety regulations are really tight.
Well, if you get annoyed with not being able to have eye contact with the blade-stock-bearings, draw a line with a "sharpie" just above the upper bearings. Take a hack-saw and cut it off and take off the burrs with a file. That will solve the problem.
I know.. I know.. butchering your new saw is like getting the first scratch on a new car. The wound will heal shortly and you will up-grade your cutting results. You have to do the same thing on that "armadillo tail" safety guide on a Mini Max if that is consolation. :>)
Regards...
Sarge.. jt
Mission accomplished.
I got the saw assembled and tuned in no time (despite having the set screw).
I am overall very satisifed with the saw. The table is flat, dust collection is very good and most important I can tension my blade is tensioned properly and it doesn't wander in the cut. The one complaint I have is that the fence is not top of the line and has a little flex when putting too much pressure.
I intended to spend around $1500 and end up spending around $1550 with the saw delivered, a 1" timber wolf blade, an HTC mobile base and a new plug.
Thanks again Sarge for the good advice.
Emmanuel
Morning E W...
You must be exerting some pressure if your fence is flexing. I have not had the problem and thought the fence was better than most I have seen come stock on most of the others. I do use the point fence often though, depending on what I am doing.
Quick fix... Purchase a piece of 1 1/2" angle aluminum from the Box. Get a roll of 3/4" Slick Strip from Eagle America @ 800-872-2511. Attach the angle aluminum to the back side of the fence and run the 3/4" self-adhesive slick tape on the underside. After setting the fence, just Quick clamp the L portion of the angle that will point rear-ward to the table and exert all the pressure you want to exert.
You can use the rest of the roll under the fence slide, your TS fence, router, etc. What was sticky action turns into a run-way train with that stuff acting as a barrier of metal to metal. Cheap and effective.
Enjoy your new saw as I think you will be very happy with your choice..
Sarge.. jt
I would trot down to the nearest Jet/Powermatic dealer. There is a sale going on through the end of the month.
Work Safe, Count to 10 when your done for the day !!
Bruce S.
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