Do you sit or stand when carving? Most carving projects I’ve tackled are too large to be done from a seated position, but my feet sure get tired from standing at the edge of a worktable. Maybe I’m not working from the best height?
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Sometimes I sit -sometimes stand. It depends largely on the light, the tiedown (clamp), cutting angles, whether my back is tired, etc. I too have had problems with tired feet. To ease this problem I purched sponge floor mats. I have one that is a 5 ft. runner and another set that is interlocking 2X2 ft. squares. You can get one atthe big box stores or from catalog purchase. The mats really helped out tired burning feet.
Fortunately, (I'm 72) I'm not beholding to anyone else for any kind of product. Anything I build or carve is done on my schedule. I try to remember that when I get tired (to the point of noticing it) it is time to quit!!! That seems like a good rule for safety's sake.
Yeah, I do both also, but the height of my workbench (an Ulmia) is too high for most carving projects even with a bar stool to sit on. Currently I'm working on a wall mounting that's about 40 inches wide and over a foot deep, so moving it around is harder than moving myself around while standing. But my 75-year-old feet prefer the sitting position, for sure. Did you ever try to carve on your lap?
Happened to think that my foot problems eased up when I bought a new pair of boots (Ankle high shop shoes). I was a forester up in MT during my working years. One thing we all cherished was a GOOD pair of boots. After retireing went into tennies. You know - the walking kind, that cost way too much. Finally thought these soft shoes might not be the best for shop use. Found a good pair of boots with a high heal - sliped in some felt insoles. Pretty much stay on foam floor mats, and found the problem of tired feet pretty much disappeared.
Yes am now carving on my lap, but am working on a small 6" long carving of an elephant. I've never worked on a project of the size you have. I built my bench (copied from a woodworking mag.) It's a 2.25 inch thick top on the top of some store bought floor cabinets. Trimmed the bottoms of the cabinets so that the total height is 34 inches high. In making the top I routed slots perpandicular to the wall and put in "T" slots. hold down clamps will slide into the "T"s.
I have a small foot stool folding ladder - the kind used for getting into high kitchen cabinets. Sometimes I KNEEL on the top of it.
Gotta get back to Mr. Elephant!
OK, thanks for the suggestion about the work boots. I do have a pair of good hiking boots that may do the trick. I'll try it. Otherwise, the foam rubber floor mat isn't doing what I had hoped for when I got it. Take care with that elephant. . . Jim
After a few days, tell me how the hiking boots work out! Good wishes to you! Mature fellas have to stick together.
I am new to carving, having taken it up last fall after I had a stroke (age 70) and had to put off some of my instrument making projects. I made a lap box and bought tools (and may I commend Ramelson of Newark, NJ for fine quality at decent prices - they make their own in a small factory in the Ironbound section - not good on knives, but great on gouges - wish I'd known of them before I paid for some of my Pfeills).
I am doing only small hand held work, so the standing isn't the issue. But I might as well stick my oar in the water. The most valuable tool I have is a glove (I think it is from Woodcraft) made of a weave of Kevlar, stainless steel, and some resistant synthetic. It's about $20 and must have saved me twice that in bandaids (and I use a bit of leather as a thumb guard for paring knife cuts).
I may be the only one among you to have been the center of attention in hospital with his carving. The stroke in late October delayed a scheduled femoral artery bypass, so that was done in January (and then I found myself back in hospital from an opportunistic infection). So the nurses, the doctors, the attendants, etc. all were coming to my room to watch me carve. I had brought the lap box and all my tools in their rolls. I was bound and determined not to be bored by watching TV and doping off. That is a natural function of the hospital routine (which I've learned from some recent trips), they never let you sleep long "wake up, it's time for your sleeping pill".
Whatever, I commend to you all that should you have a hospital stay in your future you make a lap box and take your tools and wood and carve miniatures. Great for getting favored treatment, and makes the time pass.
Best, Jon
Thanks, Jon, but my hospital experiences have been anything but wonderful even though my wife was a director of the same hospital. Terrible place to be if you're sick!
Hey JON!
I certainly don't envy your stayin the Hospital, nor the cause that landed you there! Just got back from a 2 month outpatient stay at Loma Linda Proton Hospital in Loma Linda, CA. Have prostate cancer, but after the 44 proton - conformal radiation treatments, all I have to do is wait to see my PSA scores for the next few years. I'm probably cancer free now (about an 85% chance). That's as good as surgery, but with none of the pain and side effects. The point in telling this is that during the spare time spent between treatments, I started carving a small African Elephant. Shure helped, like you found in keeping the goblins away. Have been home 3 weeks now and just putting the final touches in Mr. Elephant.
One more thing, I'm not the world's most accomplished carver, but have received a lot of rave reviews of finished work. Took a class in carving for something to do while on winter vacation in South Texas. The RV parks down there are full of activities. Wood carving is one of them. First thing our instructor said was "don't run out and buy a set of tools. He had some we could use. The most important thing about tools, besides their function is learning how to keep them sharp. We made double sided strops and were incouraged to strop every 15 to 20 minutes while carving. He eventually sold me several gouges and a couple of knives. Also sold me a Kevlar glove. I agree the glove is a must to keep blood off of the carving.
A friend of mine at the RV park, never took a lesson, never bought a carving knife or gouge. He made his own tools, from old files, used fillet knives, and used dental tools. Most of which he picked up at flea markets. He was, and still is the quickest carver I've ever seen (I"m slower than a cow on rutches) and does beautiful work. He also uses a Dremel. (one he got at a yard sale and coustomzed). After carving beside him for a while, I saw the best carving tools are not necessarily the most expensive, but the SHARPEST. I've done some carving in red oak and have found that if tools are sharp and shaped sorectly there is no need to bear down with a lot of pressure. Tools slide into oak the same as in poplar as long as they are sharp and have the right taper to the edge. But in oak there is a need for a little more sanding. There is another guy down there that carves beautiful forest sceens. Sometimes with animals and sometimes with mountain men. He carves these sceens in moose antlers and uses a Foredom tool for all of his work.
Holt
I concur with your instructor, in fact I offered my surgeon the use of one of my "sheepsfoot" knives to replace his scalpel. I have a had a lifelong fascination with sharp tools, and in fact spent two hours tonight and four last night working on a new plane blade on a 1200 grit waterstone (then a 6000 grit). I think I go too far, but then it is my pleasure. As long as the cutting bevel is sharp and honed smooth it will work fine, but I like the aesthetic of having the whole thing look good.
I have more tools than I need, but that doesn't prevent me from wanting even more. I commend the U.J. Ramelson that I mentioned for gouges of excellent quality and reasonable price (I do some relief carving and a small collection of a #3, a #5 and a #9 sweep gouges in several widths is nice. In my bedroom shop I don't have the facility to work with the steel to make my own.
When I'm carving I tend to hit the edge of my tool with a 4000 grit waterstone (the little slip stones, the side of them makes a good touchup) every 15 minutes, then the leather strop.
As to wood, I like basswood for carving in general - although it doesn't have the interesting grains of some others. I'd not touch poplar. And I do have a Dremel, but I don't use it for carving (nor the Foredom tool). I like the feel of the carving, and am not in a production mode.
I confess the Foredom sounds interesting, if I read the ads properly. After @ 55 years of shaving I've finally found the perfect razor. Gillette has a three blader out with a single AAA battery that vibrates the blade slightly, making a continual shearing effect. It cuts my heavy growth even after a couple of days of neglect, where I used to have to use an old fashioned double edge from the fifties to do an initial scrape. I assume the Foredom does the same for carving, that is to put a little vibration shear into a straight cut. But I'd still rather work the wood myself (my face is another matter).
Best, Jon
There are so many ways that I fully agree with you. The only place we might disagree is that I'm too frugal to obtain tools just to have them. After setting up my wood shop with the basics, several years ago, I strongly strive to get another tool only when it is needed. The other day while cleaning up the shop I was surprised at the number of hand tools that not yet found their own storage spot. Now it's time to make another tool cabinet. The good thing for me is; buying only when needed allows me to pick what I think is the best - regardless of price. I guess that's what I'm favoring these days because I still have some favorite home made small tools. Oh well! whatever works.
I like sharpening too! Can still remember the thrill of producing a correctly beveled and very sharp plane blade in high school shop. When the grumpy old instructor said he liked it - I was impressed. Still get a thrill out of a nice sharp shiny chisel, gouge, plane blade and saw blade.
Keep cuttin', Holt
Holt,
I am equally frugal by inclination, but my computer lacks a "beer sense key". The web has cost me a small fortune in late night orders. But nothing frivolous, nothing fancy. Yet the best, in the sense of useful, tools I have come from the web. I just made an impulse buy of a "drill press milling vise" because I don't trust the cheap Craftsman router/table combo I'd been using for the music stands I'm making. I don't trust any cut I can't see. The damned thing is great, now I have to find a buyer for my routing table. I've already found ten uses for it that I hadn't thought of (maybe five <g>).
I confess that I sometimes use a diamond paddle sharpener to start an edge on things of odd shapes, but there is nothing like that glossy finish of a finely honed blade. Or when you study the edge under strong light an can find no reflection (Boy Scouts taught me that).
Best, Jon
Jon - just remembered to say that my most important tool is a sharp pencil with a soft lead.
Holt
For those that are interested in Chris Pye here is the link to his web site. You can subscribe to his free newsletter from there and some of his writings are free to download.http://www.chrispye-woodcarving.com/
I like the mechanical pencils with the "finger tip lead pump", I have one in my shop apron and the other in the coffee cup next to my arm chair. Nothing like marking the wood while looking at it from a perspective before getting into the close work of carving. Concur your comment.
Best, Jon
This is funny! I used to have the same thing - two of them. Got them from Rockler. Broke on by drpping it and haven't replaced it. Now have the good one in my apron and a wood 2H in the table next to my chair.
Best to you! Holt
My mechanical pencils are from my local Shop Rite supermarket where I buy my kitty litter (and my wife buys our food).
Best, Jon
Jon:
I used Kitty litter once to get rid of the remainder of a couple cans of paint. You know, poor the paint into the litter - let it dry and throw the hardened chunks into the garbage. What do you do with the litter? Let the cat use it?
Hey about 5 years ago I bought a Shopsmith. Best buy I ever made! can make the drill press table large. About 2' by 5'. Even longer if needed, but never have. The table saw fence works on the drill press - handy. Even used the horizontal function of the press to make the pivot holes in sutter slats. Could go on, but no need.
Thanks!! I'm going to start looking at the grocery stores for my mecanical pencils in the future!
Keep on chippin' away,
Holt
Did your hiking boots do any good for you?
Holt
Ha! I haven't tried them yet because the part I'm working on now allows me to sit for a while, then stand, then move around, then sit, etc. I'm making a banner of grape leaves across a 40-inch panel. The part that required standing was a bunch of grapes and that's mostly done, so I've put off the shoe thing until I need it. However, I've also become aware of a technique where the work table is chest high. This would make a big difference it would seem and I think I'll give it a try one day using a temporary table. Ever hear of this instead of working at normal workbench height?
Of all the caving tables I know about - the height has been a function of the worker's height. Usually (I think) this is an issue regarding the worker's back. You know a stooping and leaning thing.
Holt
Just got this tonight - thought you would be interested.
http://www.woodworkersjournal.com/ezine/webreview.cfm
Holt
Thanks, Holt. I have another solution that was staring me in the face. Although I already have good quality rubber mats at all the workstations in my shop, it was the carving work that created the problem: neither standing nor sitting were comfortable for long. I was told to raise the work surface above the normal height of the workbench and, as I was considering ways to try this, I thought of a barstool on the other side of the shop that I use for visitors. It's a bit higher and has foot rests. Yesterday I tried it out for several hours and it seems to be about right, plus it swivels so I can move on and off as needed without having to move it. I don't know why I hadn't considered it before. Anyhow, it hasn't been needed for smaller or shorter-term projects until now, so I guess ya never get too old to learn something new!
Too old to learn? No way! Nice save! (Just look around the shop and there is the solution) Good going!
Holt
Finally took a picture to show you the setup.
Looks like you got it figured out! GOOD!
Best wishes, Holt
Sitting is my first choice but the bench and the project have everything to do with the carver's position.
Lee
Lee,
What do you use for lighting, when carving?
Willie
Lots, hah, hah, ha...,I have areas of the shop set up for good light, 95% full spectrum fluorescents overhead spaced to not create shadow, windows nearby and mobile halogens when needed. The halogens are awfully hot so I only use them for dark woods like walnut, usually in conjunction with a fan.As the eyes get older I need more light, I suggest the fluorescents just because they are cool and efficient. The higher spectrum bulbs are really quite nice.Lee
I sit a lot with the workpiece clamped to any available table when doing lettering. There's a lot of pencil-work, layout and repetitive cuts happening. My mentor-in-print, Chris Pye, would disapprove, I'm sure. For really getting leverage on the tool and feeling it bite into the workpiece nice and cleanly, you probably need to be standing, if possible. (I guess - seems like I read that - I'm not an expert myself). I also perform this maneuver where I unclamp the workpiece, turn it upside down, clamp it back, and work on it that way some, too. Not sure if that would be kosher, either, but it gets the job done.
I'd like to take one of Chris Pye's workshops, but haven't looked at his print material. Is it worthwhile? I find the videos of Nora Hall to be pretty marginal, at least with respect to the production qualities. Sometimes you can't even see what she's doing and the audio quality doesn't help much. I have learned some things from her, though, and I guess that's next best to actually being there. As for sitting/standing, I'm going to explore some kind of temporary jig or table that will support the workpiece while I'm in a sitting position because I've got a border of grape leaves to carve across the top that will take me many hours. It would be a lot more tolerable if I didn't have to stand, and maybe I'll be able to rotate the work at least a little from the sitting positiion if it's supported. Thanks for your input. Jim
>print material. Is it worthwhile?<
I'm a fan of Pye's Lettercarving in Wood: A Practical Course, Fox Chapel Publishing, 2003. It is a rigorous, methodical approach but I tend to skip around and take what I need from it. I feel like I'm taking a course and reading the instructor guide when I read that book. Good luck, Ed
I checked out Amazon's stock of Pye's books. You mentioned lettering...have you also bought any of his other books? Would you recommend them?
I only have the one Chris Pye book. Will probably buy the others in the future.
I have an old football injury that leaves me with a lot of lower back pain if I stand on a hard surface very long. I don't do a lot of carving, but for when I do I'm working on some drawings for a bench I plan to build. I want to combine a shaving horse with an adjustable carving bench slab. See the attached photos and with a little imagination I think you'll get the idea. I don't think it will be too difficult to make the carving surface to where it will both swivel and have a height adjustment. Don't know if this will help you or not.
That carving bench is very cool. Haven't seen one before. My current project would not work on it, I'm afraid. But I have a question about that shaving horse ... are those holes in the seat area and, if so, does one put a dowel in them so that when you sit it --er -- fits a part of your anatomy to keep you from sliding around? Anyway, I can see what you're thinking about for a carving table "accessory".
Do you sit or stand when carving? NOT a good carver here BUT.. Has made a few things that folks liked..
I just used a SHARP knife AND watched TV while doing it! Really..
No thought.. Just the wood seemed to do it!
I HAVE to Vacuume the rug after the show! Wife' insisted!
I CANNOT carve if thinking about it.. Just me
Sounds to me like a perfect way to do anything! I'm not so lucky.
It depends on the size of the carving..Small pieces work well with lap holding. I find that standing allows greater two handed force to be applied, also on large objects one can more easily move around to approach the piece from different angles.
Tom
Jim,
You got some great responses to your question about sitting or standing while carving. Part of your motivation was that standing is tiring.
If your boat gets stuck under the bridge on the river, there are two ways to break free -- either lower the river or raise the bridge.
So back to carving. How can we speed up the process. Using sharp chisels will have some effect. Using a 12" chain saw will do even more. Think about it!
I have seen carvers use the small chain saws and turn out wonderful outdoor sculptures.
So after getting great advice from the real experts, you now have some other advice from me. Think about chain-saw carving. Recommend you do it standing up, but you can finish up quickly on a reasonably sized piece.
For further info:
http://www.chainsawcarving.co.uk/
http://www.aloghomestore.com/tools-chainsaw-carving.shtml
http://www.baileys-online.com/chainsaw_carving.htm
Enjoy,
Mel
PS please keep me posted on the dates of your trip to Virginia
Measure your output in smiles per board foot.
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