Replies

1. 
   lat_axe | Dec 06, 2023 07:36am | #1

   As you describe, the final stages of hand planing stock flat can be tricky because grain will be going in various directions at the surface being planed, with tear out always a risk.

   Personally I use more than one plane, with one set as "standard" (a 45 degree cutting angle or thereabouts) for with-the-grain cuts and another plane with a high cutting angle of 60 degrees or thereabouts, set for very fine shavings. The latter plane, used with care, can eventually reduce most of those nasty areas to flat with zero or only tiny tear outs. It takes time and care, though.

   When planing off larger amounts at the start of the process, you need to read the grain so as to be ready for choosing the best angles and planes for doing the final smoothing. As you've discovered, just one poor swish of the wrong plane at the wrong angle across the work can tear out chunks.

   There are all sorts of plane configurations for minimising tearout when they're used against the grain. High cutting angle, close-set chipbreakers, tight-closed mouths, blades thick enough so they never chatter, super sharp cutting edges set for very thin shavings ..... and some others.

   If the wood is very gnarly, ornery and otherwise difficult, a scraper plane might required - e.g. around live knots. A scraper plane is better than a hand held scraper as the plane sole helps avoid the tendency to create the sort of hand scraper-dug hollow that you mention. It still takes time because it still takes only very thin shavings.

   If it gets really ornery, I end up using a big belt sander in a sanding frame for the "bad" bits. These too can dig hollows - in a moment - but a large sanding frame can help prevent that, along with a good technique for machine-planing and use of a finer grade sandpaper (say 120 - 180 grit rather than 60 or 80).

   Lataxe

2. 
   esch5995 | Dec 06, 2023 07:43am | #2

   First off, handplaned wood is never going to be as consistent as machined wood so there's that.

   As to handling tricky grain there are many things you can try.

   First of I believe you meant to say the blade was sharp, but there is sharp and there is sharp. In 50 years of making wood shavings I can't tell you how many people have told me their tools were sharp... Until they tried mine. Now I'm not saying yours weren't just that you asked what went wrong and how to fix it. This were I would start.

   You make it sound like you prepared a fair amount of wood. If so you should have resharpened several times more than likely. At the first sign of tear out I probably would have touched up the blade if I had been working it awhile, I'm assuming you sharpened before beginning the task.

   The there are the plane settings; were you trying to take too deep a cut, was the throat properly adjusted to support the wood as much as possible, was the blade cutting at the right angle? All these things can be the cause of your problems. No one can say from afar what exactly caused the tear out it's up to you to figure that out probably through trial and error.

   Now for tools. The planes you used were all bevel down planes probably with a standard 45° frog. All the better plane brands offer multiple frogs specifically designed to handle gnarly wood by raising the attack angle this has the effect of making the blade more like a scraper. The downside is it takes more effort and blades dull quicker. You can also use a bevel up plane, like I do and simply have several blades ground to different angles to use as needed. Lastly a scraper plane can sometimes be the only tool that works in extreme cases. It takes your scraper and basically turns it into a plane. It gives plane like control and repeatability and I feel encourages more methodical work patterns.

   I will leave you with this, sometimes the wood just wins. Despite our best efforts using the best tools the wood just isn't going to cooperate and we must settle for the best we can get.

3. 
   mschlack | Dec 06, 2023 05:12pm | #3

   I sometimes use a toothed blade on rough wood to start, especially to go cross grain. You get no tearout and its easier. Than you can start smoothing it with standard planes. I try every kind with difficult wood; standard plane, bevel up, high frog, whatever. You never know what will work best, IMO. Except they all need to be super sharp.

4. 
   bilyo | Dec 06, 2023 06:02pm | #4

   As mschlack says: "sometimes the wood just wins". If you do enough work with rough lumber to warrant the cost, I suggest you consider a power planer. You may need a sled in order to get the first side flat, but in the long run, the work piece will be flatter, smoother, and both sides will be parallel and it will happen in less time and with a lot less effort. If you can't afford one, find someone who does or pay someone who has one to do it for you.

   I appreciate those of you who want to do this work all with hand tools and I very much appreciate the talent and skill it takes to do it. So. I'm not trying to start an argument. Just suggesting some alternatives.

   BTW, using the power planer will not necessarily prevent tear-out, but you can minimize it by making sure your blades are sharp and take fine cuts (kinda like the advice you got above regarding hand planes ;>)

   One more point. Reading your post, I get the impression that you are trying to true up an entire plank prior to cutting it up to make something. I quickly learned when I started working with rough lumber that this is a mistake. Rough cut your lumber first into pieces a bit larger than your finish cuts. THEN do your planing to flatten and smooth them. During the rough cut stage you can eliminate some of the bad areas and save yourself some aggravation. Also, working with smaller pieces some of the crooks and warps will be less and less planing will be required.

1. 
   esch5995 | Dec 06, 2023 07:32pm | #5

   Good advice about cutting larger boards into more manageable pieces eliminating knots and such, unless they are desired in the final work. I will add an important caveat never try to rip rough wood on a tablesaw it is almost guaranteed to bind and kickback. Always use a bandsaw, tracksaw or even a handsaw to break down rough lumber.

5. 
   starideda | Dec 11, 2023 02:22am | #6

   Thank you for your advice. I guess I made a mistake trying to work on too big or too small pieces of wood, so it is hard to prepare it properly.
   What I also discovered is to after roughly preparing the wood (traversing method) with Stanley Nr.5 I use the Stanley Nr.4 smoother, but I tried to go extra fine so I can remove the uneven places and then go deeper.
   When I tried to go too deep (although my smoother was sharp) I ended having tear out.

6. 
   CharlieFurnituremaker | Dec 11, 2023 05:39am | #7

   If the tearout goes deeper than planned thickness then a re-design is called for or you'll have to process a new workpiece and remove wood less aggressively if it exhibits the same propensity for tear out.

   The mistake you've made is one people tend not to make twice.

   Whether to process an entire board before cutting it into components requires some judgment. Sometimes it make sense to, and sometimes it does not. It depends on the size of the board, its general condition, and how many workpieces you intend to harvest from it, amongst other things. There is no, one, rule.

7. 
   joeleonetti | Dec 11, 2023 07:07pm | #8

   I've had the same challenges from time to time as I primarily work with hand tools. What I often do is purchase S3S wood from the local lumber mill. It costs more than rough sawn but it helps reduce some of the issues. Depending on how bad the tear out is, I will try card scraper or just spot sanding or living with it. At times, I've used a straight edge and feeler gauges to see how bad it really is. If it's like 5 thousands, then it's only a few hand plane strokes out of square and it really won't impact most things. The longer I do this, the more fussy I become about the boards I select to try an avoid the problem. Good luck, sounds like you are doing all the right things.