Replies

1. 
   John_D | Jan 22, 2006 07:19am | #1

   I saw something like that done with a core of ply or MDF ribs, bending ply over, then veneered.  Hope you post when it's done!

   My goal is for my work to outlast me.  Expect my joinery to get simpler as time goes by.
2. 
   Pondfish | Jan 24, 2006 09:26pm | #2

   I would either veneer bendable ply, or laminate several sheets of thin ply meant for bending/laminating.  In a good vacuum press system you can bend the plys until you get the shape you want without even using a form (since the vacuum system holds the plys in place); let the glue dry, then you have a solid curved surface to veneer. This might be easier than trying to veneer onto bendable ply substrates, and then clamp it to a form or get it into a veneer bag with a form.

   Recommending the use of "Hide Signatures" option under "My Preferences" since 2005
1. 
   patrick | Jan 24, 2006 10:32pm | #3

   thanks for your responses.  If i decide on the veneer i will definitly use a vacuum bag.  I'm really interested in what you all think about the design and asthetic aspect of solid vs. veneer in this sort of aplication?   what about the strength of a 16" vertical, solid arc  (not to hold the glass up but to hold itself together while being moved about)  I was planning on veneer but the thought it might be neat to have it be solid and see the end grain through the glass.  thanks for any opinions

1. 
   Pondfish | Jan 24, 2006 11:40pm | #4

   I think making the base from solid wood could be done by careful coopering and smoothing out the curves, though it would entail a fair bit of work.  Either solid wood or ply-based should be structurally sound, given the thickness in your picture.

   As far as seeing the end grain, it would have to depend upon the wood.  Most end grain isn't all that attractive; veneering would give you something nicer to look at. 

   Nice commission, hope you enjoy the work.Recommending the use of "Hide Signatures" option under "My Preferences" since 2005

2. 
   EarlKelly | Jan 25, 2006 03:05am | #5

   If you decide to go solid with this, rough out the shape on the bandsaw before glue up. That will speed up the shaping .I would do a solid base, it gives some room for error. Where with the veneer, you loose any ability to alter or correct the shape once it's done.Furniture...the Art of a FurnitureMaker

3. 
   sapwood | Jan 25, 2006 06:40am | #6

   I would do this out of solid lumber. Coopering is also the way I'd do it. In fact, I did a remotely similiar form quite a few years ago for a standing mirror. I drew out the plan shape full size then measured each angle as I worked around the curve. By jointing each board on an angle, I produced the proper curve, with just a little error. I glued each board as I went by simply using a rubbed joint. I used yellow pva. There is no need to clamp, but you must let each joint cure well before doing another.

   Personally, I would use solid lumber because it will give a more "natural" and organic presence. But maybe I'm just shooting from the hip here without fully thinking out what I'd like to portray. It's a value judgement, no matter how you slice it.

   Using veneer is an equally valid method that will yield a more modern and fabricated look. Veneer here will be clean and slick. Either is OK, you must decide on the question you are trying to answer.

4. 
   Scrit | Jan 29, 2006 12:09pm | #7

   Hi Patrick

   I'd laminate up a base from thin MDF sheets then veneer. MDF is both heavy and stable as a ground and has certain environmental advantages over using solid. It would probably be considerably heavier than most coopered solid wood grounds so will offer greater stability in the finished piece. With a coopered piece I'd be concerned about telegraphing of the laminae through the surface veneer as the piece aged which might somewhat spoil the aesthetics of the piece. If you intend to use a finish such as pallisander or cocobolo the cost alone mitigates in favour of a veneered surface. Nice design! Like it!

   Scrit

5. 
   JohnWW | Feb 01, 2006 03:16am | #8

   I'd build it solid just for the time savings and simplicity of construction.  You could make several solid bases in the time it would take just to jig up a veneered version.

   John W. 

1. 
   Scrit | Feb 01, 2006 05:35pm | #9

   But then you'd loose the ability to get the wow factor by incorporating a particularly stunning flame or burr

   Scrit

1. 
   JohnWW | Feb 01, 2006 06:03pm | #10

   Scrit,

   True, but that wasn't part of the original question, and the photo shows grain that suggests the original piece was done with solid wood construction.  If the customer wanted a look, such as burl graining, that could only be obtained with a veneer then there is no choice but to do the job as veneer.

   My point, from a practical point of view, was that the base would be fairly simple and easy to build from solid wood, with little chance of failure.  Veneering a piece like that with inside and outside curves, and tight radiuses on the ends would be technically difficult, even more so if the base tapers from top to bottom as the original post suggested it might.

   This was a paying job, as I read the original post, usually it pays to keep things simple and predictable when you have to work to an estimate.

   John W.

1. 
   Scrit | Feb 01, 2006 07:20pm | #11

   OK John, but with a piece like that can be veneered using vacuum bagging, urethane foam cauls and cramps or even heat-set PUR adhesive film  - but incorporating solid ends to handle the rounded end look. That way the piece could be made to appear as if it was a single piece of wood, which I feel is visually more pleasing. The job of veneering such a shape is no more complex than coopering it would be IMO.

   Scrit

1. 
   JohnWW | Feb 01, 2006 08:18pm | #12

   Scrit,

   The base definitely could be done in veneer using one of the several techniques you describe. If I did it in veneer, I probably would think about using solid end blocks to avoid trying to veneer a tight radius, but that would create a new challenge of matching the appearance of the solid wood to the veneer, basically trading one problem for another. 

   I am fairly sure that I could build the base out of solid wood in one day of pleasant relaxed work, with almost no risk of being disappointed with the result.  If I were to make it as a veneered piece, my guess is that it would take a couple of days to make, with at least some risk that one or more steps in the process might run into a problem.  Somebody else, with a lot of veneer experience and a well equipped shop, could possibly build it in one day, and that would be the best approach for them.

   There's no right or wrong way to build this base, we're only comparing the pros and cons of the ways it could be done, which was the point of the original question.  I tend to be conservative when approaching a job for hire, I don't like taking risks when money is involved.

   John W.