Replies

1. 
   forestgirl | Mar 20, 2007 07:01pm | #1

   I strongly suspect No is the answer.  The spalting process is a delicate balance of the "right" fungi being active in increasing and decreasing amounts, whilst any decay organisms aren't as active, so you get spalted rather than rotten wood.  Here is an email I've kept, from Jon Arno who was our wood guru for many years.  NOte that the best spalting takes place over a fairly long period of time.  Reading this may help your understanding:

   I suspect the veining in spalted maple is enhanced if the maple is exposed to variations in moisture content that hover back and forth around the 20%MC cut off point. The logic is that the fungi that cause the spalting metabolize best between a low of 20%MC on up to the wood's Fiber Satuation Point, which for most species is between 28%MC and 30%MC.

   When the wood dries out below 20%MC the fungi go dormant, so the fungi that have penetrated deepest into the wood have a little more time to "operate" as the wood begins to dry from the outside when the moisture content declines toward the 20% cut off point. If the wood is keep constantly at an MC in the 20% to 28% range, the fungi advance into the log at a constant rate that yields a more or less uniform graying of the wood...and it also results in the most rapid progress toward the complete structural decay of the wood tissue.

   The story is a little more complicated than this in that the fungi that actually are most destructive to the wood tissue aren't the simpler molds that cause the spalting, but the molds tend to break down the interconnecting pits between the wood cells that allow the more destructive fungi to gain access and each of these related critters has some specific optimum MC at it metabolizes best, but they all are most active at some point between 20% and 28%MC. In any event, the outcome is the same.

   So, to make a long story short, the best spalted maple comes from logs that are exposed to vacillating MCs that range around plus and minus 20%MC...and especially if the vacillation progresses slowly back and forth.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 
   

1. 
   amishness | Mar 20, 2007 07:13pm | #2

   i did some more research and came up with this http://www.woodcentral.com/russ/russ4.shtml

2. 
   pins | Mar 21, 2007 12:54am | #5

   I read this entire thread because I have a lot of spalted curly maple, some 16-18" wide that I sawed in the early 90s.Here's what I know:I hired a guy to timber some of my property and we were to split the proceeds. As luck would have it the very first tree he felled was a maple about 35" in diameter. When the tree fell I saw the spalting in the end grain of the stump and the log, and I told him that this log was mine, not to go into the pool.So, the spalting was in the log on the stump, and did not occur later after the tree was felled.Since my band mill has a max width of about 29" I lost some wood on the first two cuts but still wound up with some very nice boards.Here's couple pix of a box with that wood, the color differentiation is the fault of the photographer, they are of the same box, and I have some that is even more spalted.pins(I replied to your post because Jon Arno didn't mention the possibility of the maple spalting in the tree.)

   Edited 3/20/2007 5:56 pm ET by pins

   
1. 
   Kevin | Mar 21, 2007 03:26am | #6

   I'm far from an expert but I would think that what you found has got to be exceedingly rare. Very very nice looking wood with your box, though. You got the spalting and the figure all together. That's bound to start some folks salivating...

1. 
   pins | Mar 21, 2007 01:57pm | #7

   Thanks, it probably is rare because I've never heard of it otherwise.pins

1. 
   | Mar 21, 2007 02:42pm | #8

   Hello Pins,

   Cool looking wood. I think that your tree has a few things going on though. I can see spalting, in addition I think some of the broader coloration lines may be from something like Ambrosia staining from the beetle. In addition there appears to be some mineral staining. Finally, you have the cool curly figure, you really hit the jack-pot.

   Bob, Tupper Lake, NY

2. 
   pins | Mar 21, 2007 02:58pm | #9

   Thanks Bob,I don't know anything about Ambrosia staining but the bookmatched bottom of the inside box has color I would describe as a light coral.I do know about mineral because this timbering was done in WV and its common to find, poplar for example, that was growing over a coal seam and it picks it up. I have a poplar board that has a pronounced almost black streak.I don't see any of that in the maple box.pins

2. 
   forestgirl | Mar 22, 2007 08:48am | #14

   Neat wood!  I don't know about the ambrosia beetle thing either, but if there was a bug involved, he might well have provided an opportunity for fungi to get going and create the intriguing combination you found in that tree.  What great luck!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

1. 
   topher | Mar 24, 2007 01:43pm | #15

   I just moved into a studio with some friends who own a bandmill and 50 acres here in Asheville NC and since I have a degree in forestry they asked me to come out to look through the land and tell them just what all the tree were. So, when we were going through, off to the right of a road grade was a large standing dead maple. 30"+ at the base for about 10' until it forked into two more modest branches (18"X16' each). I noticed that it had some shelf mushrooms popping out and the lower side near the root margin and thought then that this tree might be spalted or spalting...anyway we took it down last week and started to mill it. It turns out it was spalting, mainly black grain streaks and some color, interrupted by clear sections and then more spalting. Very beautiful, wish i had some pictures for you all. Today we'll open up the smaller sections and see what's inside. We did some more research and found out the 1 in 200 maples will spalt. Around here it's going for about $15.50/bdft. Anyway, we'll probably post a picture of it on our website for Mountain Sawyers...keep an eye out for it. Also, I'm pretty sure that the ambrosia beetle usually hits soft maple. The spalting occurs as the beetle bores into the wood bringing a fungus with it on its carpis or exoskeleton, and you usually see this spalting wherever there is an entry hole.

   Edited 3/24/2007 6:54 am ET by topher

1. 
   forestgirl | Mar 24, 2007 08:05pm | #16

   Wow.  Can't wait to see the pics, what a find!  Asheville, eh?  My family hails from that area originally.  Grandaddy was a postman, maybe in High Point? can't remember for sure.  He retired to his "gentleman's farm" outside of Greensboro where I used to visit in the mid-1950's.  Long red-dirt road leading to his 17 acres with a fishing pond, pack of hunting dogs, home-grown corn, watermelon, grapes, green beans, etc., etc.  My best memories of childhood!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 

3. 
   Jakehandel | Mar 22, 2007 01:29am | #10

   Some years ago a local furniture manufacturer used spalted maple for the wooden portions of their upholstered furniture. I'd get what I could from their trash bins and finally they allowed me to get the best throw-away pieces for the inside before it hit the trash bins.  What I noticed was that EVERY, and I stress EVERY, discolored vein had an insect hole in it somewhere.  Every one!  I often wondered at the chicken/egg question:  which came first: the worm or the vein.  (How I loved that wood !  But, they closed down and I'm on the last of my spalted maple now.

   Jake

    

2. 
   forestgirl | Mar 20, 2007 07:20pm | #3

   Neat article, thanks!  You spoke specifically of KD maple, that's where my uncertainty lies.  Note this line from the article:  "It works better in wood cut in the spring when the sap is up and the free-water in the wood is at its highest."  You would be trying to reintroduce a great deal of moisture deep into dried wood.  Not sure how that would go, how well it would spalt, and what the radical change in moisture would do to the structure of the lumber.

   I have a pile of maple logs that have been (hopefully) spalting for a couple years now.  Will soon split one of the smaller ones to see how it's going.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-) 
   

1. 
   amishness | Mar 20, 2007 07:24pm | #4

   ive got some scraps lying in the bathtub haha. yes i dont have anything better to do. its worth a shot. if it doesnt work then ive got some compost for spring time ;).

3. 
   dherzig | Mar 22, 2007 05:51am | #11

   Why waste the beer?

1. 
   amishness | Mar 22, 2007 05:53am | #12

   i used a can of Wildcat...i didnt waste anything :)

1. 
   forestgirl | Mar 22, 2007 08:45am | #13

   "i didnt waste anything "  Would have made great slug bait!! ROFL.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)