Replies

1. 
   jako17 | Feb 01, 2004 07:43pm | #1

   I have only limited experience spraying that product.I used conventional LVHP and thinned it 10%.The thing I noticed was that it quickly congeals after the can is open(I think it has a lot of dryers in it ) By the next day I was putting it through a filter to ensure there wern't any snots in it.Apart from that it worked great on the shutters I was making.By the way the tech people at Flecto were very helpful indeed.

1. 
   sawdust50 | Feb 02, 2004 02:10am | #3

   Jako -

   Thanks;  I had the same experience once; it was old product, and the oil

   had gone bad too.  I plan to keep the gun moving across the surfaces

   so  get decent build but no runs.   I too talked to the folks at Flecto,

   good advice on the product, "follow the directions" don't use high pressure air

   as it will accelerate drying.  Evidently you can't mist this on like oils or stains.

   take care,

   duster

1. 
   jako17 | Feb 02, 2004 06:24am | #4

   I had no problem with the finish on the job.But just overnight it formed tiny jelly globules in the can. However I still use it as the poly of preferance on floors etc but there I  use a lambs wool pad.I also only buy enough for the job and ditch the rest.My Maple and cherry kitchen floor still looks good after 10 years! I consider that durability.Good luck with the stairs   Jako

2. 
   Sphere | Feb 02, 2004 12:22am | #2

   http://www.woodanswers.com     there is good help.

   Go Stab yourself Ya Putz! Ya think I Parked here?
3. 
   Floss | Feb 02, 2004 07:18am | #5

   Would it be possible to set the glazing with a thin coat of shellac? Then you could brush the poly over top. No worries with overspray or cleanup.

   J.P.

1. 
   mlbfreestyle | Feb 02, 2004 05:37pm | #6

   I second this motion!  Spraying varnish or poly could get really messy.  I am currently finishing the new floors in my home.  I applied oil-based stain.  Am following this with two coats of shellac.  This does a great job of providing a barrier coat.  Then you can brush away with any oil-base and not disturb the stain.  Shellac has excellent adhesion properties.  There has  been much discussion about waxed-containing shellac under poly.  Zinsser make a blonde dewaxed pre-mix that I am using.  Will be fine under almost anything.

   I highly recommend this approach.  Faster, better, less messy, will help insure excellent results.

1. 
   sawdust50 | Feb 02, 2004 06:51pm | #8

   Thanks for the comments.  The staircase is mostly vertical surfaces, so regular floor type apllication is out as there are many right angles and places for the material to pool.   I believe spraying light coats gives me better control over buildup as well.

   As far as the mess, the house is fully masked, tarped plastic sheeted for containment to the entryway.   Have a large filtered fan and cross flow air filtering set up also.

   The quarterwinder stairway also has FLexmold, which can only be sprayed or glazed. So I think I have got it "covered"  but any other comments I can get would be welcome.   The first coats of stain were wet, and wiped, and the last was a dry-spray, (misting).   A small touchup gun works wonders!

   Please, add more!!!

1. 
   Clay | Feb 02, 2004 11:13pm | #9

   I usually have used Minwax polyurethane (rather than Varathane) but I like to spray while the stain layers are still tacky.  I seem to get better adhesion and less runs that way.  The poly topcoat seems to help the stain or glaze coats to cure and the shorter between coat time can save a lot on the overall schedule for the job.  It is my understanding that there are only the two options here as to timing the topcoating; 1. topcoat after the stains are set and tacky but before they lose their sticky surfaces, or 2. topcoat after the stains are completely cured and dry to the touch with little if any smell.  Sometimes there may be up to several days elapsed time between these two windows of opportunity.  In such cases there is a real advantage in making use of the first one.

1. 
   sawdust50 | Feb 03, 2004 01:11am | #11

   Clay -

   Thanks - I agree on the tow windows; in this case the weather went to 47 overnight and humidity went up.  We turned off all the heat and ignition sources etc.  But today, with rain predicited, I still found some tacky areas; so we are waiting to dry out in side.  I can keep the woodwork clean and covered, but the handrails are the most dense and slowest to dry.   The Flecto product was chosen to take advantage of the multiple coats per day etc.

   I talked to Flecto again to day for help; but they recommend no more that 10-15% mineral spirts thinning.  But I tried several tip sets in my HVLP, got good atomization but buildup that wouldn't flow out.   It made orange peel; seems the air cooling of the spray caused the stuff to bunch up.  

   WOndering whats next

   duster

2. 
   Clay | Feb 03, 2004 10:06am | #12

   "but buildup that wouldn't flow out. "  <  Two things that you mention concern me.  1. I think that the mineral spirits are a poor choice for thinning because mineral spirits contain some heavier fraction elements that can take several days to completely dry (this may be a problem considering that you want to do several coats per day).  2. I think it possible that your textured finish may be due to the poor solvent action of the mineral spirits.  I have had that problem sometimes with mineral spirits but it is usually cured with the use of a hotter solvent.  I reccommend VM&P naptha for a solvent instead of the mineral spirits (that is assuming that the MFR'S do not reccommend a special product for thinning their poly).

   Edited 2/3/2004 2:09:02 AM ET by Clay

   Edited 2/3/2004 3:10:29 AM ET by Clay

3. 
   sawdust50 | Feb 04, 2004 07:49pm | #13

   Thanks,  I'll try as shot with naptha.

   duster

4. 
   sawdust50 | Feb 06, 2004 05:12am | #14

   Again thanks to all who contributed to this thread.  SInce this forum is to share experiences, here goes:

   I got great info from the folks at Flecto too!  Although the trial with Naphtha VM&P worked on the samples, so did 15% mineral spirits.  The guys in the Flecto lab looked at my messages to them for the gun setup and solvent trials, and they did not recommend the naphtha at all for their product.  One of them did cite that he has used xylene at 10% on furniture, with good results.   I also was concerned about the naphtha and its low flash point (104 degrees) and the fact the Capsray uses a universal motor (brushes) and might generate sparks!!   Despite the great airflow through the room ~ 1000cfm,  I didn't want to risk it.   Next time I have a chance to shoot a piece OUTSIDE, I'll try the hotter solvent. 

   I shot the first coat of Varathane SB1000 PRO poly at 15% MS thinning today, and I am reminded why I like the HVLP setup.   A #3 tip and 8PSI (100 cfm non bleeder gun) produced a good pattern with easy control of coverage.   Temp was at 70 and dry.  Overspray while spraying handrails was absorbed by sheet cardboard, and the overall mess has been minimal.  One issue - make sure the check valve in the pot pressure line is open.  The poly will gum it up stopping the fluid feed to the gun.  Best way is to not tip the gun on its side!

   Any questions?

4. 
   Tao | Feb 02, 2004 06:48pm | #7

   I faux finished almost the entire main floor of a house once (only), and I used alkyd (oil) based stains and glazes.  After a day, they were fine to topcoat.  Most "oil" stains are not reversible after they have cured.  They set up just like a top coat.

   I wouldn't recommend the shellac, either, especially on a surface that's going to take a lot of impact, like a floor.  Poly doesn't adhere very well to it, and might separate whenever it is dented.

   Do some test panels to make sure.

   Don't even think about spraying poly in a finished house; you'll have a sticky mess all over, no matter how welll you mask.

   Michael R.

1. 
   mlbfreestyle | Feb 03, 2004 12:08am | #10

   Dewaxed shellac is not at all uncommon as an undercoat under polyurethane based varnish.  I would not expect any problems on an interior floor.

   If you are protecting primarily vertical surfaces, then you might need the extra scuff resistance of polyurethane base and might want to go towards an alkyd based varnish on the vertical parts.  Alkyd base has better adhesion and repairability properties.  This two-part approach might seem awkward, but I would be more concerned about trying to successfully spray any varnish product.  I agree that it must be put on wet; but then if too wet, you risk runs, etc.