To make a long story short, I glued up a frame with a panel with no play ( no room for expansion for the panel). I realized my mistake after it was to late to correct it. BTW the panel is 16 inches wide and made of quartersawn white oak. I understand the movement across grain is about 50% what plainsawn white oak would be. Is this project destined to self destruct ???
The only thing I can think to do is to try to shrink the panel by leaving it in a heated room. Does anyone have another idea. Any help would be most appreciated..
Replies
How tightly did the panel fit into the frame? If there's an 1/8" side to side play, you may be just fine. Q/S wood doesn't move very much, and a 16" wide panel won't likely move more than 1/16" - 1/8". This only helps if you didn't actually glue it really, really well, all the way around. If you did, the glue bond won't let it expand, no matter how much gap you have.
On the other hand, if you had to tap the panel into place with a mallet, and used lots of glue, you may have a problem on your hands.
My advice would be to go ahead and install the piece and hope for the best. If, later on, you see some twisting or warping of the assembly, you could always remake it then. I'd be that you'll be okay.
Best of luck to you.
Regards,
John
The only thing I can think to do is to try to shrink the panel by leaving it in a heated room.
"Shrinking" the panel (if you can do it) will prove a short term fix. Once the panel returns to a moister environment, it will again take on moisture and expand. The only way to fix it is to remove the panel from its frame, trim it down and reinsert it into the frame. This time, however, don't glue the panel, and be sure it doesn't fit tightly. It must be able to move in the frame so that as expansion and contraction occur, the panel won't crack.
The more I think about this, the more I wonder if you'll be able to even get it apart. Try steam, and if it doesn't work start over and chalk this one up to experience.
Jeff
Sounds like something I'd do. In fact, it sounds like something I've done. Don't give up on the door yet. I have several solidly glued panels that have gone through five or six seasonal changes without a problem. I hope you're as lucky as I have been.
If you do pull it apart and used PVA (if you dont already know this) white vinegar will soften your glue enough for you to pull things apart without destroying it in the process.
For a relative humidity range of 25% to 75%, the expansion/contraction of QS white oak is 0.3" or slightly more than 1/4". If your RH range is less, then the expansion/contraction will be less.
Thanks for the replys but I guess I failed to communicate clearly. I didn't glue the panel only the frame. My mistake was that I left zero room for expansion of the panel.
I guess I could try pulling the panel apart (I used titebond yellow glue) Does anything loosen the glue joint??? BTW this is the side assembly of a misson style chest of drawers.
Anymore ideas?? Thanks in advance
A 16" wide Q/S panel won't move too much so you may be okay. If you truly left "ZERO" room, you're probably better off dissasembling it with white vinegar and some expansion clamps. If it were just a door on a cabinet, I'd say leave it, but since it's an integral part of a chest, I'd just go ahead and fix it.
Unless the project will be subjected to moisture (table top, etc) I use hide glue for most all my projects. It's worked well for thousands of years, and is easily reversible. You might consider this for the future.
Regards,
John
Hi,
My rooky solution would be to rout around the rear inside of the frame to remove the panel. And reassemble kinda like glass in a window frame.
Gert
Sometimes it's just easier and faster to remake the piece than it is to repair, especially since you already have experience. I suppose trying to take it apart as suggested by others wouldn't require much time and effort, but I've spent too much time agonizing over correcting mistakes, when a quick re-do was more satisfying. Todd
You have two realistic options - 1) don't worry about it and use it; 2) build another one.
Making these kinds of decisions are part of making a rookie woodworker a seasoned woodworker. So, you decide.
You clearly understand the reasoning behind frame and panel construction which means that you have the information you need to make a decision.
Rooky,
If the frame and panels was constructed with cope and sticking you can run the whole thing through the saw and cut off one of the stiles. Pull the panel out and recut the ends of the rails. Joint some off the edge of the panel and remake the stile and reglue. If you used deep mortise and tenon construction you can cut the stile off on the saw but will have to replace the tenon with a loose tenon. This is a little quicker than a remake and a lot cheaper as far as material goes.
Edited 11/4/2002 5:45:02 PM ET by HEMPSTALK
I aggree, this is a quicker solution. I had to do this on a table I just finished. I glued the apron to the legs backwards and did not realize it untill the next day. Cut it with a coping saw to minimize lost material; loose tenons was the answer. In the panel case a swift cut on the table saw will work better.
If the edges are exposed shoot a long drill the width of the panel down the dado and plug the holes with wood plugs. However, sometimes it's easier and faster to chalk one up to experience and build a new one. It's good practice and you'll find a use for the left-overs.
Glendo.
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