I just got a mailer from the folks at Wilke and I wanted to get the boards opinion. They offer two Bridgewood cabinet saws. One a 3HP 1Ph Left tilt and one 3HP 1PH 220V Right Tilt. The Right Tilt saw is about $400 dollars cheaper, and about 65 pounds lighter with a slightly smaller table top. My questions are:
1. Is the $400 worth it (and why)
2. Does Bridgewood make a good cabinet saw?
3. Is there a difference (in performance) between 110 and 220V power tools. My shop is currently set up with only 110V.
Replies
aak: Don't know if $400 is worth anything if you don't want it . Do you want a left or right tilt?, if you buy a right tilt to save $400 and don't like it what's the point. 2)Don't know quality of the saw, never heard of the brand before, some things to consider:
1) Whose going to fix it if you need repair, according to there warranty ,your responsible for labor charges after 90 days.Do you live in PA to pick up the saw? or do you have to ship it there if there a problem?
2) Mostly all cabinet saws need 220 volts,especially with a magnetic starter, that saw will need 30 to 40 amps to run properly. If you do not have access to 220 volts in your shop, you need to get a licensed electrician to run a dedicated line for your saw, other wise just buy a 110volt contractor saw.
3) You didn't say where you live , but see if you can find a local tool distributor in your area, buy it from him, this way you get SERVICE with the saw you buy. Explain what your needs are and he be happy to sell you the RIGHT tool you need. If you need accessories in the future, parts, blades, you know where to go, and most of all you will build a relationship with the store along with your projects..Good luck
aakBoston,
The Bridgewood TS appears to be the same as the Grizzly except for the fense. The difference in price is due to right tilt verses left tilt and the more expensive machine provides much more table top to the right of the blade...probably 50" verses 26". Many of us here have Grizzley's and are very happy with them....and the shop fox classic fense.
If you have a couple of spaces in you electrical box you can probably run a 220 line to the saw.
Becareful when you compare prices....make sure you evaluate all the add-ons. Delta is now offering a made in China TS too now...so there is lots to choose from.
I personally do not place any value on left tilt verses right tilt.....others do.
On reading your post, several things occur to me:
1) Is this your first table saw? Almost every cabinet saw will require a 220v circuit, while nearly every contractors saw will run on 110v.
2) So the first question should be how difficult it would be in your particular situation to run this 220v circuit? If getting a wire from your circuit breaker box (assuming you have two single spaces available) to the saw's location will be fairly straightforward, that's what you should do. A 220v motor is more efficient and beefier.
3) Right tilt vs. left tilt. Here's why left-tilt machines have become so popular: If you position your fence to the right of the blade as most do, a right-tilt machine tips the blade toward the fence; thus, when you are ripping, one part of the board is captured between the fence and the tilted blade, which can make for a wicked kick back.
The left-tilt blade dramatically reduces this potential for kick-back; is this feature worth $400 extra? Probably only if you anticipate doing a whole lot of ripping fairly narrow boards at an angle. Remember that until a few years ago, there was just one left-tilt saw on the market (Powermatic), which means that the vast majority of saws sold in this country were right-tilt.
4) It does sound like you are comparing two different saws, however. Normally there is not that much price differential between left and right tilt machines. And you did mention that the table on the less expensive version was smaller. I would check out what other differences there might be between the two saws.
5) Bridgewood / Wilke reputation. I don't own any of their equipment, but in my circle they have an excellent reputation. They just don't have the marketing muscle that other importers have (e.g. Grizzly).
6) Local service. I would discount the importance of this. In this age of FedEx, almost everyone is servicing stationary equipment over the phone.
But some are better and more responsive than others. I would suggest you call Wilke with all your questions so you can take their measure.
I have a Bridgewood shaper and jointer. Think they are excellent machines and I have had good service from them in answering questions. I assume you have seen the Fine Woodworking article on Bridgewood table saw. There is also a short article in new June/July 2004 issue of WOOD.
WOOD's review says, "It appears that Bridgewood's designers married the massive box trunions of a Powermatic 66 with the stout trunnion-mounting brackets of a Delta Unisaw. The result is a powerful, vibration-free saw who fence scale remains accurate throughout the full bevel range." Etc. Rated 4 out of 5 stars.
I live in Central PA between Grizzley and Wilke (Bridgewood). So far I prefer Bridgewood. As you may know, there are a lot of woodworking shops in PA and Bridgewood is fairly common around here.
Alan - planesaw
Edited 5/10/2004 10:06 pm ET by Alan
The 220 vs. 110 debate can get heated and very lengthy! But it can be boiled down to a very simple evaluation and decision, IMO: How much power do you want to have left over for other items? Your shop panel is only going to hand out so much juice (x number of amps) and if you run a saw on 110 you're going to use up roughly twice as many amps out of that allotment for the saw, leaving fewer amps for the rest of the machinery and lights.
I have a 1.5HP table saw that can be wired either 110 or 220. For now it's running on 110, but the minute I get a dust collector, that will change -- I will finish off the 220 wiring that's been brought to the sub-panel in the shop, and switch the wiring on the motor.
Personally, I'd not even try to run a 3HP motor on 110. It draws way too many amps at that voltage.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
>> How much power do you want to have left over for other items?
I agree, if you're talking about other items that you want to have running at the same time.
It's not a problem to have more electrical devices plugged in or more circuits than the service will carry. If I turned everything in my house on, it would draw much more amperage than the service is rated for, which could get exciting, since my service is so old it doesn't have main breakers. But in practice it never happens.
"if you're talking about other items that you want to have running at the same time." I'd imagine most people figured that part out, given the context and my comment about the dust collector.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
About those amps...I know there's a fixed amount of amps on a panel but does it matter how many you're using at a time (I personally only use my Dust collector, one peice of equipment and the lights at a time). As long I only do this, shouldn't I be able to wire up as many big amp items as I want?
Thanks for all the advice. I'm not sold on the Bridgewood but I did get a little excited about the price for a 3HP machine ($1000 for the cheaper one, $1400 for the left tilt machine). The $1400 is about my upper limit for what I can spend on a Table Saw right now. especially since I'll have to drop some money to get the right power installed. So as a follow up, are there any other cabinet saws (I'd like 3HP) for around $1400 out there. Most of the saws I've seen have been around $1800 and higher.
Have you checked out the Grizzly's yet? Here's the link to their tablesaw line:http://www.grizzly.com/products/items-list.cfm?key=530010&sort=price
The 1023SLX has the Shop Fox Classic fence (better, from what I've heard, than the other SF fences -- a Beis clone), left tilt, and 7' rails for $1203 delivered.http://www.grizzly.com/products/item.cfm?itemnumber=G1023SLX
There are several 1023 owners here at Knots and on other forums, reporting high degrees of satisfaction it seems.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
aakBoston,
It cost me $100 for the electrical upgrade to 220v. I talked to an electrician and he told me what to buy...I ran the wires....he stopped by, checked everything and pluged it in to the panel for $50 bucks. ...he was at the house for 15 minutes.
Jamie: Is that a portable table saw your running 110 volts or a stationary one? IMO anything that draws 20 amps should run a 220 volt circuit. Not that it can't run on 110 volts , but the strain of running your motor on 110 volts will cut the life down tremendously, not to mention if there a voltage drop while under load. I also assume that your using a dedicated circuit for each of your tools to avoid a amperage breakdown.
Hi Ben. My saw is a Jet contractor's saw. It is on a dedicated circuit with a 20-amp breaker. I had trouble with it tripping the original circuit breaker, so I replaced the cord (12 ga. instead of the original 14), put in a new 20-amp-rated outlet, new plug on the cord, and replaced the circuit breaker. I think the motor pulls around 15 amps (it's raining outside, I'm too cozy to go out and look), maybe 18 or so on start-up. I've tripped the overload on the motor once or twice when the blade got jammed, but otherwise it runs fine. I use a link belt and, when ripping, a dedicated 24-tooth rip blade to make it easy on the motor. Most of my work is on stock 2" or less thick, so the motor isn't being pushed very hard.
I totally agree about using 220 for heavier loads than that, and certainly for a 3HP motor. My earlier response was designed to "cut to the chase." So many of these 220 vs. 110 threads get lost in highly technical discussions about electricity and motors, when the issue could really be boiled down to (a) what's needed to run a specific motor (per your suggestion) and (b) what's needed to power other tools/gizmos in the shop simultaneously.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I will cut right to the chase with my heartfelt opinions. Not so long ago I lived not more than 12 miles from Wilke. Visited there several times. Their customer service and ability to answer questions was POOR. I would never buy anything from them. As far as the quality of the TS in question, I would agree with many others that responded to your post--- look SERIOUSLY into the grizzly. I have one myself and I am very pleased. Great machine with great value. And lastly you gotta go 220 to run most any descent 3HP or more cabinet TS. Running 220 is no big deal. If you are uncomfortable running a 220 line yourlself, hiring a licensed electrician is not a waste of money. I myself had an electrician run the 220-- and it was money well spent. My Grizzly runs like a champ and I can make saw dust to heart's content or till my wife calls me up.
Good luck,
Cheatah
When it comes to left vs right tilt each has minimum advantages over the other depending on the type work you do with your saw. With a table saw you want your workpiece to be face up in most cases. Most of us learn to use table saws with the fence to the right of the blade. When ripping bevels with a right tilt and the fence to the right you will be placing the workpiece face down if your long point is on the face. This may increase the likelyhood of tearout on the face and may cause jamming. Tearout can be controlled with zero clearance inserts and the correct sharp blade. Jamming is controled by using straight, flat pieces on a properly aligned and tuned saw. Operator skill is a big factor in all cutting. Ripping small bevels may require adding a sacrificial fence with the blade let into the fence, left tilt or right. On a left tilt saw with the fence to the right, your piece can be face up but downward pressure can pinch against the blade on small rips.
If you also use the table saw for crosscuts, miters and compound cuts you should consider which side of the blade you prefer to work on. Again thinking about good face up or down and also how much room you have to either side of the saw, fence removed, for long pieces.
There are many different ways to overcome limitations of machinery, and many ways to make the type of cuts I described above. Personally I don't rip bevels often and when I do I prefer to have my piece face down under the blade. Right tilt is my choice. I think you could buy a six inch joiner with the $400. The perfect partner to a table saw.
This forum post is now archived. Commenting has been disabled