Table Saws ?’s: Contractor vs Hybrids
Greetings all- first time posting, so I’d appreciate any advice I can get…here goes–
I’m in the market for a table saw. I’ve been working with wood for about 20 out of my 32 years, but save for a few years access to the high school shop, I’ve had little access to a table saw. I’ve mastered the art of rigging up temporary garage shops, and have built quite a number of shelving units and light furniture projects with circular saws, guides & clamps. Now I’m finally building a real woodshop & ready for the leap foward. So, my question is regarding table saw types.
I looked at a number of contractor level saws and they seem pretty good. I was a bit disappointed with the fence on the Jet, for instance, as it didn’t stay true with a little preasure on the far side. But I wonder if that’s a problem with all front locking fences. Then I came across the new Craftsmans, and was impressed with the quality. I’m now stuck on the desire vs. budget struggle: The $650 contractor model comes with a 1.5 hp motor and that front locking fence & would be just fine for 90% of my tasks. But I’ve been known to push the limits of my tools (like running 4/4 oak stock through my poor scroll saw) so I’m very tempted to go for broke & buy the $900 Commercial saw with it’s 1.75 hp motor & Bies fence. It seems to me that this latter saw fits into the catagory of “hybrid” table saws – but is not quite a cabinet maker saw, which I definitely cannot afford. (So maybe it’s a question of $-value vs. use-value for contractor vs. hybrid saws)
Is there anyone out there that has put these tools to the test that can comment? Is the extra torque and fence rigidity worth the extra 250 bucks or so (pretend you have a 2 month old kid & not a lot of $….but then pretend you may want to build this little tyke a special toy box soon 🙂 Also, are there any other brands that are comparable at this price?
Thanks in advance…
Matthew, Seattle
Replies
This new Craftsman saw is the only Craftsman power tool I've been impressed with in 20 years. The design does appear to be an excellent one, with definite improvements over the hybrid saws made by others such as DeWalt and Jet. That being said, however, if you were to "go for broke" why not get a true cabinet saw. The Grizzly 1023S is a proven performer, sells for $955+$78 shipping, and comes with an excellent fence and a 3HP motor.
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)
Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
All front locking fences will deflect at the back end. The force required to deflect them varies a bit.
What actually IS your budget? Once you get into the $900 price range you ought to consider the low end cabinet saws. The caveat there is you also need to consider your electrical system and whether it can handle that class of saw as well. If your budget is considerably less, then the contractor saws tend to be very good values, some more so than others.
I seriously doubt you would ever be able to notice a 0.25hp difference.
I have a "selecting a tablesaw" article on my web. You might find it useful to help clarify your needs which would also help us give you advise.
PMB
http://benchmark.20m.com
Haven't any experience with the new Craftsman saws but from what I've read, the mid to upper level saws seem to get good ratings. The one thing I would watch for is the size of the dust shroud opening, if it has one. The knock on the DeWalt is that the 2.5 inch opening clogs with woodchips. Probably worst when ripping.
You might want to shop around. I have a General International contractor style saw with a 2 hp motor. So far I haven't had any problems running it on 120 volts. Lots of oomph without tripping breakers. For real heavy duty work though, you might want to consider shopping around for a used cabinet saw. The 3 horse motor will make a huge difference but you need 220 v.
I bought the 22124 for Christmas. I upgraded from a 25 yr old Shopsmith and so far I'm very happy with the saw and Sears/Orion service. The Biese fence arrived with a slight tilt and customer service had a new one on my doorstep in 4 days.
You can carry on a normal conversation when this saw is cutting wood! I've left mine at 110 even though I have 220 in my shop, but I only run the saw 1 hour/day usually so electricity is not a real cost.
I haven't even hooked up the dust pipe yet. End of day, I just vacumn out the cabinet.
The attached outfeed table is a bonus. For years I've had to set up 3rd hands that would fall over at the wrong time. I put mine on the mobile base so I could clean under it easily.
I don't know what current deals are running but I paid $725.00 for mine delivered. Included 2 year service agreement and mobile base with sale and Craftsman Club 10% off.
Lastly, this is just my opinion and is NOT a sales talk.
Joe
Well, here I go again :-)
I've had the Craftsman 22124 since early October. I'm absolutely satisfied with it.
Wait a moment... I lied; I'm thrilled with that saw.
(If you take a few minutes to search about in Knots and Tool Talk you'll come across other threads on the 22124 saw. I've tossed my too-few-cents-worth of comments into some of them -- do an All Forums search using 22124 as the keyword.)
Some of the advantages of the 22124 over the 22114 "mid-saw" are the larger table (extension wings are 12" vs 10"), the outfeed table, the Biesemeyer fence, a slight bump up in power, and the better blade. It looks "cooler", too :-)
I put my 22124 on a "Craftsman Universal Mobile Base" (which is a re-branded HTC base) and it rolls about just fine. It even stays put when I need it too.
I wish you good luck and a lot of happiness with whichever machine you finally choose. I just know that I'm not alone when it comes down to being extremely pleased with all aspects of purchasing, owning and using the big Craftsman 22124 table saw. Sears is definitely out to ruin its rotten reputation!
-- Steve
Enjoy life & do well by it;
http://www.ApacheTrail.com/ww/
I picked up this saw on Fathers Day, got it on sale and got the craftsman club discount plus a $50 gift card that went for the mobile base. Had it delivered the next week right into my garage. Took a few hours to set it up and tweak it but after that it's been flawless. Some of the directions for calibrating and adjusting the fence and the bladeguard were lacking, but overall the saw is fantastic.
I'm a relative noobie to this and dove in after reading all the reviews and couldn't be more pleased. I still have some minor adjusting to do, but I'm very satisfied with the results and the saw now outperforms my other skills, I'm always happy when a tool makes me the limiting factor;)
anyway, thanks for all the advice and information. Oh, and as some other's pointed out, the "crate" it comes in is quite beefy. I was disappointed I couldn't put it to some other use other than a "club house" for my kids until trash day (a scavenger picked it up;))
Thanks!
T.
please,please, please!
Look at Grizzly offerings.
I know that you might like to hold it in your hot hands before buying but ...
I can't see spending that sort of money without considering a Grizzly! Those who own Grizzly tools as well as several magazines call the grizzly saw a best buy!
I previously owned a Delta nd cannot tell you what a P.O.S that thing was.
heck you already are on line skip over to grizzly.com and look.
frenchy! Have you been gone, or have I just missed your posts somehow?! C'mon now, admit that you're one of "those who own Grizzly tools." Don't you have the 8" jointer??forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
yeh, I got a virus that had me pretty much off line (that and I actually had to do some real work)
the basement is full of Grizzly stuff.. 12 inch table saw, 8 inch jointer, 20 planer, 3 hp shaper, molder, (shop fox) and air purifer, dust collector, I do have a Jet band saw that I bought prior to finding Grizzly
Major fan of Grizzly!
Frenchy, since you're back seemingly in full swing now, maybe you could stop by this thread:http://forums.taunton.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=tp-knots&msg=20502.1
and give your .02 worth. The thread was started by Andy Engel, Senior Editor. Given how much work you do with your Grizzly tools, your input would be invaluable!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Welcome to the forum! Most of us understand the budget contraints completely. That said, most of us also understand the importance of trying to buy the best TS we can afford that will do the job....cheaper to buy once if possible. The Sears 22124 go on sale alot. Right now it's $809. Before Christmas is down near the $700 mark, making it an excellent bargain IMHO. Undoubtedly, the better steel t-style fences have insignicant deflection and are worth a few extra bucks....the rails are also alot stronger.
Grizzly, Shop Fox and Bridgewood offer good contractor saws with a decent Biese knock off fence. Prices are typically attractive.
The GI 50-185 is an excellent saw with a great fence, 2hp motor, and a pretty good stock miter gauge. It typically runs in the $660-$700 range with 30" rip.
My complaint with the Jet and DW hybrids are cost and the quality of the fences at their respective price points. IMO the 22124 has them pretty well covered on all counts.
My vote is for is for the 50 220 MI from General with the Biesemeyer fence,but I'm probably bias because I own one and love it. I hear the new craftsman Hybrid getting alot of praise too. But the biggest thing you should consider is do you want to invest in a brand new tablesaw without dust collection.If your answer isn't No Way ,ask around to any one who has it. Good Luck.--- Edit. I didn't realize before posting this was from January. Hope you like what you bought.
Edited 7/5/2005 8:36 pm ET by Walker1
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