Call For Entries:
Show Us Your Shop!
The Taunton Press is seeking photos of workshops for possible publication in our upcoming Workshop Idea Book, by craftsman and designer, Andy Rae. We’re especially interested in the following detail shots: shop floors, dust-collection setups, doorways or other access points, lighting, heating and cooling systems, compressed-air setups, machine set ups, workbenches, assembly areas, veneering and finishing storage and setups, sharpening stations, sanding setups; wood, hardware, and tool storage, safety gear, homemade spray booths, and drying areas. Our audience wants to see unique workshops that utilize clever time, money, and space-saving solutions. If this sounds like your shop, please send:
- A color 2 ¼ or 35mm positive transparency or high-resolution digital image showing the device in use, rather than a static still-life. If it’s a tool or jig, put your hands on it; if it’s a shop floor, stand on it to give a sense of scale.
- Digital submissions must be photographed at the highest possible resolution that yields at least 4 x 6 @ 300 DPI printed image. Camera MUST be set at high resolution and low compression. Save files as JPEG or TIFF and submit them on a disk. Include a print-out of all images on the disc.
- Photos must be in focus, have good contrast, and show uncluttered but real backgrounds.
- Deadline for submissions is April 30, 2004.
Send all submissions to The Taunton Press, Books Dept., 63 South Main St., Newtown, CT 06470, ATTN: Robyn Aitken
Replies
Sounds like a great idea. I would like to see shops of the contributing editers. I was ready to grab the camera, then I read the part about " uncluttered ". Would take untill April 30 to clean it up but then I wouldn't be able to find anything.
Dave Koury
No, I'm pretty sure you don't want to see the disaster that I loosely call "my shop". ;>)
I'm out, I started the "Most Trashed Shop" thread last year. :o)
How about "lessons learned".
Vast improvements have been done but "After" pics may never happen.
Enjoy, Roy
Do people with nice neat tidy shops get any work done?? Every one shown should be rated in terms of productivity.
PlaneWood by Mike_in_Katy (maker of fine sawdust!)PlaneWood
Ha!
I was browsing through a shop book a while back with one of my WW buddies - each shop pictured was the epitome of cleanliness. My buddies comment - "Wonder if they get any work done in these places?"
I spent all day, from sun-up to dinner cleaning and straightening up just one *end* of my land fill .... I mean shop and still have another week to go.
Should have made the deadline april 1st ... at least I could enter mine as an april fools joke.
...........
From Beautiful Skagit Co. Wa.
Dennis
Yeah.....I have exposed floor joists in the ceiling and plastic sheeting separating the shop from the front half of the basement.
Hey Sarge, your shop is always clean!
TDF
Tom
"Hey Sarge, is your shop always clean"?
Of course it is. I was just pondering giving it the spring cleaning as the 70's have arrived in Atlanta. Cob webs are abundant and dust in all the nooks and crannies. It's seen some heavy usage this past year and it shows.
Just finished milling about 800 sq. feet of pecan we cut about 10 years ago that will be used for donated sports trophy cases at a new high school. We're working on a 30's "street rod" at my work and the interior head-liner bows and panels are being fabricated in my shop. And the good news is as soon as I'm finished, a crochet cabinet, break-fast nook table and new bed is on requisition from the "First Lady" as summer through fall projects before the normal Xmas toy donation cranks back up in Oct.
Yep, clean as a surgical operating room after a tornado scored a direct hit! Now if you asked if everything was in it's place, organized and can I walk around in an orderly fashion; the answer would be YES !! It may have dust in all the nooks and crannies and cob webs, but everything has a place and that is where it ends up when I'm finished using it.
By the book and discipline are my strong points! Coffee stains and spiders are not! ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..
Regards...
sarge..jt Proud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Anyone think I can make it with my shop, it is very dreamy...
http://www.mgstocks.com/shop1.jpg
http://www.mgstocks.com/shop2.jpg
Although it is often somewhat productive
Michael
One of those "french maids" and a graphics disigner could have it clean and touched up for "photos's suitable for framing in no time at all"!
:>)
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Love it, Mike, that's what a real shop looks like! I doubt you'll make the cut for the magazine, though. Can't see enough brand names on the tools, for one thing. Having three drill presses would be a plus for you, if they were all recognizable advertisers... ;-) BTW, what is that router setup in the lower right used for?
I doubt my shop woud get much consideration either. I need a really wide-angle lens just to get any photos, as it is only 16 feet square. Only small areas of floor are visible between tools, the cheapo POS bench, DC hose, etc. and the router chips... Maybe I'll take a few shots and send them in anyway, what the heck!"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
Raitken,
If Taunton likes "uncluttered" how about uncluttering the several duplicate postings.
We don't miss much around here. There was no need for that.
Enjoy, Roy
I am honored that you would even care what is in my shop. I LOVE that chest you made for swords! I would love to be able to do that kind of work.
The machine is a 3D pantagraph, I use it for carving small gunstocks. It is a POS from the factory, for $50 they could make it vastly better. It weights in at 45lbs. I just got a 2 spindle carving machine that weights in at 1050lbs! It will do 20 inch diameter items, 60" long and even has an attachment to do mirror images!
You can see the first gunstock I carved with my new machine, it is laying on the band saw table. You can see a bunch of stocks in the second photo. There is a sawed in half original WWII garand stock that I am making into bookends, there are a pile of wood pistol grips for a .22 machinegun and in the background is an Uzi stock for someone who target shoots with it. Yes, there are matches held with submachinguns, just for fun, here is the link to a big one.
http://www.issmc.com/
Your site is great, I like all that stuff, I even have a sword by Jim Hrisoulis I bought years ago. I am going to use my new machine to also make some fun midievil sort of stuff for friends and family.
Michael,
I wondered if that was a special set-up for routing barrel channels or something. Noticed all the gunstocks and figured that's what you were making! I used to shoot a lot, and refinished a couple of gunstocks, but don't make much smoke any more.
I've met Jim Hrisoulas a few times; that guy does amazing stuff with metal. A pioneer in the revival of pattern-welded steel that is so big nowadays. I'd love to have one of his blades.
I took a few pics of the shop today, will try to post them tomorrow.
Thanks for the nice compliments!"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
Well this thread has gone off in an odd direction, hasn't it?Anyway, I said I'd post a few pics of my little corner of heaven, so here 'tis. All 256 sq. ft. of it, tools crammed wherever they will fit, almost everything on wheels except the jointer (small enough I can walk it around) and the lathe (vibrates too much). You can even see the plywood-on-sleepers floor, 'cuz my darling wife sweeps it out every so often. (No slab, the sleepers are on 6-mil poly laid right on the ground. Building is pole-framed.) El cheapo bench from HD has pride of place in center.
Background is too cluttered for FWW, I'm guessing... but if I put doors on the cabinets I'd never be able to open them! (Have that problem already with the one behind the BS.) So everything is out on shelves where I can find it and it can get that good healthy coating of dust on it.
In two months, though, we hope to be moving into the new house, and then this cabin we're in now will become my new shop! It will feel positively huge, being all of 750 square feet with another 150 or so in two rooms at the back. Might even be able to make one of those a finishing room and get a spray rig.
I'm sure it will still be cluttered, though. Just the way I am.
"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
A W
From what I see you shop is a lot more organized than you give yourself credit for. You have a traffic pattern between machines and eveything is up where you can find it. You are limited by space and have compensated by going mobile on casters.
My first shop was about the same size except it was also the storage room, garage, contained the hot water heater, washer and dryer. I had about 80 sq. ft. in the center left to work with. TS was a circular mounted under a 2 x 4 piece of ply and take-down as it mounted on folding saw-horses. All the other hand and power tools were in stack boxes and you had to rifle through them to get what you needed. It was in Florida, so you could open the door and put up temp tables out in the drive-way most of the year.
So it may not make FWW magazine, but it is laid out and organized as well as can be with the space you have to work with. I'm sure your new one that has more space will allow you to take an even more clever approach than you already have.
Nice shop... :>)
sarge..jt Proud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hey Sarge, thanks for the encouragement, I don't often get accused of being organized ! :-D More a matter of necessity than cleverness, I'm afraid.
80 sf?!! OK, I'll quite whining about my shop now. Like you say, it must not be that bad, I manage to get some things built in it.
TO their credit, Taunton has featured small shops and small-shop solutions in FWW and in the shops issues. I think what caught my eye was that remark about "cluttered backgrounds," as most working shops don't seem to have uncluttered walls. Tools, templates, and stock storage clutter up the background of most working shops. The smaller they are, the harder this is to avoid, seems to me."Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
A W
Having a smaller shop creates necessity for cleverness to overcome. I have about 850 sq. ft. in the main shop now with another 500 or so behind that serves the wood-rack and several machines ( spindle sander, grinder, low-boy assembly table) and without getting things hung and shelved it would still be cluttered. I just try to get things as close to the machine or bench that I'll actually be using them at. Common sense tells me not to hang saw blades, push sticks, tenoning jig, etc. on the other side of the shop away for the TS.
I have hand planes on a shelf beside the main work-bench lined up by the numbers. This might create a look of displaying them for public view. Nope! I can turn and get the one I want without having to take more than 3 steps. Clamps, finish materials are by the assembly table. I build my own bases for machines that can house their accessories, etc., etc., etc.
I took a year and designed the shop space I have to full potential of organization. Most don't have that time, but I am a hobbyist by choice and do. I have lovely pics I took the day I had it finished. They never collect dust. As I stated earlier, the shop does. The more power tools you use, the more dust you accumulate. The more space required also. I spent Sunday doing a spring clean-up. Is it the way the pics I have show it? Nope, and never will be. I spent 6 hours cleaning cobb webbs, dust, etc. and it still has dust. It's clean and organized, but it will never be the same as that day I took the original pictures. I accept reality and that's necessity!
BTW, I also do my own mechanical work on cars, plumbing, electrical and painting. My forward and rear shop space has to share space with tool-boxes and equipment for those little side-lines also. Necessity!! And in my spare time............ ha.. ha...
Regards...
sarge..jt
Proud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Edited 3/9/2004 10:42 pm ET by SARGE
Edited 3/9/2004 11:22 pm ET by SARGE
Works for me! By the look of the work on your website, I'd say it works pretty well for you to. Though it may not live up to the standard that they are looking for, I get the impression not too many of us do. Oh well, back out to the shop!
Brian
I am positively jealous for all the "stuff" y'all have to clutter your shops with!! Now, if I can just expand my collection of clamps, etc., etc. I might be able to keep up with!
LOVE the pictures though - keep 'em coming!
Robin"Well-behaved women rarely make history."from the Sweet Potato Queens' Book of Love
I don't have a dirty shop. A dirty shop is not directly correlated to woodworking genius.
What I don't have is a very impressive shop. I do all my woodworking with hand tools. I used to have an impressive shop space (warehouse space with huge windows) but that came with a high rent.
What I have are two sturdy workbenches in about 250 square feet of space. A lot of my tools reside on the one shelf that my bench has. The rest are hung on two full sheets of peg board or in a box. I have some shelves for my woodworking books. I have a B&D Workmate hung on the wall that I occassionally use.
I don't have under the floor dust collection. But I do sweep plane shavings at the end of the day with a big broom. Sometimes the smaller chips and dust fall through the cracks between the floor boards. Does that count as under-the-floor dust collection?
I don't have a tool chest or fancy shelves to hold my planes. Why do I need a chest? I never work outside the shop - I'm a furniture maker not a carpenter. I don't care much about displaying my planes - they're tools. I don't have a wall tool cabinet that will only hold a fraction of the tools and measuring devices I own. I always laugh when I see one of these projects - the pictures are always of a cabinet with a smoother, a block plane, a rebate plane, and a few chisels. Where are the 18 hollow and rounds stored? In my shop, they're in the box that Larry Williams used to ship them to me. It's a nice paste-board box with styrofoam dividers. When I need the H&Rs, I get the ones I need out of the box. I guess they would look good on a shelf, but like I said I don't brag on tools.
I'd rather receive a compliment on something that I built with the tools that I own instead of a compliment about my nice tool collection.
I don't have a lot of fancy jigs and fixtures. Hand tool woodworkers lay out work directly on their stock and cut to that layout with an appropriate tool. I don't have a cutesy rolling clamp rack. My clamps are stood up in the corner - they're not abused - they're just in the corner. When I need some of them I walk over and get the ones that I need.
I haven't gotten around to building a sharpening station (I don't need one). My sharpening stones sit on the shelf with my hand planes (the oilstones in a Tupperware container filled with lamp oil). I have a smallish piece of plate glass that I use to hold coarse sandpaper when I need to regrind a bevel. I have an extra fine ceramic stone on the shelf too. If I spill oil on my bench when I'm sharpening I don't cry. Oil doesn't hurt wood. It's a workbench, not a piece of living room furniture.
Overall, the shop is far from cluttered - it's neat and workmanlike. But it certainly doesn't look like any shop Taunton ever featured in a book or in FW.
Chas, it sounds to me like your shop would be an ideal subject for this issue!
If you are annoyed by the kinds of shops Taunton features - submit your own for consideration. There should be a minimalist, hand-tool-dominated shop to balance out each of the enormous Norm-inspired power tool displays. But if the people who have these shops refuse to try to get them published, then you're making the perception problem worse.
At the very least - post some pics here, so we can see what you are talking about! Please?"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
I may do just that....
Though it would be nice if they made a specific request to see how the other half lives.
Charles
I would love to see your shop pics! If it has wooden floors, I'm already sold. Someday...
You might pause at a magazine rack when out and take a look at this month's Popular WW'ing magazine. I don't normally buy it but I did. The cover caught my attention. It has Don Weber, a chair-maker from Paint Lick, KY. on the cover. He did a table for the article as he does all by hand. Take a look at that work-bench on the cover and scan to his shop and tools inside. We're talking basics here. I love the look of that work-bench. I haven't seen one that worn in 30 years. It gives off vibrations. ha.. ha...
Regards... P.S. hope arm is healing!
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Don't get excited unless you like 1x subflooring material as a floor. Nice and flexible though - very easy on my joints and the tools when I drop them.
The only thing I've done to the place is screw pegboard to the walls, moved the tools and workbenches in, and started to work. There is no electricity. I'm not wasting my time running any just to have lights. A Coleman lantern works fine. I don't work too much at night anyway. I do have one window. I need to build a new batten door sometime.
I don't consider my 'shop' to be the building that I'm in at any given time - I consider it to be my workbench, assembly bench, and my tools. If I can keep them out of the rain that much the better. I'd work in a Sears Sir Edmund Hillary cabin tent if I had to. In fact, that probably wouldn't be all that bad - the ventilation would be better and if a board was too long the walls would give a little to accommodate... Maybe a yurt would make the best shop of all.
Thanks for the heads up on PW.
Edited 3/10/2004 4:36 pm ET by CHASSTANFORD
Edited 3/10/2004 5:22 pm ET by CHASSTANFORD
Charles
Plywood floor is more forgiving than concrete. Anything is more forgiving for concrete for that matter. Foot comfort is a must if you spend a lot of time on them, as you know.
The tent isn't a bad idea. I have seen about every surgical operation known to man done inside one with less than sufficent lighting. The bottom line always remains if the operation was sucessful or not! Your point, in essence.
I like rustic. Keep in mind I hail from the foot-hills of the Appalachians. Pass that corn liquor jug. And put your shoes on and grab the broom quickly if company shows. Other-wise, at-ease! ha.. ha...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Rustic is good. Nothing to get in between you and your woodworking. It's amazing how austerity forces you to pay attention to the task at hand. I'd go nuts sweating the dust collection system, measuring wattage for the appropriate amount of task lighting, and all the other things that take your mind off the chisel in your hand and the piece of wood on the bench. I wasn't always this way, but I'm glad I am now.
Charles, you should absolutely submit pictures of your shop. I predict they will love the austerity. You are going to become famous, a living symbol for the "other" way of woodworking.
My wife and I were looking at the shop last night and trying to figure out how to shoot it. It's so small that the photograph would have to be taken through the open door to get one end of the shop and then shot through the window to get the other side. I mean it's tiny. Has a hell of a lot of atmosphere though.
Chas, I had the same problem, although sounds like your shop is even tinier... My camera zooms out to the equivalent of about a 35mm wide-angle lens, which gets about half the shop in one shot, if I stand just outside the doorway. You might need to find somebody with an SLR and a true wide-angle lens, maybe 28mm.
I hope you do, because I'd like to see it - my curiosity is whetted!
There's an annual Shop Tour up here on the Mendo coast, where several professionals open their shops for a day and invite the public to come in. Ranges from the spectacular (Four Sisters' dream shop, featured in FWW) to the, ah, "intimate" (a former one-car garage, no bigger than my place). It's a lot of fun to do the tour, see all those shops in one day, and chat with the woodworkers. Fascinating to see how different shops can be - from the straightforward industrial setting to highly personalized spaces."Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
Sounds like an interesting tour.
I don't want to appear as if I enjoy personal torture as far as shop space is concerned. I'd love to have a thousand square feet or so with beautiful Maple floors, lots of windows, a fireplace, the whole works. But I wouldn't want the shop space itself to become an obsession.
I don't begrudge those who have a great shop, although I'm sure it sounds as if I do sometimes.
Charles
Take the pics and don't worry about how they come out. I am not a photographer and this isn't a photography forum. I accept however they come out.
I have never seen a shop period that I didn't like. To me, they are the "great escape" into an en-chanted, mystique world. Every now and then, you even run into a craftsman inhabiting one. ha.. ha...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I think we'll take some snaps this weekend and send them in for the hell of it.
Wow, some of you guys aren't too far from me. I am over in Sacramento! We have a woodworking group here that is pretty big although the skill level is all over the place and no real "artisans".
We have a shop tour that is fun, always a good excuse to clean up the shop! I am sure I will do it again as everyone will want to see my new stock machine when I get it installed. Boy is it a beauty.
Michael
Michael
I believe that you might direct your post to Albionwood. He is in the Redwoods and Charles and myself are down south. But we do have pick-ups that are equipped with compasses and are capable of pointing them in a West-North-West direction at any time. Is there any of those gold nuggets left in that "crick" up by Sutters Mill?
Seeing as how we like to have a little fun, we might just load up those trucks with Budweiser and barbequed pork and head out that way for a "grand tour". Ya'll leave the porch light on for us, ya hear! ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
I just want to make it clear to Fine Woodworking that I love their magazine and think they do a fine job. I miss the direction they started in but I still think it is a great magazine. We all make choices to pay the bills.
Personally, I LOVE shop issues. I call it "tool porno"!
As for how things change in business, I started my stock making business thinking I would be making painstaking authentic reproductions of gunstocks for machineguns. I do some of that but I am surprised by how many want super fancy stocks for their guns. The first picture is of a stock for a WWII German machinegun and the bottom one is of Uzi submachinegun stocks for target shooters.
http://www.mgstocks.com/mg34back.jpg
http://www.mgstocks.com/fancyuzi.jpg
Michael
I started getting FWW with about the 3rd copy. It was quite a welcome back in those days when WW information was few and far between. Black and white and like TV's back then, it didn't matter.
I agree about people's preference in taste. I used to be a gun person long ago and the authenic stock on either of those classics ( German MG or Uzi ) seems more appropriate. I guess it's a personal thing. I see people take perfectly good pick-up trucks capable of doing work as they were designed and chopping them down into low-riders. H*ll, you can't even go over the hump in your drive-way without risking taking out the oil pan and rear-end. Nothing like a few sparks back around that gas tank with a leaking fuel line connector. I suppose to a low-ride owner, that would be the ultimate way to go to low-ride heaven! ha.. ha....
Regards...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hey Sarge,
A beer-'n'-'cue road trip! NOW yer talkin'! See ya when ya git here. My porch light is on most of the time anyway, the deer, skunks, mountain lions, etc. keep tripping the sensor. If yer gonna spend the night I might even put a fresh tarp on the roof.
Tim"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
A W
Now if we're gonna have "que", it just ain't appropriate to leave the table without a tooth-pick in your mouth. Grab one of those down-fall red-woods and git it split up into "California style" tooth-picks. Save time when we get there.
The new tarp soons good. I've spent a lot of time under tarps and quite a bit under sand-bags. You take an exotic vacation resort like "Khe-Sahn" and they both sure come in handy.
I got a pair of raccoons that visit for the shop cat's food evey few nights and they get that sensor along with the wind and falling hardwood branches that accompany.
Mountain lions, huh? I suggest you set out a couple of "clay-more anti-personel mines" and hook them up with trip wire. Should discourage the cats after the first en-counter. They got a lot of street smarts. ha.. ha...
Regards...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Charles
Why not? All they can say is no! If they do, post them on the forum and instead of taking the "high end tour" in the mag, we'll take the "blue collar reality" tour right on the forum at no charge. Everyone should send in a pic. All of us that are rejected just post them here under a "Blue Collar Reality Shops" thread!
I can detect the rebellious genes showing up from southern heritage. Homeland Security might suggest they beef up the current security status to high! ha.. ha...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Sarge, good idea. I still need to buy a new scanner.
Michael I live in the Southeast, fwiw.
Tim,
That shop tour sounds like lots of fun! Can you post here when the next one is scheduled? Great excuse to get out of the bay area for the weekend!
Wayne
Wayne,
The last shop tour was in October, following shortly after a local exhibition by the same group. It's hosted by Mendocino Woodworkers, an association of local professionals. I'll try to remember to post information here when the next one is scheduled. It makes a fun day, and rich city folks are always welcome for the weekend! :-D"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
Now I'm really intreaged. If I didn't live half the world away I'd volunteer to come over and take the photos for you.
Ian
Sounds good... it's little more than a potting shed I tell you with all honesty. I'll try to post pics soon.
Don Weber has gotten famous since he moved out of the Redwoods and into the Hardwoods... I guess Paint Lick, KY is more "in the limelight" than Mendocino, CA... ha ha! Don is a great guy, very funny and talented. Kind of a Welsh Roy Underhill? He moved away shortly after I moved up here, bummer for me but evidently good for him! Would love to see his new setup in Paint Lick.
Pretty basic, yeah, that's Don! He made many of his tools himself, being a blacksmith in addition to a bodger. He teaches workshops in both skills. Basically his approach is, you can start with a hammer and anvil, some scrap iron, a pile of limbs (to make charcoal), and a tree; and you end up with a forge, tools, and furniture. "Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
AlbionWood,
"The blacksmith is the father of all trades." Don't know who I'm quoting, but it's true.
Cheers,
Ray
A W
It's a decent article and he seems to be a character. The shop seems (the photos don't show the whole shop) large and sort of "out of place" for Paint Lick. But the benchs (weathered is an under-statement), foot operated lathe, etc. gets your attention.
Might just have to drop on some day on my way to Pa. to visit my in-laws to check him out. A lot of interesting characters up in the hills. There is a guy in VA. who makes the finest fiddles you ever saw. If you ask him the process he uses, the answer is "I just take a pile of that wood over there and use those tools over there and take away everything that doesn't look like a fiddle". ha.. ha... As far as I'm concerned, life doesn't get any simpler than that.
Out in the red-woods, huh! I saw the first home-made twin screw vise I ever saw out your way back in the early 80's. You talk about a dusty and cluttered shop, that shop ruled that category. You talk about a WW'ing craftsman, he was a craftsman when "craftsman wasn't cool". ha.. ha...
Regards...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Okay guys - y'all are being a bit tough on this. I don't think being uncluttered means you've got to clean to the pristine state we see in the magazine. They did say "real" but lets face it - we'd all get more done ANd more enjoyably if we kept our shops more organized than the picture offered. I don't have any nifty storage units OR a dust collection system so I'd love to see pictures of some of your shops that have been serving you for a while. Gives me something to look forward to.
BTW - when I took my woodworking classes at the U of Memphis, the last 15 minutes of every 3 hour class was spent cleaning up the shop. Yeah, it's a big shop but there were generally 14-15 people working at the same time. And yes, as the only "gurl" in the last class I think I can say that I was consistently one of the last to leave because I felt obligated to help until it was done while some of the guys never helped. I really need to get back in that mode - I do think it makes the process more enjoyable to come back to a relatively clean organized workplace - just like it is more enjoyable in my regular job.
Robin
Okay - Sarge - challenge here - go take some pics of your shop as you left it the last time - NO CHEATING - I'd love to see it in it's UNspring-cleaned state!"Well-behaved women rarely make history."from the Sweet Potato Queens' Book of Love
Robin,
I LOVE shop issues, don't get me wrong. My shop would look like one of those if I had some space and money. Currently, my table saw and jointer sit in the rain, covered usually but...
I am about to get a 2 car garage in addition to this one and so I may yet have a chance to be in a shop issue. I have never seen an article on using a large carving machine, nor have I seen an issue on gunstocks and I have read lots of the cool old B&W issues.
If you have never seen fine gunstocks, here is a link:
http://www.griffinhowe.com/claremountmodel.cfm
Besides, your never going to make everyone happy. I used to love reading about how to make and modify machinery but few people do that anymore.
I cleaned my shop once. My productivity then went down 50% cause of all the time I spent looking for where I put stuff!
When I 'worked' for a living, my desk was neat as a pin cause all my reference material, tools, and work was inside the keyboard and my brain!
All boils down to 'upbringing' I guess.
PlaneWood by Mike_in_Katy (maker of fine sawdust!)PlaneWood
Looks like the "Men's Lounge" at the woodworkers' countryclub(sorry, F.G. , I ment Women's longe)
"...the 70s have arrived in Atlanta."
I heard the South was behind the times, but that much?!!
scott
I think he means 1870s. Atlantans just found that General Sherman left town.
Newhuh
You guys are just jealous because General Sherman had to surrender his sword to General Lee at Appomattox Court House. That was just after we ran General Sherman out of town as we considered him too old to play with matches. Last we saw of him he was working on a "alligator wrestling" attraction on the side of I-75 down around south GA. helping entertain the Yankee tourist headed for Florida.
Now we trained that Sherman to become an entrepreneur and all without the aid of a snow-blower to keep traffic moving south-bound.
:>) he.. he...
sarge..jt
Proud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hey, Sherman cleaned up Atlanta so you guys could get the Olympics. He spared beautiful Savannah didn't he?
Anyway I used to live few blocks from General/President Grant's tomb in NYC paid regular homage to the great but controversial man and eventually lived down the street from the Triumphant Arch of the Union, in Brooklyn, celebrating the great victory against the rebelious states of the South.
Newhuh
And we re-built the city, are still rebellious, enjoy having a good time and the weather ain't bad at all.
:>)
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
rev
"I heard the south was behind times, but that much"?
From the looks of traffic in Atlanta, I can only wish for the 70's. ha.. ha...
Regards...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hey Sarge, you got your work cut out for ya, wow!
Seems to me your shop is always in pretty good "operating condition." Personally, I like the shop pics that are found in one of the scroll saw magazines -- they are professional shops, well-known successful sawyers, totally functional shops, but nothing like the shops you see in FWW, Wood, Amer. WWer., etc. Packed to the rafters from right to left with wood, tools, DC paraphernalia. But there's a sensible path and clear workbenches for handwork.
Too funny. forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
The old quaint shops are great. Especially all wood ones. That doesn't fit the description of most of our shops though.
One day soon, I hope to have a shop I timber-framed in the woods. I can stack as I please along-side my 55' Chevy on concrete blocks. There will be a Port-A-Potti on every corner for convenience and a ditch to dump things in. When they get out of hand, I just take the dozer and cover it up and back-hoe another.
But, even with that scenario you will find things in their place as I take time to do it. I don't do this for money so lost production time means nothing to me. I made my money else-where and the day that WW shows the first sign of pressure, I will quit WW. I don't spend every waning moment concentrating on producing something. Life's bigger than that and I'm not missing a beat if possible.
I don't like tripping over things I mis-placed a year ago. I don't like wasting time looking for a tool. I don't like staring at clutter and promising myself to organize it some-day in the future. The future is now for me as life is short. At the end of the day when it's time to clean up, I "just do it". No if's, and's or but's. It's simple enough!
I don't care how other people keep their shops. That's their personal business. I took pictures just after I designed mine. Those pics never get dusty. My shop does. The way I handle it is a personal choice that doesn't affect anyone but me. I like it that way. It's the American Way.. Freedom of Choice!!
sarge..jt
Proud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Edited 3/6/2004 12:27:03 AM ET by SARGE
Sarge,
Extremely well said. I couldn't agree more.
TerryRegistered Shopaholic
Terry
"To sweep or not to sweep, that is the question"!!
I got the answer covered at my place and will let others decide at theirs. I won't lose sleep with what-ever decison they make. The shop is where I go to relieve stress, not create it. My time, my way and my decisions.
BTW, you got a nice shop. To be politically correct, just a compliment from one WW to another. I'll let you handle production, quality control and time management. Unless you turn in an application to work for me those are area's that I have no need to know.
And if you did apply, an attached photo of your shop on your resume would probably get my attention and we could examine the next step as I personally like organization in an employee. Or did I already mention that?
Freedom of choice... H*ll yeah!! ha.. ha.. ha..ha..ha..
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Sarge,
"The shop is where I go to relieve stress, not create it. My time, my way and my decisions"
EXACTLY!!!! I get much pleasure from the furniture that gets made there, but I get equal pleasure from the shop itself. Having it clean and organized makes me feel good. Sorry if some folks don't think anything gets done in such shops, they are wrong. I work out there every single chance I get. I just leave it clean when I get done. :-)
Now, back to the shop. I'm trying to get the finish on a coffee table I built for my wife.
TerryRegistered Shopaholic
Terry
The question you ask could possibly be answered. I'm sure you've had to bite your lip on several occasions when these statements get made. I have seen them many times in the nearly two years I have been posting. Yet, I have never heard anyone that takes pride in keeping their shop organized and clean criticize anyone that post a pic of something that is sitting in a cluttered shop. Why? Because it doesn't affect you personally and there is absolutely no mature reason too.
I understand cluttered shops and have no grounds what-so-ever to criticize them. Some make a living and dead-lines have to be met. Some don't care to clean. Some are just pinched for time with family. Some enjoy that atmosphere. Some are so cramped that clutter will prevail. In the middle of projects that is the norm. It takes me 20 minutes to clean up and put things away at the end of the day. Less time than it takes to go through these threads on Knots.
There are probably isolated cases where the accusations are possibly correct. But for the most part they are made with a totally un-founded, hypo-critical, in-secure thought process that is an attempt to make the poster look like "macho-man on campus".
Bottom line, I wouldn't get to upset if I were you as I think most see through accusations as those you've referred to as mostly bull-s**t. If you decide to go critically ballastic on those that like a cluttered shop, expect for them to tell you to kiss their *ss. They should in that case. And if anyone jumps your case with you can't possibly produce when you spend all your time cleaning and making jigs, well.. firmly suggest they kiss yours.
It all boils back down to "Freedom of Choice" and doing it your way. Life is short and you just get one shot. Make it count and enjoy in the same stroke!!
Don't forget to vacuum. Inspection at 0:600 hours!ha..ha... ha..ha..ha..
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Err. . .I am afraid mine is not very photogenic.
Frank
Gee, I think I have all of those things, let's see --(shop floors) clean, smooth concrete floor, (dust-collection setups) a bunch of 4" connectors with a Jet 1 1/2 HP DC on wheels, (doorways or other access points) yea 2 of them, a door to the kitchen and a real big automatic roll up door, (lighting) 5 or 6 4 footers hanging' from the ceiling (heating and cooling systems) a 35000btu reddy heater hooked up to a propane tank, or I open the big door or two windows on the side wall (compressed-air setups) the Stanley/Bostich compressor on wheels in the corner ( machine set ups) depends on the machine, but my mortiser is sitting on top it's own cabinet..(workbenches) 2 of them, one to hold the radio and my truck keys, etc, (assembly areas) about 490 sq.ft I would guess... (veneering and finishing storage and setups) big closet in the "shop" (sharpening stations) on top of previously mentioned workbenches (wood, hardware, and tool storage) where ever it fits so I don't trip over the stuff (safety gear) ear muffs hanging on the router table( homemade spray booths) big cardboard box on top of previously mentioned workbench (and drying) open previously mentioned door/windows...... damn, I got a hell of a set up in that garage....why would I ever even think of building another building out back? I do look forward to seeing some of the submissions though....Rick
Sarge,
Maybe you can help...
I have an extremely usefull storage idea that I have incorporated into my shop. I'd like to submit pictures...but am confused about which pictures ...storage empty or storage full? I saved a couple of biscuit containers to I don't have to run up stairs to the bathroom...can you suggest which pics would be of greatest interest ?....ROTFL
BG
Forwarding pics of what a real "out-house" looks like and you should be able to take it from there. I would suggest you take those current biscuit cans out-side daily and top them with diesel fuel. Torch them out and you can continue to use them till you get inside plumbing.
Regards from the "sunny south" he... he...
sarge.jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hmmm....I guess this might be a stupid question...but...
Why is it that some poeple assume that having a clean shop means that nothing gets done and were just a bunch of tool collectors? I see this opinion in the forums alot. Never could quite understand it though.
I agree that having a nice clean shop means nothing as far as the quality of the projects that come from it. I'm just a hacker, but the shop is clean. :-)
Just wondering,
Terry...owner of a clean shop where LOTS of wwing gets done.
Registered Shopaholicwww.terryhatfield.com
Edited 3/5/2004 12:10:07 PM ET by Terry H
Edited 3/5/2004 1:55:12 PM ET by Terry H
Some people are very neat. Some are not. Every shop picture in FWW is very neat. Not real. A piece of vinyl-veneer particle board furniture from K-mart is precise to a thousandth of an inch and probably made in a very neat shop. Not fine woodworking. After 40 years of woodworking, yes, I know how to cut a dovetail and tune a plane and sharpen my tools. I know how to spray if I want to. No, I don't give a hoot about water stones or Norm's ultimate router table. "guards removed for photographic purposes only. Don't try this at home". If the guards were designed by a woodworker instead of a lawyer, they might not have been ripped off and thrown away 20 years ago, like all of mine. Let's see some actual fine woodworking for a change. Tell me something I have not already seen in a hundred other places. I got FWW from issue number 1 to when they changed to color. Stopped shortly afterwards. Now got a subscription again as a gift. I'm not impressed.
A big clean glossy shop. Nice. I'd have it filled with junk in a week. Just like the house and the yard and the truck.
Bob,
I do understand your point. I'm just totally anal about my shop. That's my choice and everyone is certainly entitled to doing what they want with their own space. I guess I'm just tired of reading that clean shops are "staged" that way and that nobody really has a shop like that, atleast not one were actual woodworking is going on.
I would make the additional comment that FWW is only doing what every other magazine does, regardless of subject matter. Car Craft shows really nice cars. Southern Living shows really nice yards and gardens....etc...
TerryRegistered Shopaholic
The product and the process are very different things. Just because the process is pretty doesn't necessarily mean the product is, and vice versa. I know a few people with clean(er) shops, but I'm more like that Pigpen character in Peanuts. I stand in a clean room for 5 minutes and disorder is magnetically attracted around me. That has no influence on the product. When I put a mirror finish on something, it really is. Would I like a clean shop? Sure. I'd also like to be tall and rich and 30 again, but smarter. What comes out of a shop depends on the hands and mind. A clean shop and fancy tools are helpful, but not a requirement. Chippendale built masterpieces and the circular saw and dust collector hadn't even been invented. I'll bet he had shavings on the floor. Now, if they had a book about workshops of master craftsmen regardless of how pretty they were, I might think about that. That would be something you could maybe learn something from.
Terry,
I think the assumption is, if you are cleaning up the shavings, in that time spent, you aren't making shavings. I get paid for the product, not for the pretty environment that the product came from. Now, to a degree, productivity is affected by a cluttered, disorganised workspace. But the fact is (for me, maybe not for you) if I am in high gear to get the job done, and I need a half dozen different tools to do the job, they are all gonna be on the bench. I'll put them away when the piece is in the client's house and I'm getting ready to make up the cut list for the next project.
I once spent an entire winter working wood in a 20'x20' shop without DC without sweeping the floor. I'd just moved into an old house, set up shop in a farm machine shed, the wife was pregnant. I DIDN'T HAVE TIME to clean up til spring. There was about 6" of dust and shavings on the floor. Friday afternoon cleanup time is a luxury I allow myself now. But I understand that for some folks, an organised work area is as necessary as getting paid was for me that first winter. Different folks have different priorities. Those priorities can vary with circumstances, or personality types. That's what makes horse races, and elections. Ain't life grand??
Cheers,
Ray
Ray,
"That's what makes horse races, and elections. Ain't life grand??"
Yes it is and I understand where you are coming from entirely. We are in two totally different situations.
For me it's a hobby. I should say passion I suppose. The entire reason I woodwork is to not be "on the clock" so to speak. My real job is a very stressful and hectic one. The shop is my pleasure. If I were doing it for a living I would have a different outlook on things. Making a living comes first, period.
I know it's sick, but I actually enjoy cleaning the shop. :-) Time means nothing to me when I'm in the shop. I am also quite sensitive to the dust as is my daughter, and she's a shop rat, so I have to have a really good collector which makes keeping a clean shop much easier.
I probably should have just kept my mouth...er..fingers shut.:-)
Thanks,
TerryRegistered Shopaholic
http://www.terryhatfield.com
Terry,
No, that's just my point. And that's what a hobby is for. My hobby is my 1938 Indian motocycle. When I'm working on it, or esp riding, that time thing is way far away.
Cheers,
Ray
Ray,
'38 Indian!!! Cool!!!! LOML won't let me get a motorcycle because they are to "dangerous", but she lets me play with spinning blades and other really sharp objects and such. Go figure. :-)
TerryRegistered Shopaholic
Terry,
The Indian I refer to as "my midlife crisis". It was my 50th b'day present to myself. My better half said an old motorcycle was preferrable to a new girlfriend. She's been very supportive, even after I broke my wrist last fall riding it (side stand vibrated down, and then I tried to turn left). Yes life is filled with choices, some are risky, some make you feel more alive than usual.
My next door neighbor, a career woodworker since his teens, recently had a run in with his tablesaw after 50 yrs of working wood and keeping all 10 digits. Now he's missing the last joint of his left index finger. If he'd bought a motorcycle when he retired...Choices.
Cheers,
Ray
Ray,
LOML ain't that easy to get along with. :-)
The actual problem is I'm an insurance damage appraiser in real life. She see's tooo many squashed motorcycles helping me with the business. I got no hope of ever owning one. Oh well. I'll stick to woodworking.
Thanks,
TerryRegistered Shopaholic
I agree with you. Doesn't it seem a bit odd that a number of folks are so defensive about clutter, shavings and dust. To each his/her own. Why do they presume so much?
Cheers,
Peter
I think it's a left-brain vs. right-brain thing. People with cluttered shops will never understand people with neat shops and vice-versa. It's a trait that is inate in each of us.
What really matters is the quality of the work produced and the enjoyment taken from same.
PlaneWood by Mike_in_Katy (maker of fine sawdust!)PlaneWood
Peter,
Thanks. I really don't know that answer. I guess that's why I posted in the first place. I really don't understand why some people thing that a clean shop = no woodworking and that clean shops are not real shops.
TerryRegistered Shopaholic
Amen
Not another shop feature... PUUHHLLEEAASSEE.
Having a tricked out shop means nothing.
I guess the crowd who spends all their time building spray booths, homemade air cleaners, tool display shelves for the wall, and all the other rot must be salivating at the thought of this new book.
Edited 3/5/2004 9:06:57 AM ET by CHASSTANFORD
You could always ignore this thread if it bothers you.
Cheers,
Peter
As I've gotten older, with more projects under my belt, one of the ways I get the ww process started is by doing a little cleanup. Now my shop is never as clean as the magazine photos I look at but it seems to stay fairly organized with just a little pre-cleaning each ww session. There is something about pushing the broom around and putting tools away that puts me into the right frame of mind. When I used to clean at the end of the day it seemed to take more effort to rev up the ww motor at the begining of a new one. Just an observation from another old woodworking fart.
Dennis
I only pay attention to the threads that do 'bother' me. Taunton could pleasantly surprise all of us with more than a few pictures from a 'minimalist' shop (probably worth a whole book and would do more for the craft than anything else I could think of but would piss your advertisers off royally). Maybe I'll send a picture or two after all.
Count me in the crowd, however small, that doesn't care all that much about what somebody else's shop looks like, at least unless a variety of shops are shown - from the very high-end "I don't do anything but build shi* for my shop" guys (the inevitable) to the "I've got a bench and some tools do I really need that much else?" guys. The folks in the second group aren't much in the market for Delta, Jet, or Grizzly though. And that could be problematic.
I don't begrudge your's (or Andy's) writing project at all. I know that shop specials are good sellers.
Edited 3/8/2004 7:52 pm ET by CHASSTANFORD
I have no idea what you are talking about.
If I'm not mistaken, you have the same name as a fairly prominent woodworker/writer who publishes fairly frequently in FW.
Must be a coincidence.
I have no idea.
A. I'm sure it means something to those that have tricked out shops (I take it you don't)
B. From the looks of a recent survey (different thread), lots of people learn a lot about wood working (and maybe other things too) from books. Maybe lusting after a new one isn't so terrible a thing.
C. No "shotgun" put downs; PUUHHLLEEAASSEE!!!!
Warmest of regards!
Mack"WISH IN ONE HAND, S--T IN THE OTHER AND SEE WHICH FILLS UP FIRST"
My shop. Complete with wood chips, my crappy bandsaw, templates screwed to the ceiling for storage, and all the good stuff crammed in like most shops.There are more old drunkards than old doctors. Ben Franklin
Blues Bass Player
Nice shop! I notice something when I see a picture of almost any shop that most have in common. No matter what material they're made, how large or how small all seem to reflect that the user has some sense of organization whether they admit it or not. I see the shelves for getting things off the floor. I see traffic patterns for getting to things in an orderly manner within the given space. I see taking the space you have and using it as wisely as you can to succeed.
I noticed the Maxwell House coffee can up on the shelf. I use that brand and the empty cans for various things around the shop also. Some things are sort of universal. Now that snow sitting outside is not down here in Atlanta. When we get it occassionally down in Atlanta, we just take the day off as if it were a National Holiday.
Blue Collar at it's best... looking good!! ha.. ha...
sarge..jtProud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Thanks Sarge! The wife is the coffee drinker and keeps me in a steady supply of empty cans for nails, sanding dust-for making filler, small dowels, and an assortment of screws. I neglected to post another shot of my shop from the back to front which shows where I hang a lot of my hand tools. It's now attached. I try to be organized. I love my shop. It's a great escape even if I'm hard at work.
By the way, my screen name is based on my last name which is LeBleu. I am a bass player and love the blues, among other styles. Regarding the snow, this year I bought a truck and a new plow to make a few extra bucks plowing. I should have realized it would be the Murphy's law winter up here. We got lots of cold but very little snow.
I'm gonna have a web site up and running in a few days with photos of my work. Trying to make up for the lost dough with the plow. The address will be http://www.finewoodshop.com There are more old drunkards than old doctors. Ben Franklin
Looks pretty dreamy to me! Lots of windows, tools on the wall where you can find them, nice crosscut sled on the cabinet saw, nice big finishing bench. Clean floor with that cushy, non-slippery stuff around the saw. But what's with that naked light bulb in the ceiling?
How large is this space?"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but no simpler." A. Einstein
http://www.albionworks.net
I guess I have no excuse for the naked bulb. I've never broken it while turning a board. Actually there are two naked bulbs. My shop is 16 x 24. When I was designing the shop I checked out the big orange box and they had 8 windows that were special ordered and returned, priced to move for $50 each. That explains why I have so many. I love the natural light. The only negative is that the windows are single pane. I built storms out of plexi that work well and blend in seamlessly.There are more old drunkards than old doctors. Ben Franklin
LeBleu Bass Player of the north
I knew you were a bass player. You mentioned it quite a while back. I can't remember the way home sometimes, but I remember small details from years gone by.
That is I think the best view of all. You do have some light there. That is a major plus. I like the shop and it would only take about a day for me to settle in. Just in case I forget to pay the mortgage. he.. he...
Nice shop and I know you're proud...
Regards...
sarge..jt Proud member of the : "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Robyn, What is a color 2 1/4?
Ian,
A color 2 1/4 is a color negative from a medium-format camera, measuring 2 1/4" square. Not something you find in most WW shops!
Wayne
Dear Raitken:
As a subscriber to Fine Woodworking; I can tell you that I am clearly not interested in yet another dream shop article, issue, magazine, or book. They are manufactured and misleading having little, if any connection to reality. Show me tips, jigs, tools, and furniture ideas. Lots of furniture ideas and work.
Get real and get to work. And no, I am not interested in this thread, but thanks for asking anyway.
Regards,
None
Do you think I'll make it in time???
26' wide x 74' long x 10 1/2' high
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