Replies

1. 
   BrianMcG | Apr 05, 2003 07:16am | #1

   Hi PM, Just a suggestion...work with pine for a while because;

   One, it is super soft and does tearout easily so it will help teach you some techniques like slowing feed rate or using a backer board to support the workpiece to minimize or eliminate tearout. so if you can master pine you can move up to more exotic material.

   And two, it's relatively cheap.

   later, Brian

2. 
   forestgirl | Apr 05, 2003 08:36am | #2

   Which of these operations are you using hand tools for, if any, and which ones are done with power tools?

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

1. 
   PeteMoss | Apr 05, 2003 02:52pm | #4

   I use hand tool exclusively with the exception of a cordless drill, jigsaw, and power miter saw.

1. 
   forestgirl | Apr 05, 2003 06:16pm | #5

   I had a feeling that might be the case.  Just wanted to head off a slew of power-tool tips!  Super-sharp might very well make a big difference.  I don't work much with hand tools because my hands don't work very well these days, but I've watched enough Roy Underhill Woodwright episodes to know that sharp makes a huge difference.  Wouldn't know what, specifically, to say about grain orientation.  Maybe Sgian and some hand-tool specialists will pitch in here.

   Walnut is supposed to be a great wood for working with chisels, etc.  I was reading an article the other day about perfecting dovetail techniques, and the author specifically stated not to practice on soft woods, but to use quality hardwood.  You mentioned tear-out with sanding.  This seems kinda odd.  May be using the wrong paper, not working through the grits properly, or sanding against the grain on areas such as corners.

   Are you a Roy Underhill fan?  His TV program and books are great resources for the hand tool woodworker.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

   Edited 4/5/2003 11:18:26 AM ET by forestgirl

3. 
   infeedout | Apr 05, 2003 09:08am | #3

   Sharp, sharp tools! Work with grain.

   Happy honing- k

4. 
   Alan | Apr 05, 2003 07:58pm | #6

   Petemoss,

   Like ForestGirl I'm a little mystified by your problems with some operations.  For example, I can't see how you could get "tear out" when you're chopping mortises or sanding.

   It would help me understand a little better if you could be more specific:  What tools are you using when you have the problems?  And exactly where and when are you getting tear out during what procedures?  It would be most helpful, perhaps, if you can post a picture.

   Alan

1. 
   PeteMoss | Apr 06, 2003 01:18am | #8

   Well, pretty much the problem with mortising is not so much a problem with actually driving the chisle into the wood, that is not when it happens, but if you think of how the square hole will look once you are starting to make some progress, there will be two sides to it that are endgrain. I on several occations will brush the edge of that endgrain area and it will break out a small piece right at the edge. I have had the same thing happen when sanding either over a mortise or at the edge of the board. It happens when sanding into the wood as opposed to the paper moving off the wood into space. I could probably clean up my technique and sand in only one direction (off the wood), but it would be very difficult to do so over the top of a mortise. I can, without too much trouble, on this walnut, tearout the endgrain with my finger (using the flesh part, not fingernail). Do you think that maybe the wood is not a good piece and overly soft, brittle, rotted, or something?

1. 
   Alan | Apr 06, 2003 03:34am | #9

   Petemoss,

   Wow.  That sounds like awfully delicate wood.  Do you mean that you can tear out a splinter from the end grain?  That's not really unusual.  You have to take care around end grain; that's where it's easiest to tear out a splinter.

   As to the mortising, you might try using a SHARP knife (your lay out knife or a utility knife) to deepen your lay out lines all around the mortise.  Then use a SHARP bench chisel to remove a sliver from inside the lines (where the mortise is to be).  It doesn't need to be deep; an eighth of an inch is plenty.  When you begin to chop the mortise begin a quarter of an inch from the end; chop to a quarter of an inch from the opposite end; then turn the chisel around and chop back.  Chop the entire mortise this way, always staying a quarter inch from the end lines.  When you have the mortise chopped to its full depth, use a bench chisel or a paring chisel to pare back to the end lines.  Making the little trench before you begin to chop can prevent splinters from starting at the ends (and it gives you an easy way to properly register the chisel).  I don't know what else to suggest.

   Some woods, like fir, are very splintery.  On the ends of such woods cutting a bevel around the end-grain edge can help prevent tearing out splinters.  When sanding such woods, especially on the edges, the paper can catch the grain and tear out a splinter.  It helps to sand as though you are planing:  sand "up-hill" into the rising grain, and don't go back and forth.  Again, I don't know what else to suggest.

   Let us know if you keep having problems.  There are answers (but I probably don't know what they are).

   Alan

5. 
   prman | Apr 05, 2003 09:32pm | #7

   If you are getting "tearout" while mortising, I assume you are using a chisel. Always score the outside of your mortise with a sharp knife first. Do the same thing for your tennon cuts as well. The only thing I can come up with regarding tearout while sanding, is you are using to coarse of grit paper and are not going with the grain of the wood. Hope this helps.