The best Dust Collection system for small home shop
fmg
| Posted in General Discussion on
Hello all! This has probably been asked before many times, but I’m looking to upgrade Jet Votrtex DC to something a bit more stronger and cleaner for the shop. Just asking what’s everyone out there using these days? Oneida? Jet? Laguna? Etc ? Shop is only 450sqft nd do t use multiple machines together. Thanks in advance!
Best Regards
Fredd
Replies
Just went through this myself. After much research, I decided to go with Oneida. I believe their tag line in that all they do is dust collection. Based on current tools I purchased and potential upgrades and specs company list for dust collection, I went with their 3 HP system. The Super Cell was almost a match for me. The two 4" dust ports on the bandsaw made that not quite meet specifications. It wasn't cheap and took me three years to save for that, plus upgrades to electrical. If I had wall space, I might have gone with ClearVue though they do have a free standing option but it didn't quite work out for my needs. I really only have two tools I needed to hook up to a dust collector, my bandsaw and a thicknesser. As such, I'm not running any metal ducting in the garage. I got magnaport quick connects and then used either 6" or 4" hosing as needed. Just got it set up so too soon to provided any feedback. As best I can tell, I will be happy. This comming weekend, I should be able to use the bandsaw as setting it up. I will measure before during and after particulates with my Dylos to see how well it actually works.
I hope you didn't buy the Oneida model we had that burned the shop down, it was black PLASTIC with a cardboard barrel, the motor/upper part is what started the fire
Mine was the all metal system. Saw your info below. Yikes. Glad mine is all metal.
I have a Laguna PFlux 1. It's 110V, but high amperage (you need a special outlet). It's got a massive HEPA filter. It's large but very effective. Might be overkill for what you do; I have three machines on each of the two 4" ports. If you go with multiple hoses into one port, I heartily recommend NOT using blast gates but using one of those multiport gadgets where you slide the dust collector hose between the machine hoses. Rockler sells one and I think Katz-Moses has a video on how to make your own. The advantage is that you're always using a one-to-one connection between vac and machine, so far less leakage and MUCH more effective chip and dust collection.
Small basement shop here with a Grizzily 1hp sitting atop an Oneida Super Dust Deputy on a separate circuit and fixed mounted in the corner. Using a clear 4" hose with quick connects (Rockler brand) to the planer, jointer, and router table enclosure. Also have a Fien on casters for the bandsaw, sanders, and tablesaw (not optimal, but it works). Both are on remotes with small magnetic bases that I can move around with me. Wish I could run the 4" hose to the tablesaw, but my shop is too confined to make it work.
I have a garage shop and went with the Laguna CFlux 3. What did it for me was the unique design of the chip bucket that makes it a snap to disconnect and empty - just lift a handle. I also did a lot of looking at published performance curves, based on another post here on FWW. 3Hp was overkill but the price difference with the 2Hp was small. If I had to do it over again I would have gone with the PFlux due to the lower noise level.
I will agree that Laguna does have a nice chip/dust bucket set up. Probably the nicest out of the ones I've seen.
I have a Holytek 3000CK - probably best avoided. It's a powerful machine, well specced fof the cost, and comes with a remote, which is lovely, but needs a bit of adaption to work well as the dust bin does not seal. It's also not especially thick steel so requires some care at bag change time.
There are certainly more choices for HEPA cyclone collectors now than there were when I bought my last collector. However, I have always stuck with Oneida. My first cyclone was an Oneida which had an internal cylindrical filter in the cyclonic cone. It wasn't HEPA, but then HEPA wasn't a big thing in the mid-1990's. When I upgraded about 10 years ago, I again bought an Oneida; this time a HEPA V1500. It fit my needs with air flow of 900+ CFM and 120V power connection. Oneida now has many options, still including the V series. I would contact Oneida to see, given your equipment and shop area, what would work best for your shop. Unfortunately, Oneida collectors are expensive, but I have never been sorry I stuck with them. The size I have may not be suited to your needs, but they have many choices and their HEPA filters simply can't be beat.
400 SQ FT garage shop. Grizzly 3hp 2300 CFM 7" main line an 3 branches. My old system was a 650 cfm single bag with a garbage can separator all hidden under an outfeed/assembly table. That goes to 5 different machines. Worked ok for 1 machine at a time. Now one 5" branch takes the place of that single bagger. The other branches hit machinery that never had collection to them before. This is all on the cheap. The Grizzly machine was just over $500. 30 gallon metal trash cans for the separator. The "downdraft" cabinet for my router table is a rubber kitchen trash can with a 4" drain fitting. Shedule 40 PVC is overkill, hit the garden center for outdoor drain pvc.
No need to overspend on dust collection. Having only 650 CFM to work with in the beginning showed me alot. A good amount of efficiency comes from sealing your machines. Little gaps rob cfm. Plumbers putty works great and it removes easily.
I would agree with chiwoodworker that you should spend as little as possible while still getting an effective system. However, the one thing I would require in any system I buy would be a HEPA filter. There is no point in sucking fine dust out of the air and putting it back in because the filter doesn't filter out fine enough dust. I have been successful in keeping my shop clean because a HEPA filter keeps the very finest dust from returning into the air. The finest dust is the stuff that is the most harmful, especially if your shop is in your basement. You don't want that dust accumulating on benches, floors, and tools, only to be circulated again later, maybe inhaled, and maybe even migrated to the rest of your house. Look around at all the possibilities. Laguna has some nice HEPA filter collectors on wheels; even Rockler's with a HEPA filter isn't bad. If you want a movable collector which you move from tool to tool, then smaller machines are great. If you want a more permanent installation with some ducting, then an upgraded collector may be a better choice. I only have 1 main duct with 4" drops controlled by blast gates. Since I use only 1 machine at a time, this works and I don't have to move the whole collector from one spot to another.
Since so much of that fine dust is produced by sanding and not my machines namely my beloved PC speedbloc 330. I knew a hepa wouldn't be an overall solution. Downdraft table, sealed sound closet for the collector that can vent outside. upgraded bags, air filter on a timer. We do what we can.
Since we weren't given a budget I'll say +1 regarding 3 hp, hepa filter and don't be shy on the size of the pipes - go big until you get to your machine. I have the Oneida 3 hp with hepa and have never regretted it.
It's not the size of your shop so much as how much CFM you need/want at each machine. No matter how many mods I made to my Harbor Freight DC it wasn't going to do the job so I went up to 3 hp. And my shop is a bit smaller than yours; 400 sq ft total and the machines hooked up to my DC are in 168 sq ft.
Oneida sells a stand that will let you roll a 55 gallon drum under it instead of a 35 drum. It's much easier on your back to empty the 55 drum than the 35. Remember, you can empty it long before it gets full.
Agree with many comments made that you should be aware that each machine is pulling the appropriate amount of cfm’s for each. I was using a Jet 1 1/2 hp single stage with canister and it just wasn’t collecting enough from my table saw and 8” jointer. I have done a lot of research to see what would work best for my shop and have decided to order an Oneida 3 hp V3000 with Smart Boost. I will run 6” duct as close to each machine as I can before transitioning to 4”. Keep in mind that the smaller 2 1/2” ports won’t collect as efficient as the 4” for a traditional dust collector due to the volume of air. If you have a lot of smaller ports and nothing over 4”, the Oneida Supercell May be a great option for you due to the system design. Plus, with that system you don’t have to worry about ducting layout. Also keep in mind the electrical requirement for your new machine. Many 2-stage units with 2 or more hp will require 220v.
My shop is in a rural area with no neighbors and a temperate climate -- consequently, I can get away with a cyclone separator and direct exhaust to the outdoors. Even more effective than a HEPA filter.
All good looking info here. The same fundamentals apply. You need to move enough volume of air at enough velocity to keep the spoil in motion. The spoil has to have somewhere to go. The return air has to have somewhere to go or somewhere to come from.
If you exhaust your system back into your workspace you need to filter the air . . . very well. To filter the air without clogging the filter you need to separate . . . very well.
If you can exhaust outside and allow return air from the great outdoors you have the least challenges. You simply separate the spoil; longer cones work better than short cones in general. You exhaust the fines out the side wall and allow return air from somewhere well distant from the exhaust location.
If you have to return your exhaust to your work space you must separate the spoil . . . very well. Filter the fines . . . very well. And finally return the scrubbed air to your breathing space.
We all have different challenges and we should all do the very best we can. Our success is driven by budget, space, layout, etc. If you follow the basic rule of doing the very best you can given your budget, space, layout, etc. you should do well.
The final solution for fine dust producted by sanding is a sander that has great dust collection connected to a quality HEPA filter vac. Starting with Festool sanders and vacs, they have the best dust collection (I think). However, they are also very expensive; both the sanders and vacs. There are other sanders and vacs out there which are good also (as good as Festool, I don't know). In the past I've made a choice that dust collection and protection of my lungs was the highest priority. Because of that, I spent money that I would have otherwise bought tools with at the time to get the best dust collection. I was never sorry. Even with a HEPA cyclone collector connected to my stationary power tools and HEPA air cleaner to clean the dust that escapes the dust collector out of the air, I still wear a powered HEPA mask. It may seem redundant but I only have one pair of lungs.
Dust created by sanding is the finest and the most important to protect your lungs from.
I like the idea of the Supercell, but it seems people say its really noisy.
They are loud. They are moving a lot of air! I bought their smallest model for my 1 side of the garage shop and have been really impressed. As for the noise, if you are woodworking without hearing protection, it won’t be long before the noise won’t bother you at all.
Three years ago we HAD an Oneida, the black pastic model on a stand with the cardboard barrel for the CNC in our Morton building, the piece of junk caught fire and I was injured with 2nd degree burns on my arms needing skin grafts on one trying to put the fire out, it spread to the chipboard wall so fast I didn't have a chance of grabbing another extinguisher before the flames were banking across the ceiling. The fire spread from the Morton building to all the connected buildings, all four buildings burned to the ground with all contents, lumber, a 1/4 finished project, archives, computers, tools, machines.
The fire investigators were not able to pinpoint exactly what started the fire, other than we know 100% it involved the motor on top of the 3 year old dust collector and when I discovered the fire it was only about like a small fireplace fire- the motor and the top cyclone were on fire, the cheap plastic caught on fire, melted and the motor fell on the floor.
The attached photo (not the one thatwe actually had) is what it looked like.
The fact it had a UL certification was simply stunning to me, REALLY?? flammable plastic and CARDBOARD on a dust collector was approved by UL???
I noticed after the fire I could not find this model on their web site any more, hmmm.
My advice is do not get any dust collection that isn't ALL STEEL, no plastic, no cardboard barrels!
Do NOT install it inside any building, that was mistake #2, # 1 was buying that Oneida collector in the first place.
The collector SHOULD have been outside even if it takes constructing a shed/roof over it or getting a model made for weather outside.
The fire spread so FAST, and despite being the guy who does the OSHA stuff and safety at work, and maintaining the fire extinguishers, OSHA required training etc it all flies out the window in a REAL fire situation.
Awful!
Yikes. Sorry to hear what happened. I had a friend who was out of town and had a fire occur in his home and it was burnt down to the ground. When re rebuilt, there were no fireplaces in the home. Other fire mitigation things done as well. I don't blame you for wanting all metal.
Part of what attracted to me to my current home, beyond the 3 car garage, was it had fire sprinklers in both the home and garage. I do worry about fire as well.
Thank you Joe,
It's been a tough 3 years during rebuilding having to work out of four different rental spaces and the company has it's offices in a nearby residence.
To-day I went with a co-worker to the new building to start sanding the plywood walls in the shop to apply a clear coat on it when done.
Hopefully we get in sooner than the original August date by doing this.
I have 3 of the 20 pound commercial fire extinguishers in my house now after that fire (one pictured below). I saw first-hand how totally INEFFECTIVE an extinguisher of any smaller size like the 10# one I started with during the fire- really is, on a fire any larger than a wastepaper basket.
That extinguisher went empty in seconds, it wasnt nearly enough.
I think I will upgrade my extinguishers as well. Thanks for the suggestion. Glad you are getting closer to being back in the new shop.
OP 3/25 and he has never responded to anything.
Maybe he read it, maybe he didn't.
Irritating.................
Thank you for all of the input! My apologies that I have been out of touch with this post for a while .. there are more things in life that have taken priority than sitting down at a computer screen. And if this irritates anyone well I feel sorry for you. Thanks to all of the people who replied. Many things to keep into perspective.
Don't worry about negative comments from other posters. Responses aren't required for responses to your original post, and especially to all who posted. After all, all you did was ask for information and feedback. Your response thanking everyone is sufficient.
Why wouldn’t (2) two stage collectors be more cost effective than buying a big stationary collector with duct work, etc.? If u only had 4 machines needing collection.
I have a Jet cyclone collector that's probably too big for your size shop, but the 2024 Tool Guide from FWW and FHB has a review of wall-mount dust collectors. You might check that out.
Do you know why a cyclone is not needed on a wall mounted unit? I mean, a cyclone with portability on a 2 stage is worth an extra $1,000???
I have a Laguna PFlux 1. It works on 110 volts and provides adequate suction for a single big tool. I work in a 20x20 garage and have Rockler's expanding hose, with special adapters on all major tools. Since I only use one at a time, it's not much of a hassle to move the hose around except when you are going back and forth between two machines for an extended time. And it avoids having DC hoses or pipes on the floor or up above, which are unsightly and need blast gates to operate. It doesn't take much time in my system compared to changing blast gates. So I'm happy and the DC has the easiest means of securing and emptying the barrel that I've seen, as another poster has noted. The only problem is that you need to clean the filter every few months. I would next time by a model that is self-cleaning.
Simple solution, 4" waste water pvc with 45 degree connections. Sealed blast gates (no plastic ones)(helps cut down noise). 4" type cyclone in between collection points & 1200 cfm collector. You'll have plenty of velocity with this configuration and it's affordable. Ceiling mounted 1000 cfm air scrubber and you should have a very dust free and clean shop.
Mount the air scrubber near end of shop centered between walls no higher than 8' above floor pushing air across entire shop and all of the offenders. The air will be returned across the bottom of the shop and up into the air scrubber. I tried many methods (including factory recommended) for mounting the air scrubber and this method seems to be most successful. Kind-of counter intuitive but it works great. After 5 plus years of operation the dust collector has about a cup of dust in it. Minor leaky connections in the drop ducting help prevent turbulence where it connects to the main run. This keeps chips & "stuff" from falling down into drops as the material passes by. Good luck. Getting started is the hard part. Completing it is the best part. It's not as complicated as you might think. You're always going to have some dust and chips / shavings to contend with. It's part of the process we all face. As you can see, the system captures a lot of dust including the shavings from the machines. The cyclone is the reason.