The Lie Nielsen Face Joinery Float – Reviewed
Very recently Lie Nielsen released a set of joinery floats that were fashioned after the planemaker’s floats they were producing in association with Clark & Williams. These floats are intended to aid in the fine-tuning of joints used in cabinetmaking. There are three floats in all, two for mortices and one for tenons. The float under review is the Face Float for tuning tenons.
Construction and Dimensions
The face float is available in a push or pull version. I purchased the push version because I found this to be the more natural action.
According to the LN website, these are made from S-7 tool steel, hardened and tempered to RC 50-52 for edge life and resharpening ability. 8tpi, 80° rake angle, maple handles. It is 1” wide and 3 3/8” long.
Preparation
While the floats come sharpened and may be used straight out of the box, it is recommended that the teeth be first filed. I will reinforce this recommendation as I did initially use the float without filing the teeth, and was disappointed in the performance.
To illustrate the difference, I did a test with half the teeth filed and the other half original. Here is the result:
Top unfiled, bottom filed.
Filing the teeth
LN suggests a 6 inch double extra slim taper file for sharpening. I did not have one to hand, so first tried with a 4 inch double slim taper Groblet, a file I use for sharpening a 15 tpi dovetail saw. This proved to work exceedingly slowly, and so I turned to a 6” extra slim Nicholson file. This ended up being a good choice.
Finally I found a use for my Zyliss vise! It made a good support for filing the float.
From the LN website ….
Initial sharpening: The black oxide coating of the floats is an aid in the initial sharpening. Simply file away the black coating to shiny metal for the first sharpening. Use care to apply a slight even pressure on the file to maintain the cutting geometry. On wider sections you may notice some very slight distortion showing as slightly low spots on the faces of the teeth. This is normal and is the result of volumetric changes and stresses of heat treating. It’s not necessary to remove the hollow, establishing a good cutting edge on the teeth is the goal.
The full instructions may be found on the LN website.
Below I am supporting the file flat on the face and against the gullet.
Here is the half-original, half-sharpened result. Note the hollows in some of the faces.
The LN face float is well made. Perhaps the only criticism is the need to sharpen it before it can be used. On the other hand, this will need to be done at some time anyway – not as often as a plane blade, but more much frequently than a handsaw. The initial filing was a relatively straight forward affair, and time will tell whether this is a task that remains so.
Cutting and Tuning Tenons
I generally cut tenons with either a backsaw or a bandsaw. For this assessment, I prepared a few in both Jarrah (representing hardwood) and construction Pine (representing softwood).
The plan is to compare tuning tenon faces using the joinery float, a rasp and a block plane.
The Joinery Float
The float is capable of removing a lot of waste very rapidly when used on hardwood. Before I sharpened the teeth, it had a feel more of a file, producing more dust than shavings. Once sharpened, the teeth could be felt biting into the wood.
I liked the control that the float gave. It was stable in use and left a flat, smooth finish to the tenon face.
Using the float on Pine was a less satisfactory story. Cutting across the grain now produced fine shavings and sawdust.
The Rasp
I used an Auriou AU-8-250-6, which is close in grain size to a Nicholson #49. In other words, it is quite a coarse rasp.
The Auriou cut fast, leaving a marked but acceptable smooth face.
I like the rasp for use here, but I warn that use of one must be done with care. Its length makes it easy to tilt, and then it will create an off square face.
The performance of the rasp on soft Pine was very similar to that on hardwood.
The Block Plane
The handplane of choice for tuning tenon faces is the Stanley or LN #140, a skew block plane.
Here is my Stanley #140.
The #140 works equally well on hard- and softwood. It can remove a larger amount of waste quickly, which is, I believe, its advantage over the other tools here. It also produces the smoothest surface finish. However, like the rasp, care must be taken to keep the plane square.
Conclusions
When cutting tenons, I try to cut as close to the line as possible. Consequently, any tuning that needs to be done is usually a whisker here-or-there. A skew block plane gets the job done, but is sometimes like using a hammer to swat a fly. This is where the face float comes into its own. I liked the control it presented when removing waste. It could remove a little or a lot. The rasp is a possible alternative to the float, but it must be used with care. The bottom line is that a face float is a desirable tool for tuning tenons.
Derek Cohen
Perth, Australia
August 2007
Replies
As always a great review Derek.
Now tell us how well it works for jobs it wasn't designed for. Like general rasping and shaping, or paring down plugs.
You know we all do it.;)
This float (and its two siblings), as mentioned in the review, are designed specifically for joinery. In this specific case, for use on a tenon face, which means for planing across the grain. I did not attempt to use them any other way. I suspect that trying to "rasp" down a (the end grain of a) dowel would end in failure.No doubt, floats have been used for years in this situation by a few - and the thought did occur to me a short while after Clark & Williams began making production floats - but this is the first time (I am aware of) that floats have been sold for this specific task. So it is not surprising that few of us have any experience in this area. My logic says that this float is designed to short flat surfaces only, and that it would not do as good a job on tasks of general shaping, tasks that are better suited to a rasp. That is what a rasp is designed for. This is what the face float is designed for.This float serves as just one of several techniques one may employ to do the task of tuning a tenon face. I was curious to find out how it compared. My instinct said that it was a good idea. But there are many ways to skin a cat and pockets are not bottomless. One has to decide how important it is to get a dedicated tool like this. At this time I do not see many other areas for using it. Regards from Perth Derek
While I am unaware of previous commercial production of plane makers' floats, floats for other purposes were standard commercial fare. They're often listed in old file catalogs. Many of the floats that show up in antique tool auctions are actually for joinery, molding or making of gun stocks.
Here are a couple early references to floats used in joinery:
From The Builder's Complete Guide ... , by C. F.
Partington, c. 1825:
"...It is of the utmost importance in framing that
the tenons and mortises should be truly made. After
a mortise has been made with the mortise chisel, it
should be rendered perfectly even with a float; an
instrument which differs from a single, or float
file, only by having larger teeth. ... " (p. 524)
From: Peter Nicholson, Practical Carpentry, Joinery and
Cabinet-making, c. 1826. Book III, Cabinet-making, p. 18.
"... In framing chair-work, and the like, the tenons
should always be in the direction of the grain of the wood,
and the mortises made obliquely to receive them. This is
easily done by supporting the piece to be mortised in a proper
saddle, so that the chisel may enter in a vertical
direction.
"Great care must be taken in mortising, that the
mortise may not be wider at the bottom than at the
entrance; and that the tenon not be smaller at the point
than at the shoulder, as its firmness in the mortise
depends on attention to these circumstances: we have
found it an advantage where much fitting was required to
ease the entrance of the mortise slightly with a float
previous to fitting together..."
Hi Larry,
Do you know if Nicholson's book(s) is available as a reprint? Sure would like to get one.
Ray
Google books has the full view scans, as well as a downloadable PDF.
http://books.google.com/books?id=iigBAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA1&dq=intitle:Practical+intitle:Carpentry+inauthor:Nicholson&as_brr=1
If you want a hard copy, try bookfinder.com
Take care, Mike
Mike,
Thanks, I'll look into that.
Ray
Yep, we all do it (;).
"Now tell us how well it works for jobs it wasn't designed for".
Well, I can't do that because I have never used or seen one of those , but I can tell you that a Panel Beaters Body File works like ten men on many different materials, but especially wood. Flexible bottom too- settable either concave or convex.....no woodworm should be without one.
I reckon I have just named one of the very few tools that Derek does not have in his shop-or does he?Philip Marcou
I reckon I have just named one of the very few tools that Derek does not have in his shop-or does he?
Yeah, right! Philip, have you forgotten that I have been restoring a Porsche 356 for several years - did all the panel beating myself. I have one of those files - it bends by twisting two threads in opposition to one another. I also have another like this that uses sandpaper.... both somewhere in the garage/shed.
Regards from Perth
Derek
I had forgotten that item, being far more likely to remember an E type (proper motor veehicle with engine in correct place).
So would you rather rasp/file tenons to suit or would you be more likely to shave with a plane or chisel?, now that you have this file?Philip Marcou
So would you rather rasp/file tenons to suit or would you be more likely to shave with a plane or chisel?, now that you have this file?
Philip, it is easier (more politically correct?) to say that there is a place for all. The truth is, I would do what ever seemed appropriate at the time. I'd rather use a float or a rasp to remove a little waste - a whisker - just fine tuning. If it was wedge shaped, I'd grab a paring chisel. And if it was a 1/16" or greater I would use a plane. I cut to the line and sometimes it fits first time. Mostly I only need to remove a whisker. That's when I think the float would be great.
Regards from Perth
Derek
Derek,
I once floated a tenner on a cuddy but it lost and the tenner floated off down the drain. This was my first and last gamble (apart from taking the risk of buying from Philip on the basis of your test; but that one paid-off big).
Lataxe, who has faith in psycho-men.
PS Rasp or float? I cannot have both as the shed is full to bustin'. I have seen short, flat Aurirou rasps like that float..........? (Meanwhile I plane and file the buggers albeit the file is a cheapie).
Up North of you we call them a Vixen File, milled, curved tooth, 14 inch, flexible, 7 teeth per inch.
there are variations in tooth count.Ron
Looks like he does!! :)I don't have one of those but I do have a 10" file with straight float like teeth, something like the ones Lee Valley started to sell a little while ago. It's not too shabby on wood and it's great on Aluminium ((Aluminum for Americans) I spell in both languages) because the teeth are easier to keep clean.http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=3&p=56529&cat=51&ap=3
Phillip,
I had been toying with the idea of cutting one of those up into a couple of floats that would fit into a plane body - cheaper than buying the propper floats.
What do you think. (no idea how to cut them mind you)
dave
Dave,
Dunno- try it. Not my cup of tea.Lots of bother methinks.
Easy enough to cut though:angle grind a vee line with one of those thin cut-off wheels and snap it off.
Philip the Lukewarm.Philip Marcou
I have made two planes using a chisel followed by a piece of steel set up as a machinists scraper to flatten the bed. not fast or entirely satisfactory. I have an artistic aspiration for a set of hollows and rounds, but starting with a rule-joint pair. Before that a panel raiser with a squiggle because it has more room to get at the bed.
The real constraint is getting around to it - not having a float is just an excuse.
Dave - still usually cold.
Thanks! I saw these floats on their website and was wondering how they differed from a good file, now I know.
Derek,
A very well presented and reasoned article. I learned something - including about the existence of "floats." I never had hear of them before. This would seem to be the kind of tool that people who do a lot of M&T work - especially hand work - would benefit from owning. I'm not in that category, but found your piece interesting nonetheless.
And, it should be said, superior photography and lighting to much of what one observes online..
Again, thank you for posting this piece. Zolton Cohen - Hey, are we related?
* Some people say I have a problem because I drink hydraulic brake fluid. But I can stop any time I want.
Zolton Cohen - Hey, are we related?
If you are in your dodderage, very wealthy, and have no other living relatives, then we most certainly are related! Hi unc!
Thanks for the kind words.
Your nephew in Perth
Derek
Derek,
Nix on the very wealthy part. Far from it in fact. I had hoped that you could lend ME a fiver...
Dodderage? Well, rapidly approaching.
Living relatives? I don't know that I'd call it living..
Good to hear from you though. Zolton* Some people say I have a problem because I drink hydraulic brake fluid. But I can stop any time I want.
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