I’ve seen a couple threads with specific questions about working with mahogany. They have helped me a little. But I’d like to ask you all for any general tips about working with mahogany. I’ve had very little experiance in working with this wood, and have just been asked to make a desk and a couple small floor cabinets from mahogany. Seems like a nice job for me at this time. But with the price of mahogany I can’t afford alot of screwups. Any thoughts you might be willing to share about glue, sanding, finishes, anything at all that you think might be of help would be great.
Thanks for your time..
GRW
Replies
GRW
You shoudl get some more interesting posts. One of the reasons mahogany was/is so popular is that it is one of the most workable woods. It is realtively easy to cut, sand, route, etc. More advise depends on what you want to build with it. Since it is fairly open pore, you need to know what kind of surface you wnat to disucss finishing
Yes, there are lots of ways to use mahogany. Please give us a bit more about what you intend to do with it. Other wise you will just get generalities.
It dyes and stains well, no "blotch" problem. It does have open pores, but they are moderate in size and can be filled fairly easily. It can be finished anywhere from blonde modern to classic antique.
One problem in working mahogany is that some of it, even from honduras. has rowed grain which can make planing and carving a challenge.
"...[it] has rowed grain which can make planing and carving a challenge." Steve, that's a new term for moi. Could you explain please? Thanks! forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Don't quite know where it came from, but it merely means that the grain tends to reverse in a kind of row by row fashion. The grain reversals can mean one one inch strip likes to be planed east to west, and the next inch over prefers west to east. Best solution is a Clark and Williams smoother. Otherwise scraping and --heaven forfend--sanding. Same as the grain reversals mentioned more clearly above by Rob Millard.
Edited 11/10/2005 9:24 pm ET by SteveSchoene
Thanks, Steve, it's always helpful to know the different terms things are know by. Sounds like a bit of a nightmare, for sure.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Nice table, Steve. Forgive my incredible ignorance - but what is a Clark and Williams plane?
Stay in touch,
Ozzy
"What is a Clark and Williams plane?"
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"Don't ask yourself what the world needs. Ask yourself what makes you come alive, and go do that, because what the world needs is people who have come alive." Gil Bailie
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The coffin smoothing plane they make has a VERY tight mouth unless you order it with a wider mouth. By tight I mean I doubt a dollar bill slips through. That, plus a high quality hefty blade means that the plane can be worked in almost any direction without tearout. The mouth is so tight on mine that you can only take gossamer shavings without clogging. It also helps that it is a York pitch (steeper than normal) iron. It has a wonderful feel in my hands.
They aren't cheap but worth it. Mine cost substantially more than the usual price, because it was given to me by my wife as an anniversary gift. I unfortunately had forgotten the date, so the pearl necklace that followed was a bit more than I would have usually spent.
Ouch... expensive, but memorial. At least she didn't heave it at you- breaking your head, the plane (and your heart).Glaucon
If you don't think too good, then don't think too much...
dollar bill slips through IT! DAMN thin these days! USA here!
To add to Steves' answer another term for it (and more common in my experience) is interlocked grain where the orientation of the growth rings spiral around the tree but, importantly, the spiralling goes one way one year and then another the following year.
Radially cut planks and veneers exhibit the figure and it's often described as ribbon or striped. A variation is roe figure where the stripeiness dips in and out of the surface because the growth rings not only spiral but have a wave form to them too. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
"...the spiralling goes one way one year and then another the following year." Ah, jeez, the trees conspire against us! "Radially cut planks and veneers exhibit the figure and it's often described as ribbon or striped." That type of mahogany has been my favorite since first laying eyes on it! Had no idea the characteristic of the wood though, thanks for the info.
"A variation is roe figure where the stripeiness dips in and out of the surface because the growth rings not only spiral but have a wave form to them too." Wow, and how difficult is that to work? You guys are amazing! Are these figured versions just as prevalent in the mahogany that's still left these days, as it was 65 or 70 years ago? Or is it getting tougher to find such figure?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
"and how difficult is that to work?"
Not too bad fg if polish prepping is done mostly with a scraping type action or with abrasives rather than standard planes. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
GRW,
Mahoghany is wonderful stuff. It does oxidize and darken with age. Some stain is required. If you overstain it (as is quite popular) it will be a muddy brown down the road. I tend to stain it lightly with a reddish based stain.
It also should be filled with either filler or finish.
Good luck
Frank
fg, to further illustrate what I described earlier I remembered I had a wee sketch of the cause of interlocked grain saved online, so here it is.
It's pretty self explanatory I suppose but it's a bit like those schematics of electrical wiring with the layers of sheathing stripped back. Slainte.
Richard Jones Furniture
Edited 11/23/2005 3:26 am by SgianDubh
UhOh, it's not showing at the moment, I'll check again tomorrow.
Another question though! Three of us entertained a woodworker from England a couple weekends ago, and took him to the woodworking gallery in Seattle. There was a large dining table there, the top being "fishnet mahogany." I'd never seen it before -- any info you can give us on that?forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Well, that seems to be a recurring problem fg. I can't get the images from an image hosting site I use to load onto this forum. I've no idea why, but there you go. It should be attached here as a click on which I've uploaded from my hard drive. Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
Hi, Richard, thanks for the extra effort, the drawing is very helpful. (But depressing -- looks like my birthday cake -- all those numerous candle holes, LOL!).
Did you see my question about "fishnet mahogany" in the last post?
forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Edited 11/26/2005 12:18 pm by forestgirl
Sorry fg. I've never heard the term 'fishnet mahogany' so I can't help. We are quite inventive at coming up with names for all sorts of things, including unusual grain figure and pattern.
Some of those names are not at all universally well known and are descriptions used by a fairly small number. For instance, did you know that a 'wheelie' is an old fashioned hand drill, a 'tonk' is a metal adjustable shelf support strip, a 'slit feather' is a loose tongue, and have you come a cross 'plum pudding' grain in veneers? Slainte.Richard Jones Furniture
If I get over to the gallery before that table sells, I'll ask them if I can take a close-up of the grain.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl ;-)Another proud member of the "I Rocked With ToolDoc Club" .... :>)
Hi GRW,
I just built my first project out of it. See the attached picture.
As a guy that uses mostly White Oak, I found it surprisingly soft and, when finishing, very porous and absorptive.
I was working with Kiln-dried Honduran Mahogany and found that it split and dented much easier than White Oak. The boards also varied in color, texture and pattern much more so than White Oak.
When finishing, I found tinted BLO topped with shellac and lacquer to be successful..but this client happened to want his table much darker than I'd have done for myself. Since then I've tried to finish with a lighter end result and haven't "hit" upon the right finishing schedule.
The above said, it seems to plane very easily and contrasts nicely with ebony. I also like the size of the pores..somehow nicer than the Oak I'm used to.
Keep us posted and show pictures if you take them along the way. I'm interested in learning more about this.
lp
I build period reproductions, and I have used mahogany almost exclusively. It is an excellent wood, being beautiful, stable available in large sizes and fairly easy to work. Mahogany has a wide range of grain patterns. It also has a wide range in density, and I've found the heavier wood is actually easier to work. Some of the lighter weight woods have a stringy texture that makes scraping and planing difficult. Sometimes even the heavier wood is somewhat difficult to hand plane due to reversing grain. It sands well, but I sand very little when working with solid wood. Gluing is never a problem, but as with any open pore wood glue can get in the pores and show up during the finishing process. Finishing can be easy or more involved depending on your desired look. Oiled and shellacked mahogany will age naturally, if not slowly to a very nice color. Because of this natural darkening, a dark finish is probably not a good idea, because in time it will become too dark. While stains work well, I avoid stains and use dyes, for their clarity. For the reproductions I make, my finishing schedule is, sand to 320, raise the grain and resand. Use a aniline yellow dye, followed by a mixture of lime and water to color the wood. This lime mixture creates an aged color, that is very stable over time. The resulting color can be tweaked with Trans Tint dyes mixed in oil. I then oil the piece to bring out the grain. Follow this with oil based grain filler, and top coat with shellac, padding lacquer or varnish. Mahogany was my favorite wood, until a built a couple of pieces in curly maple, and now I'm not so sure. I have attached a photo of a piece finished as described above.
Rob Millard
Rob Millard
Beuitful job ! Kudo's
The piece in the photo is absolutely exquisite. I have a question concerning your reference to using lime. I have never heard of that. Could you please explain how you used it?
THANKS
I use the hydrated lime sold in garden supply centers, mixed with distilled water. This will color mahogany, cherry, white oak , and to a certain degree walnut and birch. All finishing requires experimentation, but this is even more important with the lime, as it will color mahogany with a range from almost no change to nearly black, depending on the ratio of lime to water. The big advantage of the lime is it will color the mahogany, but not the inlays, and the color is very stable over time. The disadvantage is the color is not completely predictable, and it always turns out quite red. You can alter the color with a little dye tinted oil ( or a green aniline dye to kill the red). The lime will leave the piece looking an awful dusty orange until oil is applied, but once the oil hits it, the color and depth are outstanding. Attached is a photo showing me applying oil to a lime treated piece. Thank you for the comments on the sideboard.
Rob Millard
Hi everyone, first time posting over here.I've got another question for Rob about the lime. Do you know if that's the same stuff as Type S masonry lime? I've wanted to try that technique and had read about using Drano, but always ended up cursing those little blue crystals they put in it! Got lots of Type S around though.I also want to compliment Rob on that sideboard, you do first class work.Getting back to the original post, if it were me I'd be careful to fill the pores for the top at least, especially if you're using poly. The surface tension of wet poly will cause a dimple around each little pore, and filling them first will save a lot of sanding and rubbing. Maybe it won't be so bad when spraying, depending on how much you thin the finish, I haven't much experience with spraying finishes.Good luck with the desk, post some pictures if you can.John
I have not used masonry lime. What I have used is hydrated lime sold for gardening. In the past I have used lye ( Red Devil) to color inlaid pieces, but it raised the grain far more than the lime, and it was somewhat dangerous to work with.
Thank for the comment on the sideboard.
Rob Millard
Thanks to all who have given feedback so far..
There's a few details on my mahogany desk... It's a tall desk at 33". The legs are tapered(shaker style) with mortise and tennon jointery to a 5" skirt under the desk top. The secondary wood(drawer boxes) is maple. The desk will have 3 drawers across. The design is quite simple..No inlay, turnings, or carvings. The desk is desined to match a set of display cabinets in a Optomatrist office.. The customer wants a water resistant finish, so I'm planning on spraying polyuethane.
Will yellow wood glue leave glue lines on mahogany? And is there anything special I should know about suface prep for polyuethane on mahogany?..( the desk top will be hand rubbed after finishing)
Thanks again,
GRW
You forgot to say whether or not it is figured. Ribbon and quilted mahogany can be prone to tear-out with handplanes, even sharp ones.
Regards,
Dan
Hi, I work wood in Caracas, Venezuela, and mahogany is a domestic wood (It grows in the street). You can work it with PVA or Yellow glue, with confidence, no glue lines. You must take care of some interlocked fibers. You can see in the attachment a bowl glued 12 years ago, with other rainforest woods.
Regards,
Mahogany begs for curves.
View Image
G,
Until now there has been no mention of the fact that there are several varieties of Mahogany (Meliaceae). Sounds as though you find it expensive there-but I am sure that African Mahogany is readily available in the States and not as dear as the "real thing". Carefully selected it looks every bit as good, and is definitely not difficult or problematic to work as has been claimed on posts I have read on this forum.
Maybe you should check it out-African Mahogany-Khaya Nyasica, and Khaya Ivorensis.
In addition to what has already been said I find that it makes a very fine dust when cutting, sanding and stays floating in the air much longer than any other wood I use. when you finish your project you will have a very fine talkum like dust every where. I have an Oneida dust collector and I still get a lot of fine dust especially from the table saw. A great wood to work with. Use a darker glue so that the glue lines do not show if you are going to stain it dark.
Thanks to all for your wonderful tips, and for sharing the great pics. Very nice work.
My customer is looking for something quite simple compared to your work. Just a basic desk to match some display cabinets.
Thanks again,
GRW
I was going to post earlier but forgot to..Look into SANTOS? Mahogony.. I know nothing about it but I found is really nice to work with.. Grain patterns a 'BIT' different thoughSantos MahoganyDescription: Santos Mahogany is reddish brown changing to a deep red or somewhat purplish after milling.Mechanical Properties: Janka side hardness is 2,200 lb. with 12% moisture content. Shrinkage from green to ovendry: radial 3.8%; tangential 6.2%; volumetric 10.0%Working Properties: It is reported to be moderately difficult to work but can be finished smoothly with a high natural polish. Though nonsiliceous, there is more than the usual dulling of cutters.Durability: The heartwood is reported to be highly resistant to attack by decay fungiUses: hardwood flooring, furniture, interior trim, turnery
The preceding information comes from "Tropical Timbers of the World", United States Department of Agriculture, Forest Service, Agriculture Handbook Number 607, September 1984. Martin Chudnoff, Forest Products Technologist (retired), Forest Products Laboratory, Madison, Wis.
wow!! after seeing the pics of mahogany you ppl are excellent! I have worked with this wood once or twice but nothing like you guys have done. I can see I still have a lot of practicing to go. I am pretty new to wwking but I would love to have that glass like finish on the projects I build anything anywhere that I can print to study on how to do that???
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