Replies

1. 
   jgaiennie | Feb 05, 2003 10:21pm | #1

   What accessories have you used and what value do you place on them?

   jdg

1. 
   BossHog | Feb 05, 2003 11:11pm | #2

   I don't have many accessories yet - Just the axe jig (I do a lot of wood cutting) and the small knife jig.

   I really want to get the stone trueing tool, large knife jig, and the planer knife jig. But I only had a limited amount of money to spend, so these will have to wait.Don't sleep with a drip. Call your plumber.

1. 
   RW | Feb 06, 2003 02:19am | #3

   I just use a little of the compound at a time. The wheel gets dry after awhile, and mineral oil seems to keep it a little more supple. I've had mine for a few years now. The other jigs are good if you have continual use for them. I'm not big on the planer knife jig. It's a little awkward and for the time it takes me to hone 12" knives, I'd just as soon spend ten bucks.

   Coming over here from Breaktime make you feel like you went to your favorite bar and ordered a Pina Colada or something? ;-)" Clothes make the man. Naked people have litte or no influence in society" - Mark Twain

2. 
   Jimma | Feb 06, 2003 03:05am | #4

   Apply enough mineral oil to the leather wheel to wet it, then wipe off any surplus. You can get a small bottle of mineral oil at a drugstore. Turn on the machine and apply a smallish amount of the compound all the way around. Then I just use a finger to spread it over the surface -- you don't need to carefully coat it as that will happen when you first hone with it. Too much compound will just come off when you use it and you'll soon see what is the best amount.

   I don't leave the water tank on unless I'm going to be using it in a day or so. Notice that you can drop the tank down without taking it all the way off. However, a slurry of stone and metal particles will settle on the bottom of the tank as you use it, and it's hard to get out if you let the water evaporate all the way without dumping it. So, as a practical matter, if I'm not going to use the machine the next day or so, I dump out the water, rinse out the sludge and leave the tank off. You can leave the stone in the water without hurting anything, but it might accumulate some of the sludge.

   If you don't have a copy of the Tormek manual, I'd suggest you order one. It will answer a lot of questions, show you all the accessories that are available, and make it easier to use for a variety of applictions -- especially when you want to repeat an exact angle on a grind. Good luck, and tell those other guys we're OK.

1. 
   alias | Feb 06, 2003 03:32am | #6

   hey boss- i empty the tub after every use but thats just me ,and also put a small magnet in the bottom(the red kind from general) why ?? i find it easier to clean, it separates the slurry from the metal and i've used the metal slurry on a mirror for quick touch up's and believe it or not it work's with a afew strops on the leather tool belt also figure it would isolate the metal and wouldnt impregnate it self back into the stone. buy the stone grader, and also the truing up tool, both indispensable out of the whole setup. the idea's with the mineral oil is the right way to go . first application of compound is about as much as you would put on your toothbrush. for me i have one big frickin' tooth : ) after that it depends on what and how many your sharpening. my rule of thumb is if its working excessively on the outsides that is to much smooth it out and try to work it back into the wheel in reality the compound is almost as close to toothpaste in grit. and also the stone wheel has a tendency to get cloogged up another reason for the tool accesories mentioned above buy the cover also that really helps out with the dust and crud build up. and will prolong the life of the stone. this is agreat tool had mine for around six years and immediately bumped my work up a smidge.... slainte bear

   Edited 2/5/2003 7:37:38 PM ET by the bear

   Edited 2/5/2003 8:07:39 PM ET by the bear

3. 
   DennisS | Feb 06, 2003 03:23am | #5

   I don't empty my water tray between uses but I find that the stone being as absorbent as it is, the water tends to wick up in the stone and evaporate rather rapidly. The stone doesn't seem to mind, though. If the stone dries out completely, you'll find that when you go back to use it the stone will absorb a great deal of water and you'll have to fill the tray a time or two during use. That's one reason why I leave mine on.

   The sludge does indeed build up but if water is kept in the tray, it doesn't cake up too hard and can be screped out pretty easily with an old putty knife.

   The truing tool is indeed a must if you're sharpening items that tend to create grooves in the stone - things like turning gouges. When you get to the point where you have to buy a new stone, sit down when you see the price! Once you buy a new stone you'll get an upset stomache each time you take off material to true it up (grin).

   I've only used regular petroleum oil on the honing wheel and only occasionally apply the honing compound. But I sharpen mostly turning tools which require frequent tuning (sharpening) and I don't take the sharpening process to the same point a woodworker doing plane irons or mortising chisels would. The floor model machine at my local Woodcraft store has a honing wheel that's burnished almost like a barber's razor strop. Mine is still supple and moist so I don't know what the proper technique would be for best use.

   Enjoy the Tormek .... it's a really nice system.

   ...........

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

1. 
   BossHog | Feb 07, 2003 11:33pm | #7

   Thanks to all fer the input - I appreciate it.

   Since you've apparently bought a replacement stones, just exactly how much does one cost? I'm hoping mine will last a heck of a long time. Now you have me worried. Gonna ahev to bolt mine down to the workbench so it doesn't get knocked over and broken................(-:Sometimes you have to look reality in the eye and deny it. - Garrison Keillor

1. 
   Jimma | Feb 08, 2003 02:01am | #8

   I still have my original stone after five years of occasional use, and I true it with a diamond tool each time I use it.

1. 
   MikeK50 | Feb 08, 2003 02:24am | #9

   I had my Tormek for a couple of years.  I was told that the hobbyist is not likely to wear out the stone in his (or her) lifetime.  Although, I guess that depends on how old you are when you buy it!

   Mike

2. 
   DennisS | Feb 08, 2003 09:29am | #12

   The reason I bought another wheel for my Tormek is that we're planning on moving soon to an area where I don't think that I willl find 'parts' for it without traveling 70+ miles.

   The original stone shows about 1/4"(-) wear after a year's worth of use sharpening mostly turning tools, which as was pointed out, tend to subject the stone to point loads moreso than flat tools like plane irons or chisels. Thus I find I need to dress the stone more frequently when sharpening things like skew chisels or other more 'flat' edge tools. I was concerned about having a wheel available once mine wore out.

   It's been a few months since I bought the spare wheel ($90 some bux at Rockler) and I'm feeling a little foolish about my paranoia. My grand kids will probably end up using the spare wheel before I do.

   ...........

   Dennis in Bellevue WA

   [email protected]

   Edited 2/8/2003 1:32:05 AM ET by DENNIS02

1. 
   Jimma | Feb 09, 2003 08:54pm | #13

   I just got an email from Klingspor that showed a discount price on the basic Tormek machine. Accessories didn't appear to be discounted. This was about $50 off the regular price and I've never seen Tormek discounted before. Of course, since it weighs a ton, you might wipe out the discount in shipping costs.

   Dennis: why do you use the Tormek for lathe tools versus aluminum oxide or other grinder wheels? Don't you find it takes a lot longer?

2. 
   jgaiennie | Feb 10, 2003 07:19am | #14

   Isn't Tormek's wheel aluminum oxide?  I believe it is.

   The stone is wet and turns at 90 rpm.  As long as it's wet there's no way that it will overheat your tools. 

   My other dry grindstone turns at 3450 rpm and will overheat the edge of a lightweight tool in a matter of seconds.  A massive tool like an axe head takes a bit longer to overheat.

   Steel sharp edged tools are heat treated to temper the edge.  It's the temper that makes the tool retain it's edge past the initial use.  If you heat the edge by grinding such that you see it color anywhere from pale straw to deep blue, you've destroyed the temper.  Once that's done, the tool will sharpen just fine, but the edge has lost it's toughness.

   The good part of this is that it can be retempered.  You can read about heat treating in many different metal working books, and probably on the net.  In a nutshell, to heat treat a tool, one heats the whole part to be tempered to a cherry red and quenches it.  Then polish it to a bright shine so the next process can be observed. Then starting away from the edge back up on the body of the tool, slowly apply heat while observing the color of the steel that the heat produces.  Woodworking tools cutting edges should be tempered to a dark straw.  The color quickly goes to purple if more heat is applied and that's too much heat which will result in making them softer.

   Grinding time with the Tormek is not excessive, or even noticably longer than with the 3450 stone.  To demonstrate the sharpener at the woodworking shows, the rep destroys a chissel by standing it up on it's handle and beating the sharp edge with a hatchet.  He restores the chissel to very sharp in a matter of five to ten minutes.

   Edited 2/10/2003 9:24:04 AM ET by jdg

3. 
   Jimma | Feb 10, 2003 07:55pm | #15

   Thanks for the tutorial, but the real reason I asked the question is because I find the Tormek too slow for grinding lathe tools which I may sharpen several times per project. Instead, I use a regular 3450 rpm grinder with the softer aluminum oxide wheels and the Wolverine jig. This works great for all but the trickiest edges requiring inside honing for which I use slip stones. For my other edge tools (plane irons, bench chisels)I either use the Tormek or a shop-made slow-speed grinder with aluminum oxide wheels. Once you get used to using the regular grinders you won't overheat the tools. I do value my Tormek, which I've had for 5 or 6 years, but it's so slow that once I even fell asleep (briefly) using it. That was on a cryogenically-treated plane iron that needed a new profile. the wolverine Jig, in my opinion beats anything Tormek has to offer for lathe tools.

2. 
   jgaiennie | Feb 08, 2003 03:01am | #10

   Boss,

   I just bought my Tormek system a couple of weeks ago at a woodworking show.  I put this same question to the sales rep.  He said something along the order of this:

   If you're sharpening chissels and hand plane irons, they distribute the pressure and spread the wear on the stone and don't wear as much as point loads.  If you're sharpening turning gouges and similar, they put point wear on the stone.  If you're a busy turner, and you work ... oh say four times a week, and each session sharpening some tools a few times, your stone will last you 6 to 10 years.  Right now they go for ~$110.00, but I have no idea what they'll sell for in 10 years.

   So that's what he said.

   I bought the $550 package - I don't remember what they called it - the "Woodworker" or something - but it didn't have some of the jigs for turning gouges.  I got home with my new toy, set it up and the stone had a wobble of over an 1/8" side to side.  Woed and PO'ed, I drove back to New Orleans the next day to swap it out and said to myself... let's see... how did Tom Cruise put it in Risky Business?... "What the f*&%" - I up graded to the whole kit and kaboodle.  After I started playing around with some of those jigs, I've decided that no one needs all that stuff.  A couple of tool rests and you're set.  I think I could freehand a gouge pretty easily.  I'm pretty sure if I were on a tighter budget, I could get by with out all those jigs.

   Still a novice with this sharpener, my initial reaction is that it's the top of the line sharpener, but you don't need all the accessories that more than double the price.  Sharpening is a pain in the you know what and I'll take all the help I can get.  The basic package is a great help.  The more complex jigs seem to be just a bit too complicated to be convienent.

   jdg

4. 
   Turbo | Feb 08, 2003 06:25am | #11

          Experience I believe is the key.  Keep using what you have until you get that 1/32" curl from a plane, or easily shave with your pocket knife.  jdg has the right answer.