Replies

1. 
   JoeCoty | Sep 06, 2002 04:26am | #1

   Any of the commercial grade fences are good bets. I chose the Biesemyer fence over the Vega based on reputation and fit and finish. I really liked the idea of the micro-adjust knob on the Vega but have since found the Biesemyer very easy to set with a tap of the finger. If your accustomed to lesser quality fences the finger tapping may turn you off however the mass of this fence helps maintain control- none of that back and forth tap here/tap back stuff, In fact I can't imagine anything better.

1. 
   rslatm | Sep 06, 2002 12:48pm | #2

   I agree with you completely about the Bies... I've also used the the Delta and while many say the Delta is more versatile I find the Biese to be more versatile with the box shape which is easier to clamp accessories to and I like the mass of the fence. Someone makes a micro-adjuster add on for the Bies but tapping it gives me no problems and I sometimes use a dial caliper for special precise measuring applications with no problems

   Rick

2. 
   tschmaling | Sep 06, 2002 05:00pm | #3

   i personally can't wait to get my little grubbies on a unifence for my old unisaw. i like how you can move the fence back on the assembly for crosscutting.

3. 
   BigJohninMD | Sep 06, 2002 05:24pm | #4

   I gotta argee with  the Biesmeyer. I put one on my contractor saw. Coupled with a Forrest WWII Blade. I have much more power and great accuracy. I really almost got rid of the saw because I thought it was a underpowered piece of junk. With a few add on's I can do just about any work.

1. 
   riverr1 | Sep 06, 2002 06:36pm | #5

   Well, it seems everyone is happy with making a change. I've looked at the Biesemeyer, unifence, rocklers fence, incra's, etc. One thing that concerns me is the depth of my table is 27 inches. How will this effect the fences that lock on both sides of the table? Are there extensionshim kits? Is this a real problem to deal with? I haven't called any manufacturers yet because I'm not ready for the next best thing to sliced bread and anything else they think I want to hear. Does that sound cynical?

   Don

   PS...I understand that the 27" is standard, but I'm not sure how standard standard is from one brand to another. Hope that makes more sense.

   Edited 9/6/2002 11:44:24 AM ET by Don C.

1. 
   tschmaling | Sep 06, 2002 07:01pm | #6

   the biesemeyer and unifence derive all of their power from the front rail and don't connect at the back... the others i'm not familiar with, so i don't know.

   with the unifence, you can shift the fence part toward you when cutting sheet goods to put the support where you need it (before the blade, not after). you can also buy different lengths if you need it to only cover the table (ebay just had a shortened fence that was 14", for example) http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2047585543

   overhang off the back should cause no problems, it's probably just more of a space/preference thing.

2. 
   JeffKurtz | Sep 07, 2002 02:51am | #7

   Don,

   Previous post is right, most of the commercial fences lock only at the front.  I've never had a problem with them moving out of parallel when sawing, even with the cheaper fence on my old saw.  The old Jet had a 27" fence which was fine.  My new one has the long fence which is really nice for ripping and cutting sheet goods.

   Jeff

4. 
   billballeza | Sep 07, 2002 05:40am | #8

   Carpenter named Ed is remodeling our house right now. New kitchen with Brookhaven cabinetry, wall knock out between den and living room, complete trim out for both, decorative trim above and around several door openings, and a house full of decorative ceiling molding into the bargain.

   His fence? A 1x4 that he spring clamps to his benchtop Craftsman saw that has seen far better days. His only concession to technology is a freud saw blade. His work is something to behold.

   bill

1. 
   noone51 | Sep 07, 2002 05:55am | #9

   Bill, gotta side with ya here. The Beis is what I have on my shop saw but on the job... The Mag HD77 and a straigth 2x will do most of the things I want to do in the rough carpentry field. However, I think this person is looking to improve his precision cuts and for that I would recommend the Beis. There are two different versions of the fence and two different version of the rails. The commercial long or short can be used with either rail set and the rail sets come in two different lengths. In limited space use the short fence and short rails and when space is adequate use the long fence and long rails. Both are extremely poisitive, no nonsense fences that outperform everything else I have tried.

1. 
   riverr1 | Sep 07, 2002 07:14am | #10

   Thanks to all for some solid opinions and advice.

   Don

1. 
   Splintie | Sep 08, 2002 05:44am | #11

   Gotta chime in here...

   The Unifence, if the handle is not locked exactly perpendicular to the table, can loosen while sawing.

   I had shoved about 30 cutting boards past the blade on my Unisaw when the fence vibrated loose and caused a kickback which picked up the front end of the cutting board and flipped it over with my hand under it. I was able to get the one finger reattached and the other welded itself together (you could see the ATB pattern in the X-ray of the bone!), but i'm short one knuckle. I've talked to one other woodworker since then who had the exact same accident, but no bodily harm.

   The problem seems to me to be in that the locking slide is a parallelogram and if it isn't set in the track just right, it bears on only two corners against the track, which lets it wobble loose.

   Inertia about changing the system out means i still use the fence, but i test it before spinning the blade if my hands will be anywhere near the blade. And i never, ever, ever rip anything without using a push stick these days! 

1. 
   riverr1 | Sep 08, 2002 06:40am | #12

   Sorry to hear about the accident, but I appreciate the info. The unifence is off the short list. The Biesemyer is by far the all around favorite, but one friend swears by the HTC but it's pricey in comparison. The Incra is suppose to be good, but all their stuff just looks to delicate to me. Probably not true, but that's my take.

   Thanks again.

   Don

2. 
   TKanzler | Sep 09, 2002 06:17pm | #13

   Just have to mention one other advantage of the Biesemeyer, which is that it is finished on both sides.  I have a right-tilt Unisaw, and when I need the advantages of left-tilt, I simply use the fence on the left side of the blade.  It's a much smaller table on the left, but I find I'm mostly beveling long, narrow pieces anyway.  You may be able to reconfigure the Unifence for opposite hand work, but if so, it's more involved than just sliding it over the blade. 

   Be seeing you...

3. 
   riverr1 | Sep 09, 2002 06:32pm | #14

   Yesterday someone posted a link to a "something pond" site. I checked it out and there was an article comparing the Besimeyer to the Unifence. One of the biggest complaints about the unifence was exactly this point you've brought up. The overall impression of the unifence seems to be that it's a good accurate fence, but nearly as easy to use as some others that are just as good and accurate.

   Don

4. 
   tschmaling | Sep 09, 2002 06:58pm | #15

   see, now this is where i put a call out to the folks at delta. that is the absolute only problem i have with the unifence. a solution i have tendered is that they combine the two. the simplicity of the biesemeyer with the functionality of the unifence. all they need to do is start with a biesemeyer style fence and give it the movable face that the uni has.

   i have a saris bike rack for my car (stay with me, here). they have this neat little cam-style lever that when lifted up, releases the fork on the bike. as soon as you flip it down flat, the skewers pull in tight on each side and grip the fork, with this type of system on a biesemeyer, you could either have a fence on both sides full time, or just slide the face off of one side and swap it to the other when needed. the basic biesemeyer is too wide for such a system (the thing would be a foot wide if you just added the parts together as they are now). a little redesign would surely make it a reasonable sized device, and retain what everyone likes about both. the easy lift off and lock down feature of the bies, and the adjustable fence of the uni.

   what does everyone think?

5. 
   tschmaling | Sep 09, 2002 08:24pm | #16

   here's a pic just to kind of illustrate my idea. the flap you see on the top of the fence is what you lift back toward you, pushing the lock pins out. pushing it flat to the fence pulls them in and holds the aluminum fence to the body of the thing.

   (don't expect much, i did it in "paint", and i'm at work. sorry to those with archaic monitors, but it's about 850x550 pixels -best viewed at 1024x768 screen resolution.)

   
6. 
   tschmaling | Sep 11, 2002 05:57am | #17

   oh, cmon... don't let me kill the thread! lol

   was i that far off topic? ;)

7. 
   riverr1 | Sep 11, 2002 07:03am | #18

   Sorry Guy, but I just don't know enough about fences to have an opinion here, but I'm sure it's a great idea.

   Don

8. 
   rslatm | Sep 15, 2002 12:42am | #21

   Interesting ideas tschmaling but rather than redesign I've adapted my Bies with a few accessories so I can get more out of it and I can duplicate all the features of the unifence and then some. That mass and square body of the Bies really is a plus in my book. I have a piece of angle iron that I can clamp to the fence which gives me the ability to trim laminated panels like the uni. I have a 1" in block and a 10" which allows me to do crosscutting similar to sliding the fence back like a uni. The 10" one is nice because you just read the scale for 16" instead of 6". I also have another piece of angle stock with a 4" strip of wood mounted on it for doing pattern cutting. I plan to make some kind of rear hold-dowm because on occasion I do work with feather boards and the rear of the fence has a tendency to lift up. A clamp works well enough for the time being though. One improvement I have in the works is a sliding cursor with a stop. My saw is a left tilt and when I use a dado blade the scale is useless. By having the cursor adjust as much as an inch I can change the reference point. The stop will alow me to reset the cursor for my regular blade without recalibrating. When using a dado blade all have to do is make a quick test cut and set my cursor. When I'm done the cursor is easily returned for my regular blade with the preset stop.

9. 
   JeffKurtz | Sep 13, 2002 02:56pm | #19

   Welcome to the Loyal Order of the  Stub!  Lost one of mine from a piece of farm machinery.  Just so you know, the ghost sensations and "ultra sensitivity" will end in about 5 years.

   I'm no lawyer, but it sounds like this falls under the heading of product liability.  I'm not too big on the idea of law suits, but, unfortunately, that's what it takes to get these big corporations to fix a problem.  If not for yourself, then for the rest of us, you should see and attorney.

   Jeff

10. 
    Splintie | Sep 14, 2002 02:36am | #20

    I did the deed several years ago and thought about a product liability suit, but i was too swamped with the financial fallout (no insurance and i'd just bought a fixer-upper) to take on one more thing or engage an attorney and didn't know about the Net for research. When i first mentioned it on Knots a couple years ago, i got the reaction that there was nothing wrong with the saw at all, just pilot error.

    Next time! <G> 

5. 
   billyg83440 | Oct 10, 2002 01:22am | #22

   I just purchased an Exaktor fence. http://www.exaktortools.com/

   Just got it in the mail last week. Still haven't done more then take it out of the box, look at it, read the manual, and return it to the box.

   I purchased it off ebay, the manufacturer was selling some there, after speaking to the owner/designer on the phone.

   My only complaint is their web-site does a pathetic job of showing a really great product.

   I'm a mechanical designer, and really appreciate the built in features.

   Things like:

   - 2 T-Slots in the top of the fence.

   - Powder coated steel rails

   - 2 adjustable stops that you can set, then flip out of the way after you make a cut. Then flip back up to reset your fence w/o any measuring.

   - Double sided fence

   You can also get a back lock that locks from the front of the fence if you use board buddies etc. on the fence. It has a rear rail it rides on, but no back lock.

   Anyway, I sound like a commercial, but it's really well designed.

   As far as comparing it to a Besmeyer, Uni-fence, Shop-Fox, Vega, etc..

   Beats me. I've been looking at fences for years, never seen any of these except in catalogs. This one cost me $260 w/ shipping from Canada.

   I know I'm real anxious to get this on the saw and use it. But, I have some eve vents that I need to get on before the snow flies so I don't have major ice dams again this year, plus other pre-snow projects that may come first.

   If I can find this thread again I'll let you know my impression after I use it.

   Is it just me, or is it very difficult to refind a thread for everyone?

   I read this earlier then decided to add my 2 cents. Despite flagging it 'high interest' and several searches I finally had to find it by paging down through everything. Don't get it.

   Anyway, my verbosity has outrun my relevance once again.

   Goodday

   Bill G

1. 
   JeffKurtz | Oct 10, 2002 02:57pm | #23

   Bill,

   Where are you at man?!?!? I realize the white stuff will be flying soon, but do we really have to talk about it?

   I've never heard of the Exaktor, let us know how it performs.  You're right, web site isn't very well designed.  From what I can see in the pictures, their stuff looks a lot like Excalibur.  One of the reasons I bought a Ryobi (which I no longer own) was because of the rear fence lock.  A nice feature, but the Biesmeyer and it's clones haven't given me any problems with parallelism. (Granted, a 16" length of steel will have some flex, but sliding a board along the fence won't produce that kind of force.)

   Problem with finding flagged messages is probably in your browser.  When you flag a message, you're placing a cookie in your file cache.  Depending on your configuration, it may be saved for months, or only until you close the browser.  Easiest solution is probably to just jot down the name of the post for future reference.

   BTW, _now is a four-letter word.  No profanity please.

   Jeff

   Edited 10/10/2002 8:00:49 AM ET by Jeff K

1. 
   billyg83440 | Oct 10, 2002 08:53pm | #24

   First, I have no clue what BTW means.

   When I spoke to the guy at exaktor, I asked him about the excalibur fence.

   He said that this is the next generation of that fence. And then listed a bunch of improvements he'd made. Though the only one I remember is it now uses Powder Coated Steel guide rails vs. extruded aluminum.

   In fact, this shipped in in two boxes w/ a total weight of about 80lbs. The rails are about 6' long though.

   Bill

1. 
   JeffKurtz | Oct 10, 2002 09:38pm | #25

   Bill,

   BTQW = by the way

   _now = sn_w = s_ow = sno_ = I can't stand to even think about the stuff

   Jeff

1. 
   billyg83440 | Oct 16, 2002 06:30pm | #26

   Well, I borrowed the bosses camera and shot a couple of photos of this fence. Not installed yet.

   The accesories are an adjustable short fence, and a t-slot rail that mounts on the fence rails w/ 2 adjustable stops so you can repeat cut w/o repeat measuring.

   Exaktor hasn't started production of these yet, which is why there's no detail on their websit (see a copy of part of an email they sent me)

   (The fence you received is a product that was designed and manufactured by Modulus.

   Michael Trembly who owns Modulus has decided to concentrate on the

   manufacture and sale of the Modiulus2000 Scoring Saw accessory.

   Last fall I made arrangements with Michael to purchase the completed fences he had on hand along with the tooling to manufacture them. There were only 104 of these finished fences and, at this time I have sold most of them. As a matter of fact Michael will give me a count tomorrow how many are left. I think there is a dozen or so.

   The reason they are not on our web site. Is that when I start producing them they will be in a quantity that will properly supply the market, but they are going to cost a few dollars more.

   If you need any assistance in setting the fence up, please call.

   Regards,

   Phil Humfrey)

   Anyway, I'm happy, well designed solid fence in my mind. Can't wait to start using it. And, to boot, I think I got a good deal. ($200 + $60 shipping, The guide rails are 80" and weigh 55lbs.)

   As far as the s word, at 5000 ft. in the rocky mountains it's a fact of life. Just need to get me a snowmobile, or better yet some good freinds w/ extra snowmobiles; fits my limited budget better.

   Later

2. 
   billyg83440 | Oct 16, 2002 06:41pm | #27

   Opps, forgot to post an picts. Hope this works, seems to lock up when I try to post.

   
6. 
   KraigY | Oct 16, 2002 06:50pm | #28

   Don C.

   Just to confuse the issue even further...I have one of these fences on my Jet contractor saw and absolutely love it.  It was easy to install, stays parallel, and locks rock solid.  Also, it has grooves in the extruded aluminum which make attaching hold downs, jigs etc. a breeze.  Oh, and the company has awesome customer service.

   http://www.mulecab.com/

   Good luck,

   Doc