Replies

1. 
   forestgirl | Apr 20, 2003 04:52am | #1

   Take a look at this thread:

   http://forums.taunton.com/tp-knots/messages?msg=11507.1

   Several of the respondants had older Craftsman saws that had been upgraded.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   RoyinMD | Apr 20, 2003 09:24am | #2

   Dependable and great shape, your set! Want a tune up and enhancement, check Forestgirls thread reference, I'm one of those guys who changed over to the Accusquare fence five years ago on a 20 year old Craftsman, love it. Also look into segmented drive belts, machined pulley's, blade stablizers (and great (hint: expensive) blades) and zero clearence inserts.

   It will be like having a new toy!

   Enjoy, Roy

1. 
   BrianMcG | Apr 21, 2003 08:33am | #4

   Hi Roy, do those segmented belts really make a difference? Their the link types, right? Brian

1. 
   robkress | Apr 21, 2003 03:22pm | #5

   Brian,

   I can speak from direct experience on this one....

   I have been using an old sears ts (maybe 25 or 30 years old at this point) and when I would flip it on......  boy, it would start up with this really aweful GRUMBLE.  And lets not even talk about vibration....

   Anyway, got pulleys and a link belt.  You would think that I had just gotten a new saw.  It is totally amazing.  Don't even think twice about it if you are in the market for smoother running.  And it is a pretty inexpensive upgrade.

   Good luck,

   Rob Kress

1. 
   forestgirl | Apr 21, 2003 07:19pm | #6

   Aren't those link belts great!!??!  I put one on my old Jet saw, not even bothering with replacement pulleys, and it was like giving it a heart transplant.  Love 'em, love 'em!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   BrianMcG | Apr 22, 2003 08:02am | #9

   Thanks Rob, Just added it to my list for the Sac Wood show on Friday. Brian

3. 
   mikepwagner | Apr 22, 2003 08:08pm | #12

   I am starting to do a little woodworking after a very long hiatus. I have read this thread (and other referenced threads) with interest, since I have a pretty old (late 50';s, early 60's ?) Craftsmen "60" table saw sitting out in the shed. I think that I made one cut with the saw 7 or 8 years ago, not sure if it was used in the previous decade. It was heavily used in the early 60s.

   The top, which I assume to be cast iron, has a light coat of rust from sitting in a non-moisture proof shed. It uses saw blades with a 1/2" arbor hole, and the motor pretty much hangs out the back of it, on a hinged platform. The motor says it's a 7.3 amp 1/2 horsepower motor, and it's pretty darn heavy. The saw has a fence, various paraphanelia including a set of dado blades.

   I am thinking of refurbushing and usng this saw.  Does this make sense?

   I am not sure I understand all of the issues that have been broght up here.  Let me check my understanding. It looks like I could fix/repair anything that needed replacing on this saw.  Can anyone suggest a reasonable set of things to look for on this saw? Are there areas that are so worn that it wouldn't be replacing? How expensive would a new motor be,  if I wanted that?  I assume that a newer motor would be lighter and more powerful, is that true?  Is the 1/2 inch arbor a problem? Can I/Should I replace the arbor mehcanism?  I assume that there are some kind of bearing in there.  Do they often wear out? It looks like some of you are talking about replacing the pulleys and the drive belt.  How expensive will that be?

   Thanks,

   Mike

1. 
   forestgirl | Apr 23, 2003 09:12am | #14

   Mike, what size blade does this saw use?  Sounds like an 8" maybe.  I bought an 8" saw of that vintage at an auction several years ago and later re-sold it (never did use it because the motor was dead). 

   An 8" blade seemed awfully small to me, and I could not see any way to put a bigger blade on because of the design underneath the saw table.  Certainly, 1/2 horse isn't much power -- most of the 10" contractor's saws have 1.5HP motors.

   I seem to remember that there are "reducers" out there to make today's 5/8" arbor-hole blades work on these older Craftsmen saws.  Don't know where to find them though!forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   mikepwagner | Apr 23, 2003 06:31pm | #15

   I am not sure about the blade size.  I will look at that when I get home tonight.

   I guess the more fundamental question is, sentiments aside (I remember using that saw to cut furring strips to install acoustical ceiling tiles during JFK's funeral), if I put $100 into that saw, will I end up with a better saw than if I go out and spend $100 on a new saw?

   At first, I thought "No, buy the new saw", since electrical tools seem to have advanced a lot. The I started reading about desiable chracteristics in a table saw that cheap table saws don't have, like a cast iron table and a belt drive. I realized, "Huh that old saw in the shed has those.  Myabe I should fix it up?"

   Any opinions?

   Mike

3. 
   forestgirl | Apr 23, 2003 06:55pm | #16

   First to look at what $100 will buy you in a new saw.  What you find in that price range is bench-top saws.  They are:

   direct-drive saws (i.e., the arbor is directly connected to the motor, rather than being connected by a belt the way your Craftsman is)

   with a very small top and

   a small, not very adjustable (for accuracy) fence

   The specs or details that you might see and be misled by are horsepower and the fact that some come with a stand.  Regardless of what HP they list, they are nowhere near as powerful as a standard 1.5HP motor on a Jet, Delta, Grizzly, General, whatever, belt-driven saw.  The stand is nice, and tends to make the saw look like a contractor's saw when seen in the catalog.

   All that said, though, you can do some decent work on a benchtop saw if you put on an excellent blade and are lucky enough to get one with a decent fence, and you build a bigger table around the saw for stock support.

   That little Craftsman could be a good little saw to get back into the swing of things.  Whether you'd be better of with it, or a new benchtop saw probably depends on what type of work you're going to do at the beginning, and how you see your "tool budget" later on down the road.  If you think you could upgrade to a contractor's saw ($400-$600+) later on down the road, and you'll not have any thick, superhard stock to saw in the meantime, you could have fun refurbishing the Craftsman and using it for awhile.  If you get it up and running, and looking nice and clean and shiny, you can sell it on eBay for probably $150+ when you get ready to upgrade (I could send you my ad, hah!).

   If, however, it's going to take some significant dough to get it fixed, hmmmmmm, then there's a decision for ya!

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

   Edited 4/23/2003 11:57:43 AM ET by forestgirl

4. 
   RoyinMD | Apr 23, 2003 07:54pm | #17

   Mike,

   Excellent comments so far.

   I would not put any serious money into it until you clean it up and see what you got. Only put WD40, oil, sandpaper and steelwool etc. into it. If it runs get a reasonable priced blade to give it the full test. Then see where your interests take you.

   Sounds like a fun project, last suggestion: Turn up the tunes.

   Enjoy, Roy

5. 
   mikepwagner | Apr 23, 2003 09:34pm | #18

   Thanks to all.

   I think that I will pull that saw out of the shed, and spend a little time cleaning it up.

    By the time it seesm too small, I will have a better idea of the time/energy I have to put into this hobby, and hopefully enough successful projects to convice my SO, and can go spend money on something nicer.

   I do have one question. I have found some sites on the web that talk about removing rust using eletrolysis. I think my children would love to be able to watch that. Will that really work as well as the single edge razor scraping methods I've read about?

   Thanks,

   Mike

6. 
   forestgirl | Apr 24, 2003 06:39pm | #19

   Turns out those saw blade bushings are in one of my catalogs, Ballew Saw and Tools.  Their toll-free number is 1-800-288-7483.  The bushings run just under $4 apiece.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

7. 
   mikepwagner | Apr 27, 2003 07:06am | #20

   So I have got the saw apart- cleaning i tup. I've got the rust off of the cast iron table, which is heavier than I thought (as is the motor). I have also order some Freud Saw blade bushings so I can use 5/8 in arbor blades on my 1/2 arbort (thanks, "forest girl").

   Two things that I am looking for:

   1) The insert on this saw measure 3" x 12", and is supported by a little lip all around the hole that houses the blade (is that called the throat"). I 'd like to get a zero clearance insert, but nothing I can find on the seems close. Any ideas?

   2) In the late 50's/early 60s, I guess they didn't think of blade guards or splitters very much. I am I going to be able to find something on the net that fits this?

   Thanks,

   Mike

8. 
   forestgirl | Apr 27, 2003 06:14pm | #21

   You'll probably have to make your own insert.  What tools do you have at the moment?   A jig-saw or scroll-saw and sander are about minimum (or a coping saw and sandpaper, for the purists).  If you're lucky, some kind of standard plywood size will fit, but that doesn't usually happen.  So, you can buy thicker wood and sand down to fit, or use slightly thinner wood (plywood or solid hardwood, or laminate) and use set-screws of some sort to level the insert.  I've never done it this way, so someone else will have to provide details.

   Do you know how to make the ZC slot??  You may have read those instructions already.

   You can make your insert so that it accomodates a home-made splitter.  The guard and anti-kickback mechanism is going to be tougher.  Any aftermarket outfit is expensive.  I think Sarge or ToolDoc have made their own.  I'll invite them over to help, and find the web links for the home-made splitters.  Will post sometime this morning.

   forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

   Edited 4/27/2003 11:17:27 AM ET by forestgirl

9. 
   kenewald | Apr 28, 2003 06:42pm | #22

   I've got an old Craftsman tablesaw and make zero clearance inserts for it.  I made a pattern and have plenty of thin oak stock, I could make you one in a couple minutes.

   If you'll give me the dimensions (just to be sure our saw's are the same) I'll send one to you.

   -Ken (Palmyra, NE)

10. 
    mikepwagner | Apr 29, 2003 06:20am | #24

    Wow, Ken. Thank you very much.

    The opening on this saw is approximately 3" x 12". Does that match your saw.

    I will send my snail mail address by email.

    Thanks,

    Mike

11. 
    forestgirl | Apr 28, 2003 06:53pm | #23

    Mike, here's the link to Kelly Mehler's home-made splitter and ZC insert (sorry I didn't get it posted yesterday).  The link takes you to an article on kickback.  Look in the upper right hand corner, and click on the "click for MORE ON a shop made splitter" link.

    http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00066.asp 

    Also, see Ken's post above -- he's offered to make ZC inserts for the Craftsman saw, but accidentally addressed it to me.

    forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

    Edited 4/28/2003 11:55:35 AM ET by forestgirl

2. 
   artw | Apr 22, 2003 05:48am | #7

   I have an old sears ts and I really like it but it does not have a blade height lock. Any suggestions on what to do?

   Ken

1. 
   forestgirl | Apr 22, 2003 07:58am | #8

   There are some current contractor's saws that do no have a blade height lock included in their design.  Evidently, there is an adjustment somewhere that helps keep the blade at the desired height.  You don't happen to have the owner's manual, do you.  Ohhhh, sorry.  Well, somebody'll help.forestgirl -- you can take the girl out of the forest, but you can't take the forest out of the girl   ;-)

2. 
   SCFrankland | Apr 22, 2003 03:26pm | #10

   The picture attached shows what I am trying to explain.  Also the saw pictured has a depth lock but this is how I used to do it with my old saw. 

   I would take a spring clap and clamp it to the height adjustment wheel.  With my old saw the height was fine at cuts over a 1" but under that, the blade wanted to lower itself.  The clamp would not allow the blade to lower.  I have seen several older saws with brakes made up of spring loaded pads that ride against the adjustment knob but I have always found them to be in the way when reaching under the table to make height adjustments.Scott C. Frankland

1. 
   artw | Apr 23, 2003 01:25am | #13

   Thanks for the suggestions. My saw has a angle lock but no height lock, I will try your suggestion till I come up with something else. I mainly need it for dado work.

   Ken

3. 
   RoyinMD | Apr 22, 2003 07:33pm | #11

   For some reason I keep refering to them as segmented belts and not Link Belts. I'll try and turn the brain wattage up. :o)

   Rob and FG already replied, I agree, I think they make a hugh difference. Sound, vibration and power all improved.

   Enjoy, Roy

3. 
   Jeff | Apr 20, 2003 03:08pm | #3

   Bo

   Don't know if this helps.

   I have an old sears saw. I upgraded the fence, pulleys, belts, etc.

   I also have a Grizzley 1023 saw.

   I use the sears saw as the output table to my grizzly.

   By keeping a combination blade (Or sometimes a dado blade) on the

   sears saw, I can do 2 cutting operations at a time.

   Works great.

   jeff