Replies

1. 
   Paul_Snyder | Oct 29, 2003 12:02am | #1

   Jeff - you need to get some tech info on the stain & toner you received.

   Here are some important "need to know" considerations;

   - Can the stain be applied to bare wood (maple) or is a washcoat required?

   - Should the stain be thinned, or used straight from the can?

   - What is the thinner/reducer for the stain?

   - What finish (lacquer, waterborn, varnish, etc.) is the toner compatible with?

   - What is the mixing ratio for the toner (how much toner per measure of finish)?

   - How many coats of toner are required?

   In a two step coloring system, the stain is applied first, then a coat of clear finish to seal the stain, then the toner is sprayed over the sealer. Depending on the type of stain, you may have to pre-seal the wood with a thinned coat of finish, called a washcoat. Or you may have to spray a light wet coat on evenly with no wiping. Or you may have to spray a wet coat and wipe. There's a lot of possibilites. The chemistry of the stain will also dictate what can be used as a washcoat and sealer/finish.

   Toner is a colored finish that is sprayed over sealed wood to provide a layer of color above the wood. It provides an attractive look of depth to the finish as well as adding color to the finish and evening out color variations. Toner can be made with dye and/or pigments. The dye and/or pigment is added in small measure to clear finish (lacquer, waterborn, shellac, varnish, etc.) that has been thinned down to keep each coat of toner very thin. The thin coat(s) of toner add color without building up a thick finish. 1-2 coats of uncolored finish are applied after the toner coat(s) to complete the finish and protect the color coats. In order to use the toner you have you have to know what finish it can be added to and in what quantity.

   Paul S

1. 
   jeffreysherow | Oct 29, 2003 05:15am | #2

   Thanks for taking so much time to answer the question.  I knww the answer to some of the questions (the stain and toner came with a msds) but it sounds like I need the method used by the manufacturer to replicate the color and look propoerly.  Can I just make the stuff and have somebody else do the finishing ;-)

   Jeff

1. 
   Paul_Snyder | Oct 29, 2003 05:46am | #3

   Sorry to make life complicated. ;)

   Paul

2. 
   migraine | Oct 29, 2003 05:57am | #4

   From my memory, I have used this type of product(are yours Kraftmaid or Aristocrat??)  The proper way to use this product is with spray equiptment.  Contact the manufacturer and they should give you some instructions on their products.  Sorry I can't help any more.  Memory is really fogged up/  If you have more questions, don't hesitate to ask.  A little more info might help jog the old noggin

1. 
   jeffreysherow | Oct 29, 2003 04:26pm | #5

   Cabinets are Decora'.  I'm sure they use similar processes.  I was getting the feeling that I now had a reason to buy an HVLP setup. 

   Thanks for the input.

   Jeff

1. 
   migraine | Oct 29, 2003 05:48pm | #6

   A hvlp setup is not necessary.  An "old fashioned" spray system will work if that's what you have.

1. 
   jeffreysherow | Oct 29, 2003 08:11pm | #7

   Thanks.

   Don't have anything now.  Since I'm going from nothing, do you suggest and HVLP setup and, if so, any suggestions would be appreciated.  Posted same in tools section.

   Jeff

1. 
   migraine | Oct 29, 2003 10:25pm | #8

   My own personal opinion is to buy a pressure pot set-up and a high CFM compressor.   The fluid is contained in the pot, so you do not need a cup gun, which allows for easier use in confined spaces as in interior cabinetry.  Different viscosity paints/finishes can used with various pressure settings and fluid needle sizes.  Biggest draw back to this system is cleaning pots and hoses.   Try going to some of your larger chain stores/paint centers and find out if any of them are having manufacture demonstrations/open houses.  This is where touching/feeling  is best to determine personal choices.

2. 
   Paul_Snyder | Oct 30, 2003 12:27am | #9

   Jeff - if you have a compressor that can supply 5 CFM or more, a good entry level spray gun is the Wagner Conversion HVLP gun. Runs about $130, works with a compressor, uses very little air, and sprays nicely. If/when you outgrow a cup cun, then you can explore a spray set-up with more versatility.

   Paul