Replies

1. 
   BillLindau | Mar 08, 2006 03:24am | #1

   I used a fair amount of Poplar for framing over the years. It is a nice wood to work with, nails well, cuts well. Overall, I like it quite a bit. It's strength is less than fir but greater than white pine. Around these parts, mountains of western NC, it grows like a weed, straight and tall. Makes perfect saw logs. The hearts are cool as well, with purples and greens. It paints and stains well, sands well. The only thing it's not good for is firewood, not dense enough. It isn't at all resistant to rot. Bill Lindau

2. 
   Dave45 | Mar 08, 2006 03:29am | #2

   If you're planning on using it for framing or other structural work, I would check with the building department before I got too far.

   I use a lot of poplar for secondary wood in my cabinets and furniture and think it's a little softer than fir.  I wouldn't want to frame anything with poplar unless I knew much more about it.

1. 
   Robertog | Mar 08, 2006 05:34pm | #5

   Luckily I dont live in an area where we have to get inspections when contructing...

1. 
   Badger1805 | Jul 22, 2021 03:53pm | #19

   I agree with Dave45. Most building codes have a reason for them. It may be somewhat difficult to replace the frame of a building after it is done and the framework rots...I'd check it out before proceeding, especially if you ever plan to sell your house.

3. 
   DavidxDoud | Mar 08, 2006 04:33pm | #3

   What are the problems associated with with working with green poplar.

   very few - especially in construction - biggest problem may be getting the AHJ to sign off on,  if you live in an area where building inspectors have to inspect/approve your construction - if so,  get them onboard early in the process -

   as already mentioned,  Liliodendron tulipifera,  is soft, relatively stable, nails easily,  and has moderate/low resistance to rot -

   'Cottonwood',  Populus deltoides,  and 'Popel',  (a regional term,  often applied to soft woods of several different species,  such as various Aspens and Basswood ) are distinctly different from L. tulipifera,  and in most respects inferior - softer,  weaker,  less stable,  less decay resistance - but still suitable for use in construction,  in specific circumstances that take into account their properties -

   joist for haymow floors and the like would better be made of stronger/stiffer species - studs,  sheathing,  siding,  flooring,  rafters (if generously engineered) are  appropriate uses -

    

    

   "there's enough for everyone"
1. 
   Robertog | Mar 08, 2006 05:43pm | #6

   Well

   I sure got some great info, expecially on the different species associated with the genus... Anyway... Based on what I have read it is

   Populus deltoides that I am working with

   As I responded to one of the other guys... I do not have to worry about inspections.

   As to what I am using the lumber for its for

   Wall, Joists, Rafters, to finish the second floor and roof of the 2 story addition I am putting up.  The knee wall (portion of basement above ground ) and the 1st floor was build with spruce.....

   Seems like finishing with the cottonwood will not present too much of a problem

   And the original reason for my post was to determine warping for shrinking issues by using the green lumber.... I am using it for cost savings purposes.... The trees in the back acreage cost me 0.00 versus purchasing the luber from Canada..

   Once again

   Thanks to all for your replies.  And if any additional comments can be made regarding this than great.... Especially now that I have been able to be more specific regarding which genus-species I am dealing with

   Roberto Gutierrez

1. 
   trialnut | Mar 09, 2006 08:01pm | #7

   Roberto

   Based on the application of floor joists and rafters I would be inclined with the Cottonwood to either use a larger size, 2 x 8 rather than 2 x 6, or go with a closer spacing. The only place where the Cottonwood has more strength than any of the spruces is in compression of end grain, think wall stud. If you get heavy snow loads or plan to put much weight on the floor with all other things being equal the Cottonwood will not bend as far before it breaks as the spruces. You could also use shorter runs. My tendency would be to overbuild and be safe rather than see a failure of a structual member. You could check this out with one of the online load calculators to be sure. One I have used is http://www.cwc.ca/design/tools/calcs/SpanCalc_2002/

   RichThe Professional Termite

4. 
   trialnut | Mar 08, 2006 05:07pm | #4

   Robert

   I am not sure from your post which wood you are working with. What is normaly called poplar in woodworking is Yellow Poplar (aka tuliptree or tulip poplar) Liriodendron tulipifera L. This is the wood with the green coloring in it and is actually in the magnolia family. In most of the northeast the trees commonly refered to as poplar or popel is Quaking Aspen, Populus tremuloides and Bigtooth Aspen, Populus grandidentata. These are not generaly considered a suitable timber tree and only recently have begun to be harvested for flakeboard and such. Then there is Cottonwood. Again in most of the northeast this refers to the Eastern Cottonwood, Populus deltoides. This grows to a very large tree often 100' tall and 3'-4' dia. This tree has more uses than the others in the Populus family mainly due to it's size but is most often used as an ornamental shade tree.

   Not trying to confuse you, just wondering which wood you are asking about as it may make a difference. I would not think any of the aspens, Populus, would be strong enough to use as framing lumber but the Yellow Poplar would be fine. Any of them would be prone to rot fast in a outdoor or damp envirnment.

   Rich

   The Professional Termite

5. 
   cadiddlehopper | Mar 12, 2006 07:32am | #8

   By "green" do you mean that the wood has not lost much of its moisture? In other words: It has not been air nor kiln dried? If that is the case, shrinkage after nailing it down is probably your main concern. Seriously, you probably should locate a kiln & dry the stuff if you add it to your house. Probably doesn't matter for a barn except that some nails may rust or become loose.

   In the southeast, poplar has green colored heartwood which ages to a lovely brown. (Someone else discussed the various species called poplar.) Does your "poplar" have green colored wood also? I'm curious.

   Cadiddlehopper

1. 
   Robertog | Mar 16, 2006 09:49pm | #9

   It was green as in just cut...

   And one of the other responses specified different species... I am dealing with cottonwood not popal.....

2. 
   Robertog | Mar 16, 2006 09:55pm | #10

   Hey Cadiddle...

   I looked up the other message and it was

   Populus deltoides,  and 'Popel'

1. 
   cadiddlehopper | Mar 16, 2006 10:11pm | #11

   Our southeastern poplar is liriodendron tulipifera, a different animal. Several years back, the Champion tulip poplar grew a little over 100 miles from where I live. Supposedly your species grow around here, too, but I have never seen one here. My tree book describes the wood as "weak." I have a CD with strength data if you would like to know just how weak. You might want to double up on studs, joists, & rafters.Cadiddlehopper

1. 
   jjflamingo | Mar 23, 2006 12:10am | #13

   i am in mississippi and the only way i have seen poplar used is  as cabinetry face frames and or paint grade doors

1. 
   cadiddlehopper | Mar 23, 2006 12:58am | #14

   Take my word, it has many more uses. Many barns have been built with it. Yuppies now buy the old barns to salvage the rough, aged wood for decorative purposes. The Shakers made furniture from it.Cadiddlehopper

6. 
   daveinnh | Mar 19, 2006 03:02am | #12

   My local lumber yard in Antrim, NH orders yellow poplar for several customers, including me from timetotime.  I prefer it for painted trim instead of white pine since it seems to be clear and creates little resin buildup on blades & bits. It's also pretty stable with little twisting or warping.  It can be machined to accept a crisp edge (unlike doug fir). However, it's just about as soft as white pine. 

   For trim that may be subject to abrasion on corners, you may wish to consider soft maple as an alternative.  Good luck.

    

7. 
   rivahgal | Jul 22, 2021 09:43am | #15

   Resurrecting and hijacking a very old thread...

   I am having an addition built that includes a large, vaulted great room with timber beams/trusses that are not structural... just cosmetic. The cost of reclaimed wood is extortionate, so I'm looking at alternatives. Mushroom wood is one (made into box beams) but newly sawn poplar was just suggested. I appreciate the character and color it will have as it ages, but I am concerned about installing green wood. Will it not warp, shrink, etc? Will the moisture in the wood affect the structural integrity of whatever hardware is holding it in place? Forgive my ignorance and poor terminology. But that's why I'm here to learn. Would appreciate any input.

8. 
   _mj_ | Jul 22, 2021 10:32am | #16

   Dry it before you use it. If you make "box beams" out of it the wood will dry unevenly and you won't know what it will decide to do until it does it. The best way to prevent the warping & twisting you fear is to have it sawn oversized, and dry it properly before you use it. It will move a bit as it dries, then you can mill it for use.

1. 
   rivahgal | Jul 22, 2021 10:50am | #17

   Thanks, MJ. These are to be solid beams - not box beams. The mushroom wood would be box beams, because - by design - it comes in boards. Poplar would be solid 8" square beams. Would they still need to be dried first? If so, for how long?

9. 
   _mj_ | Jul 22, 2021 11:36am | #18

   Wow. The "rule of thumb" for air-drying lumber is one year per inch of thickness. Look around for a yard with a kiln if you want to use them in this decade or have them cut into planks that will dry faster and build the box beams.

   My back hurts just thinking about the weight of them being installed wet, and if they are long spans boxes would probably be more stable over time. (and provide a great place to run wires and hide wifi hotspots etc.)